Ordered 4 GIK 244 bass panels today

sts9fan · « **on:** 25 Apr 2008, 02:28 pm »

I am excited to see what happens! My room is 25'*11' with an attached dining room in a L shape. The speakers are on the wall that attaches to the dinning room. Right now I plan on using two behind the speakers and two either for 1st reflections or in the back corners. I know four is not nearly enough for "perfect" treatment but I am not sure how the Woman is gonna react. I have warned her and she is great about all this but we will see.

Kris

JLM · « **Reply #1 on:** 25 Apr 2008, 04:38 pm »

Keep us informed how the significant other and you react to them.

Remember that corner placement is mostly for bass and that they can also go between walls and the floor too.

bpape · « **Reply #2 on:** 25 Apr 2008, 04:53 pm »

Yup. Lots of options. Get a couple folding chairs out to set them on and play with location that way to see what each does for you and what you like.

Post questions if you have any. I'll be happy to work through the possibilities with you.

Bryan

some young guy · « **Reply #3 on:** 25 Apr 2008, 05:19 pm »

Hey Kris,

I have 3 of the 242's and 2 tri-traps that will hopefully be here today. I'll be looking forward to comparing notes.

mfsoa · « **Reply #4 on:** 25 Apr 2008, 05:29 pm »

Hi Kris,
My corner 244s are placed on kinda cheapo speaker stands, maybe 16" high. I finally got around to attaching them to the wall with cute lil' bungees so now I'm not worried about tip-over.

While their primary purpose may be to trap unwanted bass, I felt that elevating them like this also helped reduce higher-freq crap that was bouncing around the corners and mucking things up. I also felt that it made them look better, since they are more centered vertically on the wall, instead of covering the lower 4" of my 8" high room.

The more panels I put in my room (smallish, 13 x 17') and I have 18 separate panels (mostly GIK but a few 8th nerve) and 2 GIK diffusors, the wider and deeper the soundstage gets. "Width" "depth" "air" etc. don't come from the distortion that bounces off the walls of the room, there is plenty of soundstaging on the source which doesn't need any help from the walls.

It seems a bit counterintuitive maybe, but by reducing the reflections you end up revealing even more of the spatial cues. You will see that the sense of "space" that comes from a lively room is a confused, distorted, jumbled sense of space that is actually disconnected from and detrimental to the music, and that by reducing this you actually start to uncover the intended spacial cues of your source.

Well, that's been my experience at least.

Have fun!

-Mike

Nils · « **Reply #5 on:** 25 Apr 2008, 05:46 pm »

GIK makes some excellent products. I use acoustic treatment from a variety of manufacturers--each make has its advantages over the others.

sts9fan · « **Reply #6 on:** 25 Apr 2008, 06:59 pm »

Placement is also going to depend on how things look unfortunately but I bought two of the stands so the 1st refection's will be moveable. I don't expect any to be permanently attached. I will post my findings and questions.

audioferret · « **Reply #7 on:** 26 Apr 2008, 07:25 am »

Quote from: Nils on 25 Apr 2008, 05:46 pm

GIK makes some excellent products. I use acoustic treatment from a variety of manufacturers--each make has its advantages over the others.

Have you conisdered treating the front wall/ceiling intersection or the wall/floor? It looks neglected...

samplesj · « **Reply #8 on:** 26 Apr 2008, 01:54 pm »

Quote from: audioferret on 26 Apr 2008, 07:25 am

Quote from: Nils on 25 Apr 2008, 05:46 pm

GIK makes some excellent products. I use acoustic treatment from a variety of manufacturers--each make has its advantages over the others.

Have you conisdered treating the front wall/ceiling intersection or the wall/floor? It looks neglected...

I see the smiley so you are probably just kidding around, but in theory Nils doesn't need treatment on the floor/ceiling because its a line source speaker so floor/ceiling interaction is minimized.

Nils · « **Reply #9 on:** 26 Apr 2008, 05:42 pm »

Quote from: samplesj on 26 Apr 2008, 01:54 pm

I see the smiley so you are probably just kidding around, but in theory Nils doesn't need treatment on the floor/ceiling because its a line source speaker so floor/ceiling interaction is minimized.

Well, I do use a sub (i.e. a driver that isn't line source), and it certainly wouldn't be detrimental to mount a few bass traps in the front wall-ceiling area. I actually realized some benefits from mountain three lightweight ASC SoundPanels at the FRP on the ceiling. However, I rent, and mounting hooks into the crossbeams on my ceiling isn't as reversible as the small holes I've put in my walls.

-- Nils

audioferret · « **Reply #10 on:** 26 Apr 2008, 06:54 pm »

Quote

I see the smiley so you are probably just kidding around, but in theory Nils doesn't need treatment on the floor/ceiling because its a line source speaker so floor/ceiling interaction is minimized.

I am only half-kidding. I am actually facinated by his collection of treatments and wondered how he determined this arrangement.

-Nils, how did you determine what arrangement to use? Also, in your experience with GIK, what was your impression/preferences?

Nils · « **Reply #11 on:** 28 Apr 2008, 03:13 am »

Quote from: audioferret on 26 Apr 2008, 06:54 pm

-Nils, how did you determine what arrangement to use? Also, in your experience with GIK, what was your impression/preferences?

