[Folsom]

What different things would you have dedicated breakers for, and what type of breakers?

What other type of special isolation or whatever things would you do?

I only know my stereo would be on a separate breaker, 20a to itself, (or two of them if I thought I needed it), and then video on another. I would also put my computer on its own. That is all I have come up with except using Bryant/Hubble or equivalent ac receptacles in all locations.

What things would you try to avoid?

[JLM]

We built 3 years ago:

We're out in the country, with no heavy industrial electrical customers sharing our substation.   

We're on a 2.5 acre lot, with a 400 ft private underground line to the house, so we got our own transformer.   

We got a whole house surge protector.   

The entire house is minimum 20A circuits, so all the wiring is 12 gauge.   

Except for alarm clocks and a couple of TVs, all appliances are new.   

The audio system is on 3 cryo'd hospital grade Hubbell duplex receptacles that are each on a their own circuit, located a little over 20 feet from the panel.   

The 3 audio circuits are grounded together (separate from the house).   

Some recommend that the audio circuits be wired into the top of the panel.

Some recommend heavier, special wiring from the panel, but you'd have to negociate that with the electrician.

[mjosef]

I would have a dedicated sub panel just for the audio/video room. And it would be installed as close as possible to that room. Thats just for starters.  aa
FWIW...most modern day electricians use 12ga. as the base wire size. I haven't seen anybody use 14ga. wire in a new installation for the last 7years.

[andyr]

What different things would you have dedicated breakers for, and what type of breakers?

What other type of special isolation or whatever things would you do?

I only know my stereo would be on a separate breaker, 20a to itself, (or two of them if I thought I needed it), and then video on another. I would also put my computer on its own. That is all I have come up with except using Bryant/Hubble or equivalent ac receptacles in all locations.

What things would you try to avoid?

Hi DoS,

I suggest you visit PFM and search for the posts about AC mains by Roy K Riches.  In summary, his suggestions include:
* use 32amp MCBs for all hifi circuits, rather than the more normal 20amp.  This implies those circuits have to be wired with 32amp flat.
* use Memera brand MCBs etc. in the CU (Roy will buy them for you and ship, if you live outside the UK.  Memera MCBs are certainly legal in Oz, although I'm not sure about the CU itself.).  Roy actually tested out 6 different brands of CU/MCB - for 6 weeks each setup - and found Memera sounded the best.
* as a minimum, have 2 circuits for sources, so digital devices can be separated from analogue, plus 1 for the power amp(s).  The "ultimate" setup has one separate circuit for each component.
* make all (hifi circuit) wire lengths the same (to minimise earth noise).
* make sure the hifi circuits are nearest the main On/Off switch (or the RCD, if you have one) and "noisy" circuits - like with a fridge or washing m/c - are furthest away.

I had extensive renovations done in 2006 and took the opportunity of reorganising my Consumer Unit and upgrading the wiring/MCBs for my hifi circuits.  What this did (according to friends who subsequently listened to my system) was take away some HF grunge which they had heard previously.

Regards,

Andy

[whubbard]

We're out in the country, with no heavy industrial electrical customers sharing our substation.   

We're on a 2.5 acre lot, with a 400 ft private underground line to the house, so we got our own transformer.   

We got a whole house surge protector.   

The entire house is minimum 20A circuits, so all the wiring is 12 gauge.   

Except for alarm clocks and a couple of TVs, all appliances are new.   

The audio system is on 3 cryo'd hospital grade Hubbell duplex receptacles that are each on a their own circuit, located a little over 20 feet from the panel.   

The 3 audio circuits are grounded together (separate from the house).   

Does it get any better than that!

...Maybe if your power cables were made of pure gold! 

-West

[JLM]

Most of what I did was based on the ideas of others, plus the electrical work was based on a flat bid.  I got my "man cave" as we were moving away from my job, kids, and extended family.  The listening room is built/setup to Cardias recipe for a "cuboid" and well insulated for remarkably little extra money.  The only short coming is the ceiling.  Builder refused to float the drywall on gauge metal furring strips, so someday green glue and another layer of drywall will be needed to fix it.

The building code allows for 15 amp (with 14 gauge wiring) or 20 amp (with 12 gauge wiring) circuits in residential construction.  Here is economically depressed Michigan, most is still 15 amp wiring.  We ended up with a sub panel, but it handles more than just the audio/video rooms.  Not sure if a sub panel by itself does anything to reduce power aberrations (dirty power).

andyr, sounds like you're from "across the pond" as some of us yanks are apt to say.  What's an "MCB in the CU"?

[andyr]

andyr, sounds like you're from "across the pond" as some of us yanks are apt to say.  What's an "MCB in the CU"?

Sorry JLM:

* "CU" ... Consumer Unit aka "the Switchboard" 

* "MCB" ... Miniature Circuit Breaker.

And I think "across the pond" refers to England?  After all, it's only a few hours flight whereas it takes a lot longer to get to Oz! 

Regards,

Andy

[whubbard]

Andyr comes from a land down under
Where beer does flow and men chunder
Can't you hear, can't you hear the thunder?
You better run, you better take cover.

