Clarinet Preamp question

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guest1632

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Clarinet Preamp question
« on: 17 Jan 2009, 06:56 am »
Hi Jim,

I took a quick look at your Clarinet on your website. Output Impedance is 3K? I wouldn't think that is low impedance. Now, I don't wish to ruin a good thing, but is there a way of adding a Cathode follower to lower the impedance say down to something like 300 to 600 Ohms? This is going in to a SS amplifier that would like to see a low impedance preamp. I was also considering getting the Grounded Grid, but the reviews seem to be mixed. So I then stumbled upon your circle. Thanks for any help you might offer.

Ray Bronk

Yoda

Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #1 on: 17 Jan 2009, 05:57 pm »
I'm building the Castanet as a linestage preamp:  it has a lower output impedance - look at it's specs in the catalog. 

Pictures soon folks - I am building it with way cool green anodized panels that came in this week, silver knobs, 4 inputs, selectable record out, and some of those magic teflon bypass caps...

Matt

tubesforever

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Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #2 on: 18 Jan 2009, 07:51 am »
Castinet?  Dac?  Castinet?  Dac?  Castinet......hummmm

I look forward to seeing your project because I think I have a Castinet in my future.   It's all about the tubes and the power supply.  The Castinet looks like a lot of fun!  Choke based power...now we're talking!


guest1632

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Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #3 on: 19 Jan 2009, 06:09 am »
 
I'm building the Castanet as a linestage preamp:  it has a lower output impedance - look at it's specs in the catalog. 

Pictures soon folks - I am building it with way cool green anodized panels that came in this week, silver knobs, 4 inputs, selectable record out, and some of those magic teflon bypass caps...

Matt

Thanks Matt, Didn't see that one. Will look again.

Ray

guest1632

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Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #4 on: 19 Jan 2009, 06:16 am »
I'm building the Castanet as a linestage preamp:  it has a lower output impedance - look at it's specs in the catalog. 

Pictures soon folks - I am building it with way cool green anodized panels that came in this week, silver knobs, 4 inputs, selectable record out, and some of those magic teflon bypass caps...

Matt

Hi Matt,

Well I did see that one in the catalog. I thought it was just a head phone amp. Didn't realize that it is also a linestage. Ok, so how do I make it just a line stage and not a headphone amp?

Ray

tubesforever

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Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #5 on: 19 Jan 2009, 08:21 am »
Basically, just build a bigger box, add enough input chassis RCA's for your needs, then run these to a switch and feed the output to the pcb.

The Castinet provides a high and low impedence output option. 

The gain is pretty low on this critter.  So hopefully you have decent source voltages to deal with.

Cheers!

guest1632

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Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #6 on: 19 Jan 2009, 08:58 am »
Basically, just build a bigger box, add enough input chassis RCA's for your needs, then run these to a switch and feed the output to the pcb.

The Castinet provides a high and low impedence output option. 

The gain is pretty low on this critter.  So hopefully you have decent source voltages to deal with.

Cheers!

Hi, Well, I'm just using an SS amp with the 27DB of gain. So not sure what the gain can be adjusted to, but I'd think if you were to use it for a Line Stage, then you'd have to raise the gain of the tube. Plus not to sure what other things you might have to do for the power supply to work effectively with the higher gain setting. But that might be a fairly easy project to work on.

Ray.

flocchini

Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #7 on: 19 Jan 2009, 02:38 pm »
I have used my Castanet with amps with approximately the same gain (AKSA 55 and Muse 100s) as yours.
Because I was in test mode I set up a small switch in a separate box. I also use a Transformer volume control.
With my speakers (about 94 dB efficient) it works really well. You could keep the low impedance for your headphones and use the high impedance for the amps. I can't find it right now but Jim either commented on this in his blog or in the forum. The Castanet is a great product.

guest1632

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Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #8 on: 19 Jan 2009, 09:20 pm »
I have used my Castanet with amps with approximately the same gain (AKSA 55 and Muse 100s) as yours.
Because I was in test mode I set up a small switch in a separate box. I also use a Transformer volume control.
With my speakers (about 94 dB efficient) it works really well. You could keep the low impedance for your headphones and use the high impedance for the amps. I can't find it right now but Jim either commented on this in his blog or in the forum. The Castanet is a great product.

Sounds like it just might be the right ticket. Would like to see about increasing the gain to say 6 or 9 DB. I am not looking for a buffer. The transformer on the output would eliminate the need for a coupling cap. So this 6H30 sounds like a good tube to use. I don't doubt that the Castanet is an excellent product.

