[opnly bafld]

 A review of SP Tech Timepiece Mini's

This will take me much longer to write than it will you to read and I could be listening to my new speakers. 
 

Room: @12' x 14' spare bedroom.
Gear: secondary system with an NAD C521BEE CD player with no name IC's to a Magnum Audio IA200 integrated amp (100w/ch 8ohms) with W** M*** car stereo 12ga speaker wire.
Speakers are on 28" tall subwoofers which are not being used.

The front baffle of these speakers is absolutely beautiful.
I have not a camera, so this will have to do.
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=43286.0

Soundstage/Imaging
The soundstage is moderately wide and quite deep, when I was playing the Sam T. Stereophile track I looked out the window because I thought he was in my neighbors yard, 30 ft. behind the speakers.
Instruments are the right size, very distinct from one another, and easy to visualize on the stage.
Lead vocals are dead center (unless recorded otherwise) and image height seems to be consistent with the recording.
Bob is right, these speakers disappear (like mini monitors half their size).

Tone/Frequency balance
The treble has shimmer and zing with cymbals and bells, but it is never shrill and to these ears it is neither too bright or dark.
The midrange will make every amp in the house sound like a SET.
Not just any SET, but the ones that are liquidy without ever being syrupy.
The midrange also sounds as if it is of one piece, whole, not two parts, no metal cone/fabric dome disintegration here.
The bass is well defined (after a few hours of break in), the nuances in a bass line (acoustic or electric) are as easy to hear as those in a good singer's voice.
I have been listening to music that for the most part only goes down to @40hz, maybe 35, so I was thinking about what to say regarding Bob's comment about a sub being optional, I was coming to the conclusion that with about 90% of my music I could probably live without a sub.
I have not used a test disc and SPL meter yet to check how low the Mini's go in my room, but if their usable output isn't enough for you, you are more than likely an incurable basshead or HT guy and already have several subs scattered about the house.
Looks like Bob is right again, a sub(s) is optional.

Details/Details
I think I know at least part of the reason Bob was able to (give these speakers away) provide such high quality construction and sound at such a low price...... he left the crossovers out, I mean try as I might I cannot hear the x-o (800hz), when I close my eyes I hear one driver, but when I open my eyes I see two drivers.
Which I believe leads me to the details......you hear so much detail with the Mini's, details that many a lesser speaker buries in the soundscape, but the Mini's don't put a spotlight on the details and push the details forward into your face like some speakers.
The details in music are just there with these speakers, they aren't hiding and yet they aren't trying to make themselves known either.

A good gage of how much I like the Timepiece Mini's is that I don't think I would sell them if somebody offered me twice what I paid for them. Usually when selling speakers I get about half of what I paid for them, but I still sell them.

Lin

[groovybassist]

Lin:  Thanks for sharing your thoughts.  I've had my Mini's for about a week and have spent some time listening over the last few days.  Here are my thoughts:

Packaging:  Bob uses a simple, very snug, very effective packing system.  Why other mfgs. can't do the same is beyond me.  The speakers come sandwiched snugly between 6 pieces of styrofoam (looks like about 1.5" thick), with sheets of pressed fiberboard outside the styrofoam on all sides of the box.  Strong, simple, and very effective.  I think it would be extremely difficult to experience any shipping damage.

Construction:  The cabs are very heavy and solid, and the CNC machining on the baffle is very cool.  Every one of the first three people who saw them commented that they were "cool looking speakers."

Sound:  I didn't spend any time at all on setup - I just plunked 'em down, toed 'em in so they're facing almost directly at me and plugged 'em in.  While my Nait5i isn't the most powerful amp in the world, it has no problem taking control of the woofers and driving the Mini's to more than adequate volume cleanly.  The first thing that will hit you over the head is the disappearing act - sound simply does not seem to be emanating from the Mini's, unless the engineer has hard-panned something to the left or the right.  I concur that soundstage width is moderate (although my set-up has the speakers relatively close together as they're in our main living area), but depth is top-notch and so is the height (you won't find yourself staring at the floor as if you were in the balcony at a live performance).  Things like vocals, acoustic guitars, brass and piano are particularly well served by the lower x-over to the tweeter.  I'm definitely hearing details in recording I hadn't heard before, but agree they're not "in your face", but are just part of the organic whole being presented.  I'll be spending some time over the coming weeks optimizing the bass performance (I use Stereophile's Test CD 3 and an SPL meter) and letting break-in take its course, so I'll have more to say on the bass later.  It's very good right out of the box, but I'm sure my set-up and the fact that we're a suspended wood floor are compromising it a bit right now.