Experimentation, experimentation, experimentation. I spent months tweaking placement and type of treatment. I suspect dipoles are trickier than standard box speakers, because you want to preserve some of the rear wave, but too much of it over-energized my relatively small room (17' x 22', of which 12' x 17' is set up as my relatively symmetric listening space). However, full absorption on the front wall effectively turned my listening room into a giant pair of headphones--weird sounding and not very enjoyable. In the end, I found that ASC StudioTraps (a tube trap on a stand) and SoundPanels provided a good blend of absorption with some diffusion. If you want to see a ridiculous installation of ASC traps + Magnepan speakers, check this out: http://www.geocities.com/jimtranr/soundroom.html

I love GIK products. The D1 panels are great, and you can take them a step further by painting them for aesthetics and applying constrained layer damping and/or stuffing the cavity with acoustic foam (I did both). When I tap on them, they resonate like the wall behind them. The tri-traps are personally one of my favorite products... simple to set up and very effective! One note -- I found the stock canvas to cause some reflection at high frequenies. If you're ordering 244 or 242 panels for first reflection points, I'd go with the GoM cloth upgrade.

Hope that helps! If you've got normal box speakers or are setting up a home theater, your job will be much much easier.

-- Nils

jimtranr · « **Reply #12 on:** 28 Apr 2008, 04:53 pm »

I agree, Nils...it looks totally ridiculous.

Nils · « **Reply #13 on:** 28 Apr 2008, 06:42 pm »

Oh, hi Jim.

Hope you didn't read that wrong. "Ridiculous" in the "expensive and obsessive awesomeness" sense of the word. Frankly, I'm in awe of your room, and it'd be something to transplant the setup I've got into your room. Or Mike Lavigne's barn. *sigh*

-- Nils

jimtranr · « **Reply #14 on:** 28 Apr 2008, 07:26 pm »

No problem. I gathered that's what you meant, and your post triggered a huge laugh.

Jim

some young guy · « **Reply #15 on:** 1 May 2008, 04:11 am »

Okay, I received my GIK order today...

I spent an hour or so experimenting with height, speaker placement-fine tuning (not much to do after implementing Bryan's recommendations) and WOW! My system was no slouch to begin with, but the balance, articulation, delineation, decay, micro-detail... I've witnessed improvements in every area. I even dragged a neighbor over who happens to be composer of classical music, to listen and give his impressions. He was floored. He said he hasn't ever heard instruments sound as real on a stereo. He said that the piano on one recording sounded exactly like it does when he is sitting, playing it. He was blown away by the snare drum, the trumpets, the violins... he wants to come back next week. I'm extremely pleased.

Now all I have to do is convince my (generally very supportive) wife. She came home and took one look...

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #16 on:** 1 May 2008, 04:28 am »

Quote from: some young guy on 1 May 2008, 04:11 am

Okay, I received my GIK order today...

I spent an hour or so experimenting with height, speaker placement-fine tuning (not much to do after implementing Bryan's recommendations) and WOW! My system was no slouch to begin with, but the balance, articulation, delineation, decay, micro-detail... I've witnessed improvements in every area. I even dragged a neighbor over who happens to be composer of classical music, to listen and give his impressions. He was floored. He said he hasn't ever heard instruments sound as real on a stereo. He said that the piano on one recording sounded exactly like it does when he is sitting, playing it. He was blown away by the snare drum, the trumpets, the violins... he wants to come back next week. I'm extremely pleased.

Now all I have to do is convince my (generally very supportive) wife. She came home and took one look...

Nice !!! If you take care of the room (panels)....it will take care of you (better sound)....happy listening !!!

Glenn K · « **Reply #17 on:** 1 May 2008, 12:51 pm »

Quote from: some young guy on 1 May 2008, 04:11 am

Okay, I received my GIK order today...

I spent an hour or so experimenting with height, speaker placement-fine tuning (not much to do after implementing Bryan's recommendations) and WOW! My system was no slouch to begin with, but the balance, articulation, delineation, decay, micro-detail... I've witnessed improvements in every area. I even dragged a neighbor over who happens to be composer of classical music, to listen and give his impressions. He was floored. He said he hasn't ever heard instruments sound as real on a stereo. He said that the piano on one recording sounded exactly like it does when he is sitting, playing it. He was blown away by the snare drum, the trumpets, the violins... he wants to come back next week. I'm extremely pleased.

Now all I have to do is convince my (generally very supportive) wife. She came home and took one look...

You need to email me some pictures so I can put this comment on your web site. WOW and thank you so much for the kind words!!!!!!!!

Glenn

sts9fan · « **Reply #18 on:** 1 May 2008, 01:18 pm »

Mine are getting here tommorw!!!!!!!!!!! I am excited to see how they sound. I am not excited to see her reaction.......She is pretty kickass though and I bet I can keep two out all the time and stash two for listening time. I do have a secret weapon that if deployed correctly may be a winner. The weapon is Ani Difraco. All I do is make sure the first thing she hears out of the system is Ani and IF it sounds good we are half way there. "Honey doesn't Ani sound great??" Then I throw on the Primus and she has no chance. Ani softens up the barrier but Les is like kryptonite to her resistance.

Kris

poseidonsvoice · « **Reply #19 on:** 1 May 2008, 01:29 pm »

Quote from: some young guy on 1 May 2008, 04:11 am

Okay, I received my GIK order today...

I spent an hour or so experimenting with height, speaker placement-fine tuning (not much to do after implementing Bryan's recommendations) and WOW! My system was no slouch to begin with, but the balance, articulation, delineation, decay, micro-detail... I've witnessed improvements in every area. I even dragged a neighbor over who happens to be composer of classical music, to listen and give his impressions. He was floored. He said he hasn't ever heard instruments sound as real on a stereo. He said that the piano on one recording sounded exactly like it does when he is sitting, playing it. He was blown away by the snare drum, the trumpets, the violins... he wants to come back next week. I'm extremely pleased.

Now all I have to do is convince my (generally very supportive) wife. She came home and took one look...

Heh! Congrats! Now can you list your equipment, room size, etc...with a picture!

Happy listening

Best,
Anand.