[zybar]

Well the Pass amp is out the window, I just checked the website and the thing is huge! Way too big for my space. This of course is after I found one for a killer price 

I did just find a local pair of CIA D-200 amps for what seems to be a very good price, I wonder how they would fare 

CIA amps are nice and an excellent value, but IMHO won't provide the level of performance that some of the amps in this thread will (especially the Class A amps).  I will say that they don't sound as "digital" as many of the other highly acclaimed ice or hypex based amps do.

George

[woodsyi]

I  own the Dali Helicon 400's and have tried them with the H20 Audio Signature amp, Butler Audio TDB 2250 and the latest "electrostatic" amp from Sanders Audio. I thought the H20 sounded OK, but compared to the Butler, it was very sluggish in the bass and somewhat "dark" sounding. I subsequently purchased the Butler amp after an audition, which I used for about 2 1/2 years, then purchased the Sanders amp. (I just learned that there is an upgrade for the Butler that improves the bass response and it is a "steal" used!) This is also an excellent sounding amp, it will drive just about anything and it sounds very neutral. You are supposed to leave it on all of the time as it only consumes about 6 watts at idle and it runs very cool. Roger Sanders white paper on amps and cables make for an very interesting read. Retail is $4k from Sanders or Norvinz and comes with a 30 day money back audition. There is a review of the amp on "EnjoytheMusic.com". Sanders cables are also very good and very cheap as well.

Glenn

The old ESL amps were like that.  If he is still using the same topology with overkill on the output devices, I bet it's good.  Originally designed to be used with electrostats, ESL II was neutral with good damping power on dynamic cones.   

[mca]

The CIA amps were so cheap, I thought what the hell? But they had already sold in record time.

I'm actually considering either the Nuforce V2 SE or a Red Wine 30.2 now....

[doug s.]

The CIA amps were so cheap, I thought what the hell? But they had already sold in record time.

I'm actually considering either the Nuforce V2 SE or a Red Wine 30.2 now....

if you are wanting a bargain, you should really consider the amps tim rawson makes/sells; he goes by rawsonte on a-gon.  or buy my (relatively) cheap hypex ucd180 amp that i took in trade & have no use for.     i have posted info/pics about it elsewhere on the a/c forum...

doug s.

[zybar]

The CIA amps were so cheap, I thought what the hell? But they had already sold in record time.

I'm actually considering either the Nuforce V2 SE or a Red Wine 30.2 now....

if you are wanting a bargain, you should really consider the amps tim rawson makes/sells; he goes by rawsonte on a-gon.  or buy my (relatively) cheap hypex ucd180 amp that i took in trade & have no use for.     i have posted info/pics about it elsewhere on the a/c forum...

doug s.

Doug,

While I am not as high on the Mesa Baron (I bought one years ago from Srajan and never thought it was anything special) as you, I am in total agreement with you on buying something from Tim Rawson.  I have have two of his amps and they are excellent!!  While there are definitely DIY in the looks department, sonically they are up there and better in sound then many of the other SS amps I have had in house (CIA D-200's, Odyssey Mono Extreme SE's, and NuForce).

George

[RPM123]

RPM123,

Wow, I'm quite surprised to read that you encountered sluggish bass with an H2O amp - especially in direct comparison with a hybrid like the Butler. While I admit to not being a big fan of Henry's Signature 250 amplifier, my reasons certainly do not include bass control. In fact, that was the one thing the amp did exceptionally well. Please note that I am in no way casting doubt over what you reported to hear. In fact, your post serves as a humble reminder that sometime, somewhere, someone using a piece of gear you are familiar with will encounter polar opposite results.

Cheers.

No problem. Perhaps I emphasized the bass response too much, but overall, the transient response was noticeably slower than the Butler's. I recall listening to some orchestral pieces and being startled by the transients with the Butler, but not so with the H20. While it definitely had more bass and went deeper, I felt that the Butler was far more "agile".   

[mca]

George,

Did you have the current Nuforce amps or an older version? I keep being drawn to these because of their small size, light weight, low power consumption and the fact they don't generate much if any heat. Of course, I'd throw all that out the window if they don't sound good. (Although if you read the reviews of the 9SE V2, they sound killer)

[mca]

BRM uses a 350.5 with his Modwright 36.5 and likes the combination very much

Not enough to keep it, it's on Audiogon now 

[Double Ugly]

Of course, I'd throw all that out the window if they don't sound good. (Although if you read the reviews of the 9SE V2, they sound killer)

Some I know and trust think them killer, but the absence of a proper protection circuit would be my primary concern.

