SongTower Impressions (final installment 3/4/08)

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DMurphy

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    • SalkSound
Re: SongTower Impressions (updated 1/28/08)
« Reply #60 on: 22 Feb 2008, 12:56 am »
Just to follow up a little on what Jim said.  People (including a very generous member of this site) send me commercial speakers all the time, usually for a crossover revision.  I've worked on, or am working on, 4 just during the last two weeks.   In total, I've had a chance to measure and play with dozens of designs, ranging from mass market producers, low-to-mid-level internet companies, and some some very upscale brick and mortar units.  Without exception, all of them run the tweeter hotter than I have on any of the Salk designs.  And also in the vast majority of cases, there is a depression in the lower treble response, usually due to less-than-optimal crossover optimization suffering from  poor phase matching between the woofer and tweeter.  I think the main difference in sound Salk owners are hearing is a more open, integrated presentation in the upper midrange, lower treble.  If a "bad" recording sounds bad--and perhaps worse than on some other speakers--it's probably because there are recording problems in that frequency range, rather than (or in addition to) problems further up.

prpixel

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Re: SongTower Impressions (updated 1/28/08)
« Reply #61 on: 22 Feb 2008, 03:21 pm »
DM,

You were right about the Alpine; I didn't car for it.  It was all over the place and enough with the cow bells.  Also, I dozed off a few times; 52 minutes without a break. 

--------

Just so I don't totally steal the thread, I have a pair of custom finish Paldao Songtowers, with matching center, on order for a friend.  I can't wait to get my hands on them and do a comparision with my current speakers.  If they are as good as everybody says they are, I might be ordering a pair for myself.

BrianM

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Re: SongTower Impressions (updated 1/28/08)
« Reply #62 on: 22 Feb 2008, 04:02 pm »
It was all over the place and enough with the cow bells.


What do you have against cowbells?

Quote
Also, I dozed off a few times; 52 minutes without a break.

I might find a piece all over the place, too, if I kept waking up during it.   :wink:

Not to steal the thread myself either, I'm sure the SongTowers would do an excellent job of reproducing the cowbells heard in certain passages of the Alpine Symphony.  (In the alps, there are cows, you see...they wear cowbells...Buehler...Buehler...)

DMurphy

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    • SalkSound
Re: SongTower Impressions (updated 1/28/08)
« Reply #63 on: 22 Feb 2008, 04:12 pm »
DM,

"You were right about the Alpine; I didn't car for it.  It was all over the place and enough with the cow bells.  Also, I dozed off a few times; 52 minutes without a break."

Hope you didn't sleep through the wind machine.  That's my favorite.  Some composers just needed a good editor. Great moments--terrible hours. 

I'll be very interested in your take on the ST's and particularly the Song Center.   


ricmon

Re: SongTower Impressions (updated 1/28/08)
« Reply #64 on: 22 Feb 2008, 04:42 pm »
I had a similar experience a few years back.  I had just finished the first pair of HT3's and was playing a classical recording.  I heard what sounded like amplifier hiss in the background.  When I stopped playback, the sound disappeared - obviously not amplifier hiss. 

What was it? I finally figured out it was the air conditioning system in the concert hall.  Now I can plainly hear HVAC systems during low volume passages in many classical recordings.  It doesn't bother me since I now know it is not my equipment.  It kind of adds to the realism.  But I do recall being very annoyed by it the first time I heard it.

- Jim

This sounds more like tape hiss to me.  I hear it all the time on certain lp's.  I have learned to ignore it though.

jsalk

Re: SongTower Impressions (updated 1/28/08)
« Reply #65 on: 23 Feb 2008, 11:53 am »
This sounds more like tape hiss to me.  I hear it all the time on certain lp's.  I have learned to ignore it though.

As a former recording engineer, I am quite tuned into tape hiss (which I also hear on many older recordings).  HVAC sounds are quite different and do give you a feel for the recording venue.  I just never noticed it with less revealing speakers.

- Jim

Boybees

Re: SongTower Impressions (final installment 3/4/08)
« Reply #66 on: 4 Mar 2008, 07:26 pm »
Here's the final chapter of my SongTower mini-blog . . .

Leave it to the treble percussion instruments (cymbals, high-hats, triangles, bells, etc) to expose the weaknesses of a digital-sourced audio system. CDs have never quite cut it for me. I went through several CD players trying to find one that could do cymbals et al. justice. Not until I moved to computer-based audio (via my battery-powered Red Wine Audio Squeezebox 3 playing files off a hard drive) did I discover reproduction of treble that I could live with over the long term. The SB3 doesn’t quite capture the magic of my old vinyl-based system, but that’s another story. It comes closer than any other digital source I’ve heard.

That said, I presented the Salk SongTowers with a treble challenge: “You’re Vibing Me” from the album “Largo” by pianist Brad Mehldau (with Jorge Rossy on drums and Larry Grenadier on bass).



Produced by Jon Brion (one of my favorite “Midas touch” guys in the studio), this track bursts with well-recorded drum kit. The detail and staging of the crash and splash cymbals is so exquisite, one can almost discern their diameter (or at least their relative size).

But it’s the swish of Rossy’s brushed snare that might be the Waterloo of a tweeter (and crossover). If source, amplifications and speakers aren’t singing in key, the brush strokes sound like so much white noise. The SongTowers, I’m happy to report, were up to the challenge. I heard nothing but the delicate play of wire tips across the taught drum skin.

I’ve owned the SongTowers for three months now, and the high-end response of these speakers consistently brings a smile to my face. Never too bright, never harsh, never thin – just organic and natural sounding.

Now that I’ve covered the bass, midrange and treble performance of the STs: how to tie it all together?

With a track familiar to many audiophiles: Ben Harper’s “Gold To Me” from the album “Fight For Your Mind”. There’s an authenticity to this record that I love. The SongTowers tap into it, and release a wealth of details: a high-hat accent throughout that’s crystal clear and locked into place in the stereo image, triangle strikes that are tiny pure bells, the raw edges of Ben’s voice, the steely tones of his guitar.



The SongTowers respond with aplomb to amplifier power – they don’t shy away from it, they soak it up and give back the force of the music with all of its dynamics. Not a hint of compression as the volume goes up. Even at higher SPLs, the nuances of Ben’s performance ring true. You hear not only the singing, you hear the emotional subtext.

A thought in closing: it gets better than this? These outstanding loudspeakers are the low-end of Jim’s line? It’s hard to imagine what spending twice as much on Salk speakers would deliver. I’m thinking now that with the SongTowers, I’ve taken my source and amp as far as they will go.  To appreciate the virtues of Jim’s bigger and more expensive speakers, I’ll need to move up the ladder with those two components.

So be it. In this game, the next upgrade is usually just over the horizon . . .
« Last Edit: 4 Mar 2008, 09:57 pm by Boybees »

TheChairGuy

Re: SongTower Impressions (final installment 3/4/08)
« Reply #67 on: 4 Mar 2008, 07:53 pm »
A very helpful and insightful review, thank you  :thumb:

John

Big Red Machine

Re: SongTower Impressions (final installment 3/4/08)
« Reply #68 on: 4 Mar 2008, 08:08 pm »
I can appreciate your equipment running out of steam.  As an owner of HT3's and V3's I find my equipment is not up to snuff quite often and Jim has cost me a lotta dough trying to maximize the outputs of my speakers!!