What exactly do "kit versions" involve?

nathanm · « **on:** 16 Oct 2003, 09:32 pm »

I got my subwoofer in kit form to save some dough cause I knew there was no crossover to futz with. But what about other VMPS speakers? Mainly, do you have to solder up bare crossover parts together or are we just talking about stuffing in fiberglass, connecting the wires and screwing in the drivers? Specifically I am interested in the Super Tower II.

warnerwh · « **Reply #1 on:** 16 Oct 2003, 11:04 pm »

When I got my 626 the caps for the crossover had the wires all twisted together for me. There really was no hard part although I remember having to call Brian for some reason. A friend put together some Rm1's and it took him most of a day and he's an EE and very mechanically inclined.

F-100 · « **Reply #2 on:** 16 Oct 2003, 11:14 pm »

Just curious why you want to go with one of their older model but not their latest and greatest ones like 626 or RM2.

Man, if you're close to me.. I'll give you a great deal on my Super Tower. They're one of the best speaker that I've owned but they're just too big for my room.

BTW, I like the Durian picture that you have on your website... We have plenty of them down here in LA

nathanm · « **Reply #3 on:** 17 Oct 2003, 02:33 am »

Quote

Just curious why you want to go with one of their older model but not their latest and greatest ones like 626 or RM2.

I know, I thought about that as well. I figure the Super Tower II is cheaper than the RM2 and it has more woofers. (626 is way too small) Based on what people have said about them they sound like rock speakers, not hifi speakers. This description appeals to me. I am sick of tiny weak boxes that have no slam whatsoever. The Tower II seems like one of the more economical large-sized speakers out there. I do worry about them being overly directional for my tastes though. I didn't care at all for the laser-beam ribbon tweeter on the GR Research Criterions. So I am a little paranoid about ribbons from a dispersion standpoint. I have no idea if this fear has any validity or not though.

I was curious if a person had to wire up XO boards and such for the "kit" cause if so I'll gladly pay the extra 200 bucks to not cock that up myself! Heh!

mellowjammer · « **Reply #4 on:** 17 Oct 2003, 06:47 pm »

I built my RM2's and 626SE and unless you are very handy with a soldering iron, glue gun, silicone, reading schematics, etc., you may want to order them completed. The crossover is NOT a simple stuff-the-components into a pre-made glass exoxy circuit board, but rather a puzzle of discreet components that pretty much need to be wired point-to-point AND fit within the confines of a dedicated space on an mdf block. At least this was how it was when I built mine. I had no problem doing it per se, however I used to be a test engineering technician who did that kind of stuff every day and preferred to do it myself knowing that I had the ability to do it and make it look perfect.
I would say that anyone CAN do it, but it may be very frustrating if you are not skilled in these areas.
And do I even have to mention the possibility of jamming a screwdriver tip through a driver cone? HAH! (actually not funny at all...)

MaxCast · « **Reply #5 on:** 18 Oct 2003, 01:03 am »

That about wraps that up, huh Nathan?

Actually, if you are not affraid of soldering and have the time I'd go for it. I never soldered before but managed a Foreplay on the first shot.

nathanm · « **Reply #6 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 05:51 am »

Yep, that was a stunning endorsement for NOT ordering a kit! I can solder, but I am ignorant of schematics. And I would have to get a soldering iron that didn't suck. Probably not hard to do, but it's not a road I want to go down. Electronics is really something you have to grok. A simple crossover in my hands would turn into a 30 hour, stress-loaded project I can almost guarantee.

Tyson · « **Reply #7 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 06:25 am »

I didn't think anyone referenced Stranger in a Strange Land anymore. Nice one Nathan

nathanm · « **Reply #8 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 02:35 pm »

Mmm, ya lost me on that one Tyson.

You mean the Iron Maiden song? I recognized the song title and looked up the lyrics but I am not sure how it applies except perhaps on a very broad level in that schematics=strange land and me=stranger. Am I way off on this?

sharper · « **Reply #9 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 03:54 pm »

nathan,
My unsolicited $.02 -> Since you're looking for a rock speaker more than hifi...go with the polypro woofers on the Tower II, if they're available, instead of the carbon fiber ones. Less expensive. More powerful bass. I preferred my old Tower II/R's with the polypro woofers to the Tower II/SE's with the carbon fiber woofers for mostly the difference in bass power/response.

