[Thump553]

I have nearly 1 terrabyte of FLAC files (probably) spread across an internal HD and a couple of external USB harddrives.  Everything is also burnt to DVDs for backup.  One of my externals just died & as I'm not sure what is where, the best solution is probably to start over.

My requirements:

-lots of storage space and expandable if possible
-low cost but reasonable performance
-full backup so I don't have to go through this again if a HD dies
-hook into my wired network if possible (wireless reception where my squeezebox is is dodgy)
-noisy, ugliness are not factors-the box will be in the basement.
-as low a cost as is possible


I have an unused copies of Windows Vista Ultimate and Windows Server 2008 sitting around (got for going to a seminar) but no experience with Windows Server.  Don't mind dabbling with linux, but never used it and don't want it to be a second occupation.

I have a fair number of half-torn down computers around for parts.  One very old Pentium II or III box that is totally working, I think.

I've read the $60 NAS link above.  Is that the direction I should go or is anything more current?

I've never built a NAS but have built multiple computers.   

[FasterThanEver]

> Windows Vista Ultimate ...  One very old Pentium II or III box

That would extremely dysfunctional.

---
You can share the files using plain old Windows (XP or Vista.)

Some questions:

- What music player s/w are you using?

- Will you be running the music player s/w on one computer and accessing the music files on the file server?

- Do you want to run any software on the file server in addition to the basic file server functionality.  (For example, SqueezeCenter.)

- How important is it for you to do backups quickly?  or transfer files to and from the file server?

- Do expect to leave the file server running all the time.

--- An obvious path for you:

Use a PC running Windows XP or stripped Vista as the file server.  Dual Core CPU, 2GB or 4 GB RAM, a 1 TB Western Digital green HD.  A older slower CPU may be fine.  I would not go below 512 MB RAM for XP or 2GB for Vista.  You already know how to build PCs and to use them.

I'd avoid Windows Server 2008 unless you want to deal with more complexity.

Add a second 1 TB hard disk when you need more space.

Don't worry about RAID.  It may protect you against some problems but not other real problems.  I'd bet that many of the people advocating RAID for home use have never been through the process of reconstructing their files after a failure.  They may have a nasty surprise ahead of them.

Buy 2 large backup drives.  Preferably 1.5 TB or larger.  Keep 1 backup off-site if you can find a trustworthy and willing friend.

--- Practical reasons for going with a NAS appliance or a Linux or Unix box dedicated to the NAS function

- You might save some money on the computer.  If you buy a cheap NAS appliance, look for one with USB ports and a functional way to do backups.  There are many, many cheap NAS appliances around.  If you choose to build a standard PC and install Linux, be sure the distribution you choose has the Samba file server software in the distribution.

- Windows does better when you shut it down at night and start it again in the morning.  Server versions of Windows are better at running for days or months without being shut-down.

Bill

[richidoo]

The key to an effective disaster recovery plan is to have it in place before the distaster occurs AND make it automatic and no maintenance. It will die on the day you forget to change the backup tape, etc.

File serving is not a big chore, a P3 can do it, especially with a small OS.

RAID 5 is nice because it can be expanded as big as you need. It is redundant so that if one drive fails, your data is stil safe, as long as you replace the dead drive before another croaks. A proprietary RAID 5 system like Infrant ReadyNAS makes this very easy, but there are RAID controls software that is just as easy. The old days of configuring it manually in hardware and DOS are long gone.

This might work well for ya! http://www.freenas.org/

[Thump553]

That freenas may be the way for me to go.

I'm sorry I wasn't clearer in my original post.  This box would be exclusively (or almost so) for streaming flac files to my Squeezebox.  I rarely play music files on the home computer directly. 

[randytsuch]

Hi
In this thread, there is some discussion about freenas versus a full linux installation
http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=53267

Since I am the originator of the $60 thread, I am obviously bias, but I let me relate my experience so far.

I may have had different requirements, I wanted to be able to run "headless", controlling the server from another PC.  My server sits on the top of a cabinet in my garage.  I wanted to make use of the stuff I had around, as much as possible, and I wanted to keep the costs as low as possible.

So, I found a cheap motherboard that would do what I needed, threw it in a case, and installed the clarkconnect version of Linux.

A couple years later, I am happy with the outcome.  I basically let it run 24/7, with almost no maintenance.  I came into this knowing nothing of Linux, and was able to figure out what I needed, from the internet.  It is not without issues.  Whenever I need to do something, since I don't know Linux, and only use it on the rare occassions when I have to do something, it takes a little longer.  For instance, today I was trying to figure out how to add a skin.  I had to figure out where the skins are stored in Linux.  After a little searching, I was able to figure it out.