Caveat emptor.

[mca]

I just figured out a creative way to fit the Pass X250.5. I just sent the seller an email that I would like to buy it, so I will keep my fingers crossed 

[zybar]

George,

Did you have the current Nuforce amps or an older version? I keep being drawn to these because of their small size, light weight, low power consumption and the fact they don't generate much if any heat. Of course, I'd throw all that out the window if they don't sound good. (Although if you read the reviews of the 9SE V2, they sound killer)

I have not heard the latest version.

That being said, it will have to be a very significant improvement over the previous versions to match some of the amps in this thread.

George

[Big Red Machine]

BRM uses a 350.5 with his Modwright 36.5 and likes the combination very much

Not enough to keep it, it's on Audiogon now 

I'm gauging interest.  I'll probably cancel that ad.  327 views in less than a day.  No emails though.

[Big Red Machine]

My price range is about 4k but I would be willing to spend a little more if it gets me closer to what I'm searching for. No other factors just as long as it's not some design that uses 20 tubes per side or something crazy like that.

Hi Mike,

For exactly $4k (unless Paul raised his price) - you can get SST-225 from Tube Research Labs and according to Paul it sounds better than his Tube amps that have 20 tubes per side and cost tens of thousands of $.

This is one of the best amps there is and will drive anything ...

http://tuberesearchlabs.com/contactus.htm

Give Paul a call ....

Cheers
Sunil.

These amps sound very nice.  I sent mine back because I believe the 84.5 db (in)efficiency of my HT3's caused them to trip over some bass notes.  Overall they had good tonality with the single tube in the signal path.  They were lightweight and small for the power they put out, but again, beware if you have inefficient speakers.  I picked up my pair for 1599 and Paul was very gracious on their return agreeing that my speakers may have been too much for them.

[Big Red Machine]

I just figured out a creative way to fit the Pass X250.5. I just sent the seller an email that I would like to buy it, so I will keep my fingers crossed 

What I like about the Pass is its take-charge authority.  It can handle anything you throw at it and does not break a sweat.  I'd like to try one in my HT (care to help me carry it in there?).

The thing I suspect bothers me about the Pass is it is a little too polite for me.  I like agressive attack and I feel (I could be delusional here) that it just doesn't unload in the bass region like I want it to.  I get bass for sure, but I'm looking for more slam and the reality may be the woofers have reached their limit.  And understand that when Jim gets a working HTX I fully expect that to be my next speaker and it should be a killer from what I have squeezed out from his crew.

[Big Red Machine]

Anybody ever try the Ampzilla monoblocks?

[woodsyi]

Ampzilla I heard with RM30s at John Casler's place was very dynamic and certainly "impolite" on bass.    Detailed and dynamic it was but I also heard a little more sibilance than my Bella Extreme 200's.  The highs were precise and detailed -- certainly no roll off there.  If you like complex instrumental music and lean toward the "accurate" camp, check out Ampzilla.  YMMV and I am a certifiable tube head. 

[dweekie]

The CIA amps were so cheap, I thought what the hell? But they had already sold in record time.

I'm actually considering either the Nuforce V2 SE or a Red Wine 30.2 now....

if you are wanting a bargain, you should really consider the amps tim rawson makes/sells; he goes by rawsonte on a-gon.  or buy my (relatively) cheap hypex ucd180 amp that i took in trade & have no use for.     i have posted info/pics about it elsewhere on the a/c forum...

doug s.

Doug,

While I am not as high on the Mesa Baron (I bought one years ago from Srajan and never thought it was anything special) as you, I am in total agreement with you on buying something from Tim Rawson.  I have have two of his amps and they are excellent!!  While there are definitely DIY in the looks department, sonically they are up there and better in sound then many of the other SS amps I have had in house (CIA D-200's, Odyssey Mono Extreme SE's, and NuForce).

George

Which Rawson models do you have?  He seems to make quite a variety; I have one of his Gainclones. 

[mca]

Another one down, the Pass already sold. I knew that was a good price...

[zybar]

Which Rawson models do you have?  He seems to make quite a variety; I have one of his Gainclones. 

Aleph J clone

Aleph-X/XAJ (basically combines the X, J, and XA series attributes)

Both are Nelosn Pass designs and run pure Class A.

George

[zybar]

Another one down, the Pass already sold. I knew that was a good price...

Here is a x250.5 that was just listed:

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?ampstran&1220976928

George