[chenc]

Hi everyone,
  I just registered and this is my first post. Woohoo!

  I got rid of the CD player and I'm ready to get a computer DAC..! I am contemplating either buying a Benchmark DAC1 USB, or a regular DAC1 +
a used Monarchy DIP (with USB interface, superclock 3, and full mod) by EA.
 
  I noticed that the Monarchy DIP upsampler is crossed off, not sure what that means but I have the opportunity to buy a 2-yr old one at a reasonable price. So my questions....

1. What are the main difference between the Monarchy DIP with USB
   feature and the newest offramp turbo 2?
2. Should I bother to go with the DIP or turbo 2 instead of getting a
    stock DAC1-USB? I mean, the later costs less, but I wonder the earlier
    sounds significantly better?

Thanks in advance,

Tim

[The Computer Audiophile]

Hey Tim - Welcome to the world of computer audio. You'll never go back to a physical disc player again!

[giantsteps]

Hi everyone,
  I just registered and this is my first post. Woohoo!

  I got rid of the CD player and I'm ready to get a computer DAC..! I am contemplating either buying a Benchmark DAC1 USB, or a regular DAC1 +
a used Monarchy DIP (with USB interface, superclock 3, and full mod) by EA.
 
  I noticed that the Monarchy DIP upsampler is crossed off, not sure what that means but I have the opportunity to buy a 2-yr old one at a reasonable price. So my questions....

1. What are the main difference between the Monarchy DIP with USB
   feature and the newest offramp turbo 2?
2. Should I bother to go with the DIP or turbo 2 instead of getting a
    stock DAC1-USB? I mean, the later costs less, but I wonder the earlier
    sounds significantly better?

Thanks in advance,

Tim


quote]


Not sure where you're coming from but from a musician's perspective and........if you truly love music with all its emotional impact on your daily lives and wonder why that glassy 2 dimensional sound is getting on your nerves............welcome back to the world of vinyl!




 Frank

[richidoo]

Welcome to the AC family, Tim!

I like using computer transport, easy access to the tunes! I use a DAC after my Squeezebox with good results.
Rich

[audioengr]

Hi everyone,
  I just registered and this is my first post. Woohoo!

  I got rid of the CD player and I'm ready to get a computer DAC..! I am contemplating either buying a Benchmark DAC1 USB, or a regular DAC1 +
a used Monarchy DIP (with USB interface, superclock 3, and full mod) by EA.
 
  I noticed that the Monarchy DIP upsampler is crossed off, not sure what that means but I have the opportunity to buy a 2-yr old one at a reasonable price. So my questions....

1. What are the main difference between the Monarchy DIP with USB
   feature and the newest offramp turbo 2?

There is only so much that can be done with a modded unit like this.  The USB interface is an older one with Superclock3.  The new Off-Ramp Turbo 2 with Superclock4 will outperform it significantly.  The DIP upsamples the data using the CS8420, which is not the best upsampler.  The Turbo 2 does not change the data.  You will still need a DAC with either.

2. Should I bother to go with the DIP or turbo 2 instead of getting a
    stock DAC1-USB? I mean, the later costs less, but I wonder the earlier
    sounds significantly better?

If you need a DAC, then the DAC-1 USB is an inexpensive choice.  With a few mods, including a Superclock4 for the upsampler it is very good.  However, in order to get a smooth fatigue-free sound from it quite a few mods are required at some expense. If you have never experienced a decent outboard DAC, it will probably make you very happy.

The Turbo 2 and a standard DAC-1 is excellent, but unless you go for the I2S mods, it will still need a Superclock4 in the DAC-1 upsampler circuit to sound good.  This means that you will be paying for two Superclock's, one in the Turbo 2 and one in the DAC-1.  Not very wise, but it does give you more flexibility for compatibility with future DAC's.

Therefore, I would recommend first, the DAC-1 with I2S interface and Off-Ramp I2S ($500 + $990)

and secondly, the DAC-1 USB with upgraded clock to Superclock4 ($450)

If you add the Minimum mods and Upgrade ($450) to either of the above, they will be quite marvelous.

Another advantage of having the I2S interface on the DAC-1 is that you can later add a Pace-Car reclocker driven by the WiFi server of your choice.  This is even better SQ than the Off-Ramp.

Steve N.

[chenc]

Thank you all for the reply!

Thanks for the detailed answer, Steve. Do you feel the latop to Monarchy + stock DAC1 combo has a clear improvement over laptop to the stock DAC1 USB?

I'm tempted to go with IS2 + mod for a DAC1 but then it voids the 5-yr warranty right out.
 

[audioengr]

Thank you all for the reply!

Thanks for the detailed answer, Steve. Do you feel the latop to Monarchy + stock DAC1 combo has a clear improvement over laptop to the stock DAC1 USB?

I'm tempted to go with IS2 + mod for a DAC1 but then it voids the 5-yr warranty right out.
 

Since the Monarchy has a Superclock in it, it will probably be a bit better for clarity, but the improved op-amps in the DAC-1 USB may offset this.  It's all about musicality.

The DAC-1 USB with Superclock4 is still the best solution for the money. Get this one and then mod it later after you tire of it.  However, by that time I may not be modding anything anymore.

BTW, I am planning a simpler DAC prior to the Formula One.  Considering the name "Daytona".  This one will have manual volume control and use my new OEM USB module.  It will have I2S (so you can use Pace-Car), S/PDIF and USB inputs.  RCA and XLR outs.  It will not be in a pretty chassis, but will come in under $2000.  It will compete with Benchmark, Bel Canto, PS Audio, Lavry and Wavelength.  This one will be ready for intro at RMAF.