Scott

Tyson · « **Reply #10 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 04:29 pm »

Nathan,
Grok is a term first used in Stranger in a Strange Land.

nathanm · « **Reply #11 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 04:53 pm »

You mean the book? I am not familar with it. I recall hearing the term in computer circles I think. Douglas Englebart also used it in an interview. A good, useful word in any case. With circuits I'd be just doing a paint by numbers thing, and if one step went wrong I'd be lost. If I soldered it up just like they instructed but it still didn't work I'd have no clue how to troubleshoot the problem. Those who DO grok circuits and electronic parts would be able to work it out. Besides, VMPS' instructions are written for left-brained people only!

Thanks for the advice sharper! I may not get the Towers after all though, as I might finally get a crack at a used pair of my "dream" speakers on agon. VMPS is probably a better value, though. Hard to say.

Andrikos · « **Reply #12 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 06:01 pm »

what are these dream speakers you speak of Nathan?
Grok references?

Aaaaah, "Somewhere in time" circa 1986... Brings back so many memories... It was my very first album purchase as a 15 y.o. kid... Not a very good album as far as Iron Maiden albums go though...
What does this have to do with VMPS?
Errrrr, nothing at all...
sorry.

Rob Babcock · « **Reply #13 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 06:09 pm »

With apologies for going further off topic, I rather liked that album; I consider it one of their better ones.

Tonto Yoder · « **Reply #14 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 06:15 pm »

Quote from: nathanm

Mmm, ya lost me on that one Tyson.

I'm not Tyson (but I watched Mike Tyson once) and "Tonto" is Cherokee for "Tyson." The novel "Stranger in a Strange Land" by Robert Heinlein coined the term "grok". Like Tyson, I didn't think it was still a very common term.

nathanm · « **Reply #15 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 08:10 pm »

Quote from: Andrikos

what are these dream speakers you speak of Nathan?

It's two gutted Bose Wave Radios mounted in an infinite baffle with Bybees on the speaker posts. I'm having them modded as well with some top secret tweaks. Either that or it's a pair of Waveform Mach Solos.

Quote

Grok references?

Well, apparently it means to completely understand something inside and out to the point where you don't think about it anymore. That is my understanding of it, but I am not familar with the Heinlein book so I hope I am not misinterpreting the word. Closest synonym would be "master" I guess. Maiden didn't manage to use it in the song which is why I was initially confused by Tyson's comment. I should've played along and acted like I knew what he meant. Drat!

wshuff · « **Reply #16 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 09:56 pm »

So then, are you saying that you should have acted like you grotted
Tyson?

nathanm · « **Reply #17 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 10:11 pm »

Whoah hold on, let's have no more than ONE new slang word per thread please!

Andrikos · « **Reply #18 on:** 20 Oct 2003, 10:28 pm »

Those Waveforms look pretty sweet. Good luck...

To get back to the original thread subject:
Does the kit include the wiring to be used to connect the drivers to the crossover as well as the binding posts?
If not, what is recommended?

I'm planning to buy 3 626R kits (L C R) and maybe 2 "plain" 626's for surronds. Also, I'll be buying one or two Larger subs (BIG room, I don't know if one will be big enough.

The HT will be in the family room downstairs (house still being built

) and the down stairs area is pretty open (living, kitchen, breakfast nook, hallway, family area) for a total of ~ 45' x 52' x 9' ceilings.

Is there a hard and fast rule as to how many Largers would be required to fill up the volume with HT-quantity BASS?

Also, I'm planning to build my VMPS speakers using 1/2" MDF covered with 3/4" 13 ply Baltic birch. Is it too much, not enough? What are your thoughts? I'll also be using internal dampening material (Dynamat Extreme type, egg crate foam and polyfill. Is there anyting I'm missing?
Thanks for your inputs.

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #19 on:** 21 Oct 2003, 09:22 am »

Quote from: Tonto Yoder

Quote from: nathanm
Mmm, ya lost me on that one Tyson.

I'm not Tyson (but I watched Mike Tyson once) and "Tonto" is Cherokee for "Tyson." The novel "Stranger in a Strange Land" by Robert Heinlein coined the term "grok". Like Tyson, I didn't think it was still a very common term.

OUCH !! My ear !! (Poor Mike !!)