[jwes]

Hello,

So it's nice to be considering a great class "D" and a great class "T".  I'm seriously tempted by both the Spectron Musician III Mk 2 (around $7,200), and the Red Wine 70.2 monoblocks ($5,200).  Both are supposed to be amazing.  Red Wine wins on $$, as the battery power eliminates the need for after market power cords, and the Spectron, even a new, latest version requires additional upgrades to sound its best.

$$$ not withstanding, I'm wondering if anyone has had a chance to listed to both of these great amps...

Thanks very much in advance for any thoughts!!

[Double Ugly]

Red Wine wins on $$, as the battery power eliminates the need for after market power cords, and the Spectron, even a new, latest version requires additional upgrades to sound its best.

That a Spectron ordered today needs additional upgrades to sound it's best is (at best) a subjective opinion.  I know at least one who believes the stock MIII Mk2 is about as good as it gets, especially in monoblock form.

Additionally, the Spectron does not seem to be as sensitive to PCs as other amps I've owned.

I'm not pushing the Spectron and I've never heard the RWA offering, but I thought the above information may prove useful when making your decision.

[THE_ANSWERS]

Hello,

So it's nice to be considering a great class "D" and a great class "T".  I'm seriously tempted by both the Spectron Musician III Mk 2 (around $7,200), and the Red Wine 70.2 monoblocks ($5,200).  Both are supposed to be amazing.  Red Wine wins on $$, as the battery power eliminates the need for after market power cords, and the Spectron, even a new, latest version requires additional upgrades to sound its best.

$$$ not withstanding, I'm wondering if anyone has had a chance to listed to both of these great amps...

Thanks very much in advance for any thoughts!!

i was just on the digital amp corp thread and have heard the 4800a and liked it .   i don't own one though but a friend does and he moved away taking it with him.    there's some comments on spectron on that thread!   about after market power cords, dont Spectron amps come with power cords??????

[jwes]

Hi, thanks for the thoughts!

On after market power cords, I wasn't saying that the Spectron definitely needs them, but rather that the Red Wine Audio definitely would not, as it uses a charger for its battery power.

I have read some of that thread on the Digitial Amp Company.  Sounds like an interesting new product from what looks to be a new company...  Not sure, but I will go look.

[jhm731]

How can you compare an amp that puts out 600 watt/ch at 8 ohm with amps that put out 30 watts
at 8 ohms?

If you have speakers with 95 db + sensitivity than the Red Wire might be an option, otherwise the
MIII Mk2 is the way to go.

[jwes]

Thanks, yes.  I'm considering the 70.2's which are 70 Watts into 4 ohms (my speakers are 4 ohm, 88db, but much easier to drive than this might indicate).  It seems an odd comparison but conversations I've had and everything I've read is consistent in saying that the battery power of the Red Wine somehow results in current delivery that drives the crap out of even difficult loads.  And these discussions have mostly been about the 30.2 integrated, not the higher power 70.2 that I'm considering.

I don't know how every manufacturer measures power, but I know it differs.  In any case, I am convinced that either of the two would drive my speakers sufficiently, and I may well be looking to a higher efficiency speaker in the near term anyway. 

But I have to agree that the grip and control of something with massive power (like the Spectron) into 4 ohms is pretty enticing.

So earlier I may have made a bad assumption that the upgrades are needed to make the Spectron sound its best.  I was just assuming that because the company itself offers these upgrades, they are doing so because it improves the amp, and it seem they would be in a position to know.  But maybe it just depends on system implementation.

[Bemopti123]

I say your partnering speaker option should dictate which you should purchase.

Spectron can push lumbering beasts into dance, but the RWA 70 will call for a different speaker partner.  If you have one of these highly demanding speakers, I would PERSONALLY, opt for the higher powered amp.

PS:  What speakers are you thinking about powering?

[Double Ugly]

I say your partnering speaker option should dictate which you should purchase.

I agree.

[jwes]

I say your partnering speaker option should dictate which you should purchase.

Spectron can push lumbering beasts into dance, but the RWA 70 will call for a different speaker partner.  If you have one of these highly demanding speakers, I would PERSONALLY, opt for the higher powered amp.

PS:  What speakers are you thinking about powering?

Right now, Dali Euphonia MS4.  When it's time to upgrade in a year or so, potentially one of the Zu's (Def'n 2 or Presence) or the Emerald CS2/CS1.  For the latter, if I went with Red Wine now, I'd have to put those on the top of the CS2's, and if Spectron, I'd put that on the bottom.

[rydenfan]

I have personally listened to the Dali and Spectron combo, and can highly recommend it.

[Bemopti123]

I say your partnering speaker option should dictate which you should purchase.

Spectron can push lumbering beasts into dance, but the RWA 70 will call for a different speaker partner.  If you have one of these highly demanding speakers, I would PERSONALLY, opt for the higher powered amp.

PS:  What speakers are you thinking about powering?

Right now, Dali Euphonia MS4.  When it's time to upgrade in a year or so, potentially one of the Zu's (Def'n 2 or Presence) or the Emerald CS2/CS1.  For the latter, if I went with Red Wine now, I'd have to put those on the top of the CS2's, and if Spectron, I'd put that on the bottom.