Steve N.

[chenc]

Thank you all for the reply!

Thanks for the detailed answer, Steve. Do you feel the latop to Monarchy + stock DAC1 combo has a clear improvement over laptop to the stock DAC1 USB?

I'm tempted to go with IS2 + mod for a DAC1 but then it voids the 5-yr warranty right out.
 

Since the Monarchy has a Superclock in it, it will probably be a bit better for clarity, but the improved op-amps in the DAC-1 USB may offset this.  It's all about musicality.

The DAC-1 USB with Superclock4 is still the best solution for the money. Get this one and then mod it later after you tire of it.  However, by that time I may not be modding anything anymore.

BTW, I am planning a simpler DAC prior to the Formula One.  Considering the name "Daytona".  This one will have manual volume control and use my new OEM USB module.  It will have I2S (so you can use Pace-Car), S/PDIF and USB inputs.  RCA and XLR outs.  It will not be in a pretty chassis, but will come in under $2000.  It will compete with Benchmark, Bel Canto, PS Audio, Lavry and Wavelength.  This one will be ready for intro at RMAF.

Steve N.

The Daytona sounds like fun, and is within my budget, but how soon will it be available?
Also, how long is the wait for a DAC1 USB with superclock 4 with minimum mods?

And..the superclock4 works with all the digital inputs, not just the USB, correct?

Thanks again,
Tim

[audioengr]

The Daytona sounds like fun, and is within my budget, but how soon will it be available?

Late summer I hope.

Also, how long is the wait for a DAC1 USB with superclock 4 with minimum mods?

Mods have about 15-18 weeks backlog right now.

And..the superclock4 works with all the digital inputs, not just the USB, correct?

Yes, the SC in the DAC-1 works with all inputs.

Steve N.

[chenc]

Wow, Steve, that's some serious waiting list  !
How do I get on that list?
Have you measured jitter level of a DAC1 USB with Superclock4 + minimum mod? Stock DAC1 USB is in the 100's ps range according to Stereophile's review.

Tim

[audioengr]

Wow, Steve, that's some serious waiting list  !
How do I get on that list?
Have you measured jitter level of a DAC1 USB with Superclock4 + minimum mod? Stock DAC1 USB is in the 100's ps range according to Stereophile's review.

Tim

I need a purchase to put you on the list.

I have not compared the jitter spectra of the stock DAC-1 to one that has Superclock4 in it.  Need a RF spectrum analyzer for this and I dont have one.  I just know that it sounds a lot better.  All my customers report the same.  These jitter numbers must be taken with grain of salt.  I can plainly hear the difference.  Much better clarity, intelligibility and focus means lower jitter.

Steve N.

[gerald porzio]

What do mfgs. have against purchasing test gear? I guess accomodation pricing isn't available for measurement puppies.

[audioengr]

What do mfgs. have against purchasing test gear? I guess accomodation pricing isn't available for measurement puppies.

It's expensive.  I dont have much margin built into my product pricing, and I put much of the revenue back into the business.  I have not had any vacation for 6-7 years now.  When was your last vacation?

I need a new scope for around $3K and I cannot even afford this.  Designing and prototyping new products costs a lot of money.  Just to get a small proto run of boards built (20), it is $500.  New front panels and backpanels in small quantities cost $800.  Putting ANY small board into limited automated assembly costs around $20K for setup and parts. 

I would rather spend the money on automated assembly to get my order backlog down to 2 weeks rather than 5 months.  If you are a customer, wouldn't you want this instead of $10K of new test equipment for me???

Steve N.

[chenc]

Hi Steve,
  I see your point. But maybe it's not very scientific to claim lowered jitter while not having measured jitter level? Though you did say it's all about musicality.

[audioengr]

Hi Steve,
  I see your point. But maybe it's not very scientific to claim lowered jitter while not having measured jitter level? Though you did say it's all about musicality.

I know the jitter is lower, because this is all that is changing, nothing else.

Steve N.

[PLMONROE]

Hi Steve, I too had to wait an agonizing 5+ long months to get my PaceCar, which I have now had in my system for some two months. There is no question that music with it in the system sounds markedly better. I think so, my wife thinks so, as do all our friends. Now whether the improvement is due to it reducing jitter or due to you filling the unit with purple fairy doo doo, I don't know (and don't really care). What I do know is that it sure improves the sound! Keep up the good work.

[audioengr]

Hi Steve, I too had to wait an agonizing 5+ long months to get my PaceCar, which I have now had in my system for some two months. There is no question that music with it in the system sounds markedly better. I think so, my wife thinks so, as do all our friends. Now whether the improvement is due to it reducing jitter or due to you filling the unit with purple fairy doo doo, I don't know (and don't really care). What I do know is that it sure improves the sound! Keep up the good work.

Thanks, Paul.  I'm running as fast as I can.  This year, backlog should improve when I outsource some assembly.  Hopefully, not too many DOA's.

Steve N.

[chenc]

Hi Steve,
  I just got the Monarchy. I wonder which driver I need for it to work with Vista?

[audioengr]

Hi Steve,
  I just got the Monarchy. I wonder which driver I need for it to work with Vista?

Go to m-audio.com and download the latest Transit driver.

Steve N.

[chenc]

I've spent a few hours with the DAC1 USB both direct connect and via the Monarchy DIP (with Kimber D60). I much prefer the Monarchy, it's simply more musical. Don't care too much for the DAC1's USB I think it sounds too digital. I think I'll exchange for a regular DAC1 and use the Monarchy, until the Monarchy breaks, then I'll check back to see what you will be offering then. Thanks for the help Steve.