And now, at least a few others have used Clarkconnect and slimserver, and there is my guide, and the other guide that I linked to at the end of the $60 thread.  His guide is VERY good.

Just to see what happens, you could use your P3 machine, with a little hard drive for operating system, and pick up a big drive for your music, install CC and slimserver, and see how it works.  Maybe that will be good enough, and you'll be done.  I saw a one TB in today's Frys ad for $110, lowest price I have seen so far, for 1 TB. 

For backups, I just have a extra hard drive that I store all my music on.  So, if my server HD ever dies, I just need to reload all the music files.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

Randy

[JEaton]

I've read the $60 NAS link above.  Is that the direction I should go or is anything more current?

I've never built a NAS but have built multiple computers.   

You're not building an NAS.  You're building a server on which you'll run SqueezeCenter.

You may be able to build a decent server from the parts you have.  Run Windows Server 2008 on it, put a 1 TB drive or two in it.  Get an external drive of sufficient size to back up the whole library.

Use the PIII if that's the fastest system you have.  Install at least 2GB of RAM for Windows.  One TB drives are about $100-120 right now.  If the PIII system doesn't take SATA drives then you'll have to add either an SATA controller or maybe just start from scratch with an inexpensive socket 775 motherboard and an inexpensive dual-core Intel CPU.  Not including the hard drives, you should be able to do it for under $300.

[randytsuch]

You're not building an NAS.  You're building a server on which you'll run SqueezeCenter.

You may be able to build a decent server from the parts you have.  Run Windows Server 2008 on it, put a 1 TB drive or two in it.  Get an external drive of sufficient size to back up the whole library.

Use the PIII if that's the fastest system you have.  Install at least 2GB of RAM for Windows.  One TB drives are about $100-120 right now.  If the PIII system doesn't take SATA drives then you'll have to add either an SATA controller or maybe just start from scratch with an inexpensive socket 775 motherboard and an inexpensive dual-core Intel CPU.  Not including the hard drives, you should be able to do it for under $300.

If I was building this right now, I would look at either the newer Via processor (C something), the Intel atom, or a cheap AMD.  I think any of them would work, and you can get a MB/Processor combo for a $100, maybe less at Newegg.

Randy

[JEaton]

If I was building this right now, I would look at either the newer Via processor (C something), the Intel atom, or a cheap AMD.  I think any of them would work, and you can get a MB/Processor combo for a $100, maybe less at Newegg.

If you want either the cheapest system you can build, or one that uses minimal energy, that would be the way to go.  But SqueezeCenter benefits from more processing power in several ways: faster library scans, quicker web interface, more responsive remote interface.

[richidoo]

Yeah, once you throw SqueezeCenter into the mix, you need an application server, not just fileserver. Your P3 running Linux with SC7 might be OK. If too slow, try slimserver 6.5.4. I don't think that freenas can host other apps like SC.

On a slower server, flac might need to decode on the SB especially when running SC instead of slim. SC does like a lot of memory.

[randytsuch]

My little via processor does fine, for running linux, and slimserver.

If you run windows, you might need more horsepower. 

It was a little slow when I upgraded to the 7.x slimserver, but on another thread, someone pointed out that the new skin is more processor intensive.  I played with the skins, and use a different one now, and the response is fine, for normal listening.  Scans do take a while, so I just do it when I am not going to use the server for a while.

My music collection is on the small side, and I have heard that bigger collections slow things down, so that might be a factor too.

Randy

[Thump553]

An update (or more correctly, my tale of wasted effort):

Being very stingy, and Staples have a 1 TB external hard drive on sale for $140 on Black Friday, I snatched that up.  Using another computer I spent a solid week copying the FLAC files from archive DVDs to the new external HD.  I then hook up the new HD to a USB port on my music computer and . . . nothing happens.  The external HD light comes on but the computer never recognizes it.  After about an hour trying to figure out what is wrong, I'm stumped.  I even switched USB ports and rebooted the computer (several times).  Finally, in desperation I shut down the remaining old external USB HD I have and switch the new one to that USB port-it works!  Turns out I didn't have a HD crash at all, but the failure of TWO USB ports on my computer. 

Of course, being the tinkerer I am I opened the case of the "bad" external HD so it doesn't have a warranty now.  But at least I can use it for something.


A lot of wasted time, but perhaps this will be the final motivating factor for me to replace this computer before it totally gives up the ghost.