Ray

hagtech

Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #9 on: 20 Jan 2009, 05:34 am »
You won't get more gain out of a CASTANET unless you use different output trannys.  The 3k of the CLARINET might sound high, but in practice it drives most anything.  Adding a cathode follower might mess it up a little, unless you decouple the supplies and use a constant current sink.  And even then, you'll be in the range of 500 ohms.

It really depends a lot on the amplifier it will be driving.  Some can be difficult.  I would think a Pass amp as a demanding load.

jh

guest1632

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Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #10 on: 20 Jan 2009, 08:02 am »
You won't get more gain out of a CASTANET unless you use different output trannys.  The 3k of the CLARINET might sound high, but in practice it drives most anything.  Adding a cathode follower might mess it up a little, unless you decouple the supplies and use a constant current sink.  And even then, you'll be in the range of 500 ohms.

It really depends a lot on the amplifier it will be driving.  Some can be difficult.  I would think a Pass amp as a demanding load.

jh

Hi Jim,

I'm using a SKA amp from Greg Ball. His amp looks at the impedance of the preamp and I'm told like to see an impedance of 800 Ohms or lower. That's why I was kinda looking at the Castanet. It uses an output transformer. So maybe there's a way of bringing up the gain of the Preamp at the tube? Don't want to mess around with the transformer. Thanks.

Ray Bronk

Yoda

Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #11 on: 20 Jan 2009, 09:21 pm »
If you were to plug in your cd player or other source directly to your amp, and it was as loud as you'll ever need (and you don't launch the coils out of your speakers), you wouldn't need more than unity gain (0db).  Another way to look at this is if your source outputs 1.4 v and your amp takes 1.0v to meet max output power, you wouldn't want gain.  Most of the time one is attenuating with a preamp. The advantage with low gain is that you can run the volume pot fairly wide open, with less degredation to source signal.  Until the Castanet is buttoned up, I am using a passive control on my bel canto amp, and I can barely turn the the thing a degree or two before it's too loud.  I selected the Castanet for these reasons:  Selectable impedance output, headphones, the ability to use it as a 1/2 watt SET amp, very low noise floor, choke PS, ability to float ground on the output trannies, single tube design, great design and success building previous kits, the total kit integration and flexibility, and I found I would never need more than unity gain.

Matt

guest1632

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Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #12 on: 21 Jan 2009, 12:05 am »
If you were to plug in your cd player or other source directly to your amp, and it was as loud as you'll ever need (and you don't launch the coils out of your speakers), you wouldn't need more than unity gain (0db).  Another way to look at this is if your source outputs 1.4 v and your amp takes 1.0v to meet max output power, you wouldn't want gain.  Most of the time one is attenuating with a preamp. The advantage with low gain is that you can run the volume pot fairly wide open, with less degredation to source signal.  Until the Castanet is buttoned up, I am using a passive control on my bel canto amp, and I can barely turn the the thing a degree or two before it's too loud.  I selected the Castanet for these reasons:  Selectable impedance output, headphones, the ability to use it as a 1/2 watt SET amp, very low noise floor, choke PS, ability to float ground on the output trannies, single tube design, great design and success building previous kits, the total kit integration and flexibility, and I found I would never need more than unity gain.

Matt

Hi Matt,

There are sources such as movies that lots of times the tracks are not loud at all. When I was using my TVC, I had to have the thing shy a click from the max position. That is why i would like to have a preamp with some gain. Eventually if I go back to Vinyl, I'll certainly need more gain than that to ugment the head amp for the moving coil cartridge.

Ray Bronk

tubesforever

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Re: Clarinet Preamp question
« Reply #13 on: 22 Jan 2009, 06:03 pm »
Ray,

If you build the Castinet stock and just add extra inputs and source selector, you should still be able to sell it on the market place for more than the build price.  By stock I mean using the tube compliment and transformers JH specifies.   

That would let you know if the gain is enough for the movies. 

BTW on my HT receiver I run the rca output of main right and left to the inputs on my Clarinet line stage.  The internal options on my HTR will allow me to increase or decrease the output of any channel.  So I simply set the Clarinet to a comfortable volume and then go back and readjust the other levels to match. 

To accomplish a good balance, I am running my Clarinet about 60% gain.  I hope this helps.

Now on the Castinet, what I like best is that JH utilizes a choke based power supply.  Think ultra clean power and you can see why I think this is a great option, especially for a line stage.

I hope you find a good starting point and let us know.