[mfsoa]

http://www.audiophilia.com/hardware/Loudspeakers/reviews/maximus.htm

The Mark&Daniel speakers are 83 db and drop to 2 point something ohms and the guy is using VTL Deluxe 120 amps at 90 watts?

And a Bent passive pre probably didn't help the woofers any either.

Speakers were set up 6' apart and 12' from the listener, and 33" from the side walls toed OUT 30°.

Seriously, am I missing something of value in this or is this just completely useless?

Fine with me if a reviewer doesn't like the sound of something, but this?

(I hope none of us wrote it!)

 

[thunderbrick]

I skimmed it and found it devoid of a conclusion.

[bluemike]

If you're familiar with the reviewer there is no surprise 

[John Ryder]

Wordy and full of over the top descriptiions to get a simple point across?...sure.

"Terrible"...no I don't see that being the case.

[Rocket]

Hi,

I always check out the equipment a reviewer is using when they do these reviews.  Most of the time the equipment they have in their homes aren't as good as what I use at home.  They can write more eloquently than I can and describe the sound they hear better than me.  But when I read what components they are using to test the equipment I can't believe they have obtained the best results from the equipment.  I read one review where the person was using an onkyo receiver test some great speakers but it was a great read though.  Just my thoughts on the subject.

Regards

Rod

[konut]

Looks like something of a "worst case scenario" for these speakers. This guy is a reviewer? I'm sure Mark&Daniel  are thrilled. 

[gjs_cds]

I loved this the dichotomy of these quotes:

The challenge of combining dissimilar driver materials (i.e., ribbon driver & conventional paper-cone woofer) cannot be under estimated.

I suggest increasing the dispersion of the tweeter and increasing the slope of the crossover to 96 db/octave.

Yeah--a 96 db/octave slope at Fc is really going to "combine" the two dissimilar driver types. 

The guy's a blowhard.  Don't even get me started about his 30-degree toe-out to reduce errors in the frequency response.  (Especially after the guy didn't even take any quantifiable data!)

[sbrtoy]

Holy mother of god....that is an "awful" review....not only is there zero technical merit, but the structure of the article is quite poor as well with his "conclusions" not supporting anything from the body of the article. 

I am a M&D dealer so maybe I am not the most unbiased one on the subject, but although their speakers aren't perfect (whose are?) they do perform quite well if set up correctly. 

Again let's review...low impedance speakers with a tube amp, lacking bass drive with a passive preamp, and excessive brightness with speakers toed OUT straight at the walls (presumably untreated)....yep, this poor gent should have his license revoked.

[mfsoa]

Thanks for the confirmation, guys.
I have no problem w/ VTL amps, I'm sure in the right setup they can be magic.

I really posted this because the mfgr and dealers could be harmed with this crap making it out into the public eye.

I've heard the M&Ds once, at Phil's rave, and I was very impressed.

-Mike

[mcullinan]

Ive heard the Mark & Daniels a few times and have yet to like them. Boomy, Missing upper mid detail. Perhaps in the right system...
Mike

[ltr317]

Thanks for the confirmation, guys.
I have no problem w/ VTL amps, I'm sure in the right setup they can be magic.

I really posted this because the mfgr and dealers could be harmed with this crap making it out into the public eye.

I've heard the M&Ds once, at Phil's rave, and I was very impressed.

-Mike

Hi Mike.  I brought the M&D Maximus to Phil's may rave.  I thought Phil's room was under damped, which negated some of the mid-range to let the Maximus really shine.  I had borrowed them from the manufacturer, along with their smaller Topaz monitors to demonstrate at several tri-state audio club meetings.  At one of the club meetings, I asked Roy to review them, to which he agreed.  He initially had them toed in, but found they had too much treble energy on some recordings in his room.  He then towed them out as he expressed in his review, and preferred them that way.  After the two week audition, I went and got them back.  I listen to them for about two hours before we packed them up.  I thought they sounded pretty good with his VTL monoblocs.  The sound staging was very good and I didn't hear any excess treble.  After the audition, Roy stated to me that he generally liked the speakers, especially the bass.  His only real reservation was that the treble could be a little ragged on some recordings, depending on the source material.  I suggested that maybe M&D could install a tweeter control, to which he agreed.  I conveyed this sentiment to the M&D USA president in an email.  He forwarded the email to the designer in Shanghai, who responded by thanking me for the suggestion and in fact is thinking of installing the feature in some of their models. 

After the audition, Roy even said to me that if they were cheaper, he would buy a pair to use as a reviewing tool, as the Maximus is very revealing.  Every time he substituted a different component, the Maximus revealed the difference.  About a month later when the review came out, I was surprised to read what he had wrote.  It didn't matched his comments to me.  I thought the review was disjointed, rambling and generally negative.  I called him and told him I didn't read any of the positive things he conveyed to me after the audition.  He replied that he referred to his notes when he was writing the review and that's how it came out, and once the review was published he couldn't change it.  I've known Roy for close to 20 years as members of the same audio club, and it seems out of character to me that he would write such an incoherent review. 

I have listened extensively to both the Maximus and Topaz monitors in both my systems with different components and found them to be generally good speakers with the exception of the ragged treble on some recordings.  The problem to my ears when this happens is not excessive treble energy but a bit of grit in the upper mid-range and lower treble.  My room is well damped and I used mostly tube equipment for the audition.  I heard enough good things at CES to ask for a loan from the manufacturer.