Overall, I'm impressed!

[lonewolfny42]

Thanks for the comments.....glad to hear your both enjoying the Mini-TP's...
Question....Are these the first SP Tech speakers that you have heard ? Thanks...

[opnly bafld]

Thanks for the comments.....glad to hear your both enjoying the Mini-TP's...
Question....Are these the first SP Tech speakers that you have heard ? Thanks...

Yes Sir

Lin

[groovybassist]

Lonewolf:  Yes, they are the first SP Tech's I've heard.  The lower x-over does yield a different presentation than typical loudspeakers, so it'll take me some time to come completely to grips with it.  I've been into audio for 20+ years, and owned many different speakers, but the lowest x-over was probably in the 2khz range.  I did get to hear Amphion's Argon2, which crosses over at 1.2khz.  I liked them a lot, which is why I was willing to take the plunge and order the Mini's.

-Mike  

[jfreeman373]

If you move them farther apart you won't lose your center image and the width of soundstage will be huge. You can get them closer to the side walls than most speakers and still have a great center image. Just add a little more toe in for flavor. Try to make sure they are both the same distance away from your ears as closely as possible.  The better you get the time arrival matched between the 2 speakers the better the soundstaging becomes. Don't attribute center image shift left to right to the toe in...put your attention of time arrival front to back for that one. Then toe in accordingly for high frequency air to accommodate the spread between them. You'll like the results. I usually end up with the "in your head effect" when I spread them so far apart and sit in close. It's pretty cool. And then to have the center vocal still be right in the center? What the....?

[opnly bafld]

I concur that soundstage width is moderate (although my set-up has the speakers relatively close together as they're in our main living area),

My assessment of soundstage width could also be setup (or lack of) related.

Lin

[lonewolfny42]

Thanks Guys....

[Nick B]

Thanks for posting. Glad to hear initial impressions are good and welcome to the "SP Club"! I love my Mundorf 2.1's. Keep fine tuning the setup and enjoy 

[Double Ugly]

A copy/paste of my response in the other thread:

I think I know at least part of the reason Bob was able to (give these speakers away) provide such high quality construction and sound at such a low price......  he left the crossovers out, I mean try as I might I cannot hear the x-o (800hz), when I close my eyes I hear one driver, but when I open my eyes I see two drivers. 

Welcome to the crossover-less 2-way speaker club, Lin. 

For years, I've been telling anyone and everyone who'll listen (and some who won't ) that SP Technology speakers have the least apparent crossover I've ever NOT heard!  I'm happy to see you appreciate what I believe is perhaps the best aspect of a phenomenal design.

Congratulations!   

[ooheadsoo]

Regarding the soundstage width, I recommend these articles: http://www.regonaudio.com/What%20Can%20and%20Cannot%20be%20Expected%20from%20Stereo.html
http://www.regonaudio.com/Directional%20Hearing%20How%20To%20Listen%20to%20Stereo.htm

I think a large factor is the random phase of room reflections that create that wider than the speakers soundstage.  I have read of some situations where they actually toed the speakers outwards towards the walls to create this effect.  I think dipoles also use this effect to their advantage, with the relatively large but random phase contribution of the rear wave, if this effect is what you are seeking.  REG actually encourages absorbing the rear wave in a dipole using room treatments.  In terms of high frequencies, the sptech way of controlled dispersion runs contrary to this trend, and the images should always technically be between the speakers unless for the reasons stated in that article regarding mic spacing or intentional qsound like phase effects.  The advantage of the waveguide (and dipoles) is that you can a little closer to the side walls because of the controlled dispersion.  Dipoles are even better in regards to side walls.

[phoenix_rising]

Thanks Lin,

much appreciated. Can't wait to get mine and put a review up myself.

phoenix

[Aether Audio]

opnly bafld & groovybassist,

Thanks guys for the great review!    I knew you'd like 'em.

As far as soundstage width goes, I'm not going to comment on that really as there is so much in the way of psycho-acoustics going on in any given setup.  Any speaker that offers low diffraction and excellent L/R frequency responce matching should offer good soundstaging capabilities.  As ooheadsoo has pