[nrenter]

I think Early B.'s suggestion is a good one, but I think you'll need to include sub-categories. $1,000 for a pair of speakers may be perceived as "affordable", while $1,000 for a pair of interconnects may not.

[TONEPUB]

often times, what's affordable in the eye and pocketbook of the beholder.

Jerry Seinfeld once told me about one of his Porsches that he "stole" for
1.6 million and it "only" cost another two million to restore it the way
he wanted!

[pbrstreetgang]

often times, what's affordable in the eye and pocketbook of the beholder.

Jerry Seinfeld once told me about one of his Porsches that he "stole" for
1.6 million and it "only" cost another two million to restore it the way
he wanted!

Porsche is my favorite car company and I would prefer a Porsche to any other but no Porsche or car is worth 1.6 million on its merits alone. Collectibility or investment or rareness is one thing but 1.6 million a Porshe is not!

[Affordable$$Audio]

Jeff:
Glad to hear you survived CES once again.  Of course to Jerry Seinfeld that was just one week's episode. 

Nrenter:
I'm glad that we have cleared up what you were suggesting.  To me, one of the things I wish there were more of is audio clubs around the country.  As much fun as forums can be, nothing beats getting together in person on a regular basis.

[Mister Pig]

often times, what's affordable in the eye and pocketbook of the beholder

Hi Jeff

Ah thats the politically correct answer to the question. In some ways its similar to the answer that "there is no absolute truth in the world". Of course thats an answer to a philospohical question, but both answers are somewhat related.

The question must be viewed in regards to: What is affordable to the majority of the audio enthusiasts who care enough about music to spend their hard earned money for an audio system. Sure there are some people who can afford to spend tens of thousands of dollars on a system, but I suspect that is the exception istead of the norm. The question is aimed towards those who make up the norm, not the exceptions. And certainly not Jerry Seinfield.

Regards
John Hoffman

[Early B.]

often times, what's affordable in the eye and pocketbook of the beholder.

True, but let us consider the target market for the AA e-zine -- it is clearly those of us who probably feel that $5,000 for an amp is not affordable. Is $2,000 too much? How about $1,500 or $1,000? I dunno, but it would be nice to find out.

I subscribe to Stereophile, but the vast majority of the gear they review is too steep for my budget, even at used prices. And I'll bet that most of their readers are just like me -- unable to support the magazine's advertisers. The AA e-zine is unique because it reviews gear for the common man. I think it would be interesting to understand more definitively what the common man considers affordable audio.

[pbrstreetgang]

I get your point about answering the question every audio company would kill to know but the simple truth is there is nothing "normal" about what we audiophiles do or how we act. Most of our "affliction" is we are drawn to the emotional aspect of music- hence I see no metric to ascertain a baseline of projected spending of the audiophile consumer. We are outliers on the fringe of a market and it is a super small niche. Hell living in Austin "The Live Music Capitol of the World" most of my musician friends listen to music on little more than an ipod or car radio. also of all my hobbies audio has the widest swath of people over all races and financial means. A dealer I walked into ance told me a mailman saved for years and walked in buying Wilson Maxx and big tube ARC monos. That emotional commitment for a non need product cant fit a metric.

[Zero]

I see this job as fairly straight forward.  Just follow a few solid guidelines;

- Never bring in a component you cannot properly accommodate. Even if the opportunity is there. Even if it is really cool.
- Stick with what you know. Never review a component that is in a class you have little to no experience with. Of course you'll think its the best thing since sliced bread if you've never owned anything like it.
- Keep in constant touch with the manufacturer during your time with the unit. At least once a week or two. Give updates. Compliments. Concerns.

Follow those simple guidelines, and this whole gig just boils down to your ability to accurately assess and describe the performance of said component. It's all about capturing the character, general performance, what it can do, what it can't do, and where it fits into the market.

I think we sometimes over complicate things and look for something that just isn't attainable. After all, in the ideal world; any individual that recognizes themselves as a bona fide reviewer would have at least one room built strictly for listening/evaluating. The real snazzy one's would have two different rooms, one big, and one small, to properly accommodate a wider variety of gear. This individual would also run a multitude of systems. At least one system will have to be worth 100k. After all, how can a reviewers word be taken seriously if their reference point is less than the cost of a Viper GTS? They would also need half a dozen entire systems to celebrate variety. SET. Full Range. Horn. Panel. Etc..  Oh, and we'd just have to run a truly cheap (erm.. affordable) system that shows one is still humble and have not lost 'their roots'. 

One things for sure --  unless you A) Use this gig as a way of making money or are B) independently wealthy - the above ain't happening.  That said; I am taking donations..   

Oh yeah, as for this affordable thing. I can't stand this word. Sorry, Mark. It's too broad, too ill defined, and has a negative connotation to it - especially when dealing with exotic sundry electronics. Still, the bulk of Affordable Audio's focus seems to be at the 2k price point and under. Affordable is all well and good, but a reference point needs to be established. I'm workin' on it. Poor Mark, I think you're gunna flip out of your chair when you get THAT e-mail.

[Early B.]

I think what would be cool is for reviewers to have a core list of CDs, vinyl used for reviewers -- samples from all major genres. Or perhaps a handful of "audio review CDs" with different types of music and different ways the music has been recorded.

 

[Mister Pig]

Back to the question of what is "affordable." Well, we know it's tough to put a price range on it. We also know that some things obviously won't make the affordable list, such as a $5,000 amp because most of us don't have the financial means to purchase it.

IMO, once you hit the $1,000 threshold (new or used) for a single component (pair of speakers, amp, CDP, integrated amp, etc.), then any items priced beyond this point quickly begin to move further away from what most of us would consider "affordable." 

I suggest running a poll in the next issue of the e-zine and ask readers what they think "affordable" is. It would also be interesting to ask readers what their audio system is worth on the used market. And we can ask them what's the most money they ever paid for a piece of audio gear. Readers can be linked to this forum to respond to the questions.

This has been discussed inside of A$$A at one time. I don't believe we had the proper venue to do a poll properly. Now that the A$$A forum has been well established at AC, I think this idea should be revisited. I personally think a poll would give A$$A the proper insight to know what product categories would be well received by the readership.

Regards
John Hoffman

[TONEPUB]

often times, what's affordable in the eye and pocketbook of the beholder

Hi Jeff

Ah thats the politically correct answer to the question. In some ways its similar to the answer that "there is no absolute truth in the world". Of course thats an answer to a philospohical question, but both answers are somewhat related.

The question must be viewed in regards to: What is affordable to the majority of the audio enthusiasts who care enough about music to spend their hard earned money for an audio system. Sure there are some people who can afford to spend tens of thousands of dollars on a system, but I suspect that is the exception istead of the norm. The question is aimed towards those who make up the norm, not the exceptions. And certainly not Jerry Seinfield.

Regards
John Hoffman

I don't think it's politically correct at all.  I earn a very modest living, yet my system and record collection are worth
more than my house.  That's my priority and I realize that not many people share that.  So, what I consider affordable
is way different than someone way above me or below me on the income scale.  I have friends that make 10-50 times
what I do and they would never spend the money I do on hifi...

It is all relative!

[Early B.]

 I earn a very modest living, yet my system and record collection are worth
more than my house. 

Damn! Forget about the gear -- post a picture of your house.

"A very modest living" is another relative phrase. I don't have any friends that make 10 to 50 times more money than me, so you must be doing quite well.

[TONEPUB]

I just happen to know some pretty wealthy people...

Don't know how it happened.  A couple of my buddies from college did incredibly
well and they introduced me to a lot of their friends.  So, I get to go to some
pretty weird parties now and then.  Those dudes have watches that are worth
more than my house!

[ToddArthur]

I agree with Jeff, some people with money don't understand what good sound is or appreciate it so they won't spend money on it.  The mass media does a great job informing us that a Mercedes, Porsche or Rolex are valuable and should to be sought after.  Music in our society is not nearly as well valued, just look at the languishing school music programs across the country.  Unfortunately what is evident, is where our society places (misplaces)  its values.  $50 K for a BMW, sure! $50 K for a stereo system, you've got to be nuts!  Enlightened souls that appreciate music keep me doing what I am doing,  finding the affordable (I like the word) audio jewels anyone can aspire to own.