It is not necessarily a good decision to spend that $$$ on something to be used in the future for woofer duties.  I say if you go with Spectron now, it is very possible that your Dalis will become a different beast.

If you had the Zus or the CS2, then, RWA might have been an excellent choices, as most hi sensitivity type of speakers are fond of low powered speakers. 

Whatever the outcome, you might be happy with either amplifier for the short run.  I believe that those Dalis can be run with the RWA 70s.  Is the money back situation still applicable with Vinnie?  Why not try them out?

[THE_ANSWERS]

How can you compare an amp that puts out 600 watt/ch at 8 ohm with amps that put out 30 watts
at 8 ohms?

If you have speakers with 95 db + sensitivity than the Red Wire might be an option, otherwise the
MIII Mk2 is the way to go.

sounds like you are a salesman for spectron   everywhere i look youre pushing that amp     i agree with not comparing 30w to 600w or whatever .   what about tact or ps-audio or bel-canto or channel islands or the other class-t or class-d amps?????

[zybar]

How can you compare an amp that puts out 600 watt/ch at 8 ohm with amps that put out 30 watts
at 8 ohms?

If you have speakers with 95 db + sensitivity than the Red Wire might be an option, otherwise the
MIII Mk2 is the way to go.

sounds like you are a salesman for spectron   everywhere i look youre pushing that amp     i agree with not comparing 30w to 600w or whatever .   what about tact or ps-audio or bel-canto or channel islands or the other class-t or class-d amps?????

I believe jhm731 uses a modified TacT 2150 amp.   

There are other people who are "pushing" the Spectron amp much more.   

We all tend to push the gear that we own and like.  It can be challenging at times to not seem like we are on a particular vendor's payroll, but for the most part, the people here at AC are genuine and try to give good advice.

George

[Imperial]

I guess this also is a question on how loud you want to play, how big the room is and that sort of stuff.
As I understand it you have Euphonia MS4?
They could work, I guess, with either amp, but when you would like to blast the sound, I'm guessing you would need power!!!
They seem to need in the order of quality 150++ watts when called on to play LOUD!!!
Actually this speaker likes current. So 70 watt's might be all it takes, as long as it's a current there to back it up!
As I understand it, the Vines pack quite the current too!

Distance to back wall is also important with this speaker.
4 feet (from front of speaker...) is the middle ground, close the distance and the bass comes in full, pull it out and it leans out...

I believe a Spectron could fry this speaker if given full input, that is what I think...Especially a set of monoblocks...

The best for them? Haven't' got a clue really!!! 

Imperial

[saisunil]

I think it is a very good post.
The best answer would be by those (if there are any people like that) who have heard both amps with the same speaker or who have heard both amps in the same room with different speakers or at least those who have heard both amps - the rooms and speakers may vary.

I have ear marked RWA amps myself - because they are battery powered.
I have heard spectron amp with audio physics a couple of years ago and I liked what I heard.
I own TRL D225 amp - so the only reason I am likely to make a switch to another amp would be because I want to move to battery power.

IMO, the key to dynamic headroom is not as much in the wattage as it is clean and overbuilt Power Supply.

I think we should be accepting if someone is pushing the amp they own - they must love it to own it and they are just sharing their love.

Let the audio love spread!

Cheers
Sunil

[AmpDesigner333]

How can you compare an amp that puts out 600 watt/ch at 8 ohm with amps that put out 30 watts
at 8 ohms?

If you have speakers with 95 db + sensitivity than the Red Wire might be an option, otherwise the
MIII Mk2 is the way to go.

sounds like you are a salesman for spectron   everywhere i look youre pushing that amp     i agree with not comparing 30w to 600w or whatever .   what about tact or ps-audio or bel-canto or channel islands or the other class-t or class-d amps?????

"Class-T" is actually Class-D.  This fake class designation is marketing, not engineering.  Not to disqualify it, though, just because some marketing types set out to push something they don't understand.  I bet the engineers went kicking and screaming on that one.

Thanks for your mention of the DAC4800A and Digital Amplifier Company (not corp, like you said in another post), but I hope you pay a little more attention to your spelling and grammar in the future.  It's kind of like having the town idiot going around saying how great you are.  That's just an analogy, so please don't get all defensive.

Please get your friend that you keep mentioning to post here or on the DAC4800A/Cherry thread.  I'll go over there now...  Thanks for your post.

[Mariusz]

I did not know that RWA Sig. 70.2 was 70wpc?????

[Randy]

I did not know that RWA Sig. 70.2 was 70wpc?????   

It's not. It does offer higher current delivery, however.

[Imperial]

I did not know that RWA Sig. 70.2 was 70wpc?????

The speaker is 3.6 - 4ohms,  hence... 

Imperial

[Mariusz]

I did not know that RWA Sig. 70.2 was 70wpc?????   

It's not. It does offer higher current delivery, however.

That's right.
70wpc into 4ohms
30wpc into 8ohms

It could be confusing for someone new reading this thread and should be clarify. Other then that, like everything in life or more like in HiFi Life - It boils down to personal preferences and most importantly system synergy and comparability.

Mariusz