Anyway, a friend called and told me he was looking for new speakers as he was dissatisfied with his Thiel CS2s.  He hadn't listen to his system for a year because he didn't like the Thiels.   I told him I had both the M&Ds on loan.  He asked to borrow them and after two weeks of listening, he called to say he wanted to buy the Maximus.  He's very happy with them and is finally listening to music again.  He told me the bass on the Maximus is much better defined than the Thiels.  Also, the treble is clearer.  I put him in touch with M&D.  Two months later, he called again and said he's listening to music more now than he ever did with the Thiels.  I'm not endorsing M&D speakers in any way.  I'm merely pointing out that what's sour to one person is sweet to another.  Sorry for the long post. 

Paul   

[mcullinan]

Paul,
Thanks for bringing them btw. You are the reason I heard the Mark & Daniels. To each his own for sure.. and a rave is not the best of places to listen seriously... again perhaps with the right gear the are a match made in heaven 
Mike

[ltr317]

Paul,
Thanks for bringing them btw. You are the reason I heard the Mark & Daniels. To each his own for sure.. and a rave is not the best of places to listen seriously... again perhaps with the right gear the are a match made in heaven 
Mike

Mike,

You're welcome.  Like I said, I heard the Topaz and Mini at CES this past january and like them enough to ask for a loaner.  I merely wanted to give them some exposure, as the M&D distributor lamented to me that they weren't well known on the east coast.

Paul

[Bob in St. Louis]

Ive heard the Mark & Daniels a few times and have yet to like them. Boomy, Missing upper mid detail. Perhaps in the right system...

Your audition was most likely flawed since you had the speakers toed IN? 
Jeez man, EVERYBODY knows you toe M&D's out.   

{Sorry, couldn't resist}

Bob

[mfsoa]

Paul,
Yes, Phil's room upstairs is very live compared to my room.

Thanks for bringing them by - As "Crazy" Mike says the Raves aren't really for serious listening but what I heard I liked well enough to at least keep the brand on my radar.

[BobM]

Oh boy, here comes an open can of worms.

I also know Roy (the reviewer) personally. I know his likes and dislikes, and his very different opinions on good sound. How he can be a reviewer is beyond me. His views are anything but "normal" for most audiophiles. Without going into any more details I would universally throw out any opinions on the sound of a piece of equipment that he poses.

A little harsh, you think. You don't know Roy.

Bob

[konut]

Hold on a dern minute! Let me get this straight. First you toe them in, and then you toe them out, but what you neglected to do was shake it all about. You do the hokey pokey and then turn them all around, because THATS what its all about!    Sorry

[bluemike]

Oh boy, here comes an open can of worms.

I also know Roy (the reviewer) personally. I know his likes and dislikes, and his very different opinions on good sound. How he can be a reviewer is beyond me. His views are anything but "normal" for most audiophiles. Without going into any more details I would universally throw out any opinions on the sound of a piece of equipment that he poses.

A little harsh, you think. You don't know Roy.

Bob

my sentiments exactly  for what these cost they do many things right imo

[ltr317]

Oh boy, here comes an open can of worms.

I also know Roy (the reviewer) personally. I know his likes and dislikes, and his very different opinions on good sound. How he can be a reviewer is beyond me. His views are anything but "normal" for most audiophiles. Without going into any more details I would universally throw out any opinions on the sound of a piece of equipment that he poses.

A little harsh, you think. You don't know Roy.

Bob

Hi Bob,

Yes, everyone in the LI club know Roy's sound preference.  Suffice to say, he would probably prefer the tonal balance of a small table radio more than most "high end" audio systems.  Despite those personal preferences, I thought his past reviews were fairly objective.  He knows and is able to hear relatively neutral sound.  In his past reviews on various cables and cords, Roy basically reported what he heard, comparing the results with neutrality as a reference.  He left the conclusion up to the reader to decide whether or not that a particular product would be his/her cup of tea.  To me, that is the best form of an objective audio review, neither endorsing or lambasting a particular product.  That's why I asked him to review the Maximus monitors.  I didn't mind the negative comments as it related to neutrality in the review, but imagine my surprise when I read his overall tone, which did not match his comments to me.  I don't have any association with M&D but felt sorry for the manufacturer in that Roy wrote up a review that was almost totally different than what he told me after the audition.     

Paul

[Danny Richie]

Hey guys,

It may not look like a very good review and I certainly do not know the reviewer, but a some of his comments are not without basis.

I had been sent three different models from the M&D line (mostly for repairs). So I know exactly what's inside and how they measure in every way.

Aside from that, I was asked by StereoMojo (when it first started) to measure and test speakers for them that they were reviewing. I had no problem with doing this as I have a standing invitation to take measurements for anyone that sends me speakers so long as they cover the shipping cost each way. I have provided this free service for years.

However, James Darby (editor of StereoMojo) later gave me a title and listed me as a staff member that caused some perceived conflicts of interest for me so I had to resign from being their "technical guru", and have not done anything for them since then.

Now all of that to say that you can get a little more of the story by reading the review that James posted on the StereoMojo site.

http://www.stereomojo.com/Maximus%20Monitor%20Revew/MarkDanielMaximummonitorReview.htm

Maybe what was found then will give some perspective.