-Men at Work (I love their stuff)

[andyr]

   aa   aa

Andy

[Folsom]

The guy from Men At Work, lead singer, is a creepy old man now. He hit on my friend here in Montana (lives here) when she was like 16-18 years old working at a place that served drinks, and he being 50+.

[whubbard]

I believe he has been married for a while now, but I think the lead guitarist is unmarried and lives in Montana. I'm also pretty sure someone who is 16-18 can't serve drinks 

But heck, that doesn't mean he isn't a creepy old man 

[rajacat]

DOS is a creepy college sophomore.

[Folsom]

Perhaps it is the guitarists, but she said the lead guy.

She was not a bartender, just a server, and he ordered drinks.

I am not sure I am creepy. I get comments on my dancing because people like it, and my style of dressing. I was the hit of a party the other night. I am crazy though.

[Bob in St. Louis]

Would it be a good idea to shield the audio room feed wires in some manner?
This would help protect against EMI.

I would say a dedicated sub panel just outside the room would be an excellent idea. And a minimum of a half dozen breakers as well. Actually, the more the better, it's easier to buy a box with lots of holes right now as opposed to upgrading in a few years. Install surge protection, UPS, voltage conditioners, filters by the breaker box instead of cluttering up the room.

DOS, is the room strictly two channel or will it be multi-channel? How about home theater?
I ask because wiring for a ceiling mounted projector could have a large diameter conduit run to a covered access panel *about* where you think you'd have a projector hanging.
Also, If money is tight up front,  run empty conduit to covered outlet boxes every few feet across every wall. Later, if you decide you want to add a floor lamp, powered sub, center channel, surround speakers etc.... you can run whatever kind of wire your heart desires with ease. Running wires after drywall is installed is pretty dammed difficult. 

Unless your dream audio room is going in a basement, you could also have several outlets prewired to the typical place guys have their sources, and amps. But install an "array" of outlets in the floor lined up against the front wall. This way, you won't have to string 'stupid long' power cords finding the next closest outlet. Just put ten of them up there before you even move in.

Run conduit for wall sconces. You may not install them now, but later down the road you might need 110v six feet up. Who knows? 

Run some more conduit.

And when you're finished running conduit, run some more.

You might waste a few dollars today on conduit you'll never use, but think about having to *figure out* how to run a wire from here to there AFTER the room is finished.

Another nice thing about wires in a conduit is it makes upgrading/changing wires in the future much easier;
Disconnect - then - Yank.

Bob

[andy_c]

I second the "subpanel as close as possible to the listening room" idea.  That's what I plan to do in my future home.

Another thing to consider might be using "isolated-ground" outlets.  "Isolated-ground" in this case means that the safety ground of the outlet has its own separate, insulated ground wire going back to the subpanel ground.  There is no "daisy chaining" of safety ground connections in this case.  The metal box in the wall behind the outlet is also grounded separately, using a bare copper ground wire.  So each outlet pair has four wires:

1) Hot
2) Neutral
3) Insulated ground wire from third prong of plug socket to subpanel ground
4) Bare ground wire from metal box behind outlet to subpanel ground

If all outlets used by the audio/video system are of the isolated-ground type, you'll have a true "star grounding" system for your AC.  This may only be practical if the subpanel is very close to the listening room though.

I bought a book from Lowe's called "The Black and Decker Complete Guide to Home Wiring".  Though I'm an EE, I learned a lot of practical stuff about home wiring from this book that they don't teach in EE school.  It has lots of great illustrations and explanations of how to do a lot of this stuff yourself if you're so inclined.

[tvyankee]

hey

use 10 gauge wire where ever you can. also you may want the same isolated ground for both audio/video as you don't want any potential.

also both richard gray and equitech have balanced isolation transformers for a sub panel if you choose to go that route.

good luck.

[Wayner]

10 gauge wire is not required for any 20 amp service and is a waste of money and copper resources. If everybody did this, we would have a copper shortage. Bad advice, IMHO.

Wayner

[Wayner]

Has anyone talked about CAT5e wire or additional coax? How about low voltage for lighting? 120/240 mains are not the only wiring in a house. I would wire separate circuits with switched outlets to shut off shit like TV's and other crap that are "on" even when they are "off", waiting for a command from a remote control. That is where energy is being wasted. Go around your house and count what is on when you think it's off. Don't forget the garage door opener, wireless phones and microwave ovens. They all add up the amperage and that is what you pay for. CONVIENCE!

Wayner

[The Computer Audiophile]

Wow, I jumped into this thread a little late. I'm actually getting a subpanel installed in my listening room tomorrow morning. It will be in a cabinet about six feet from my components.

One question for you guys. Richard Gray offers a 240v version of its substation. I don't see any other manufacturers offering 240v versions of their stuff. Anyone guess why this is? I talked to Dick McCarthy from RGPC at CES this year and he said the 240v unit was the best thing you can do to improve sound. Marketing yes, but is there some truth to this if nobody else offers the 240v option?

[Folsom]

This is a research thing for me. I am not building my own house right now but I work at a place that sells recycled, re-use, and sustainable harvested wood and everything else you use building a place. I end up talking to people about stuff. One lady in particular wants serious suggestions about doing every thing right. Also my father may be building his own home theater room soon. The list goes on; I just talk to people about this all the time. I wanted some more information beyond the little stuff I do, or know about, on my own personal level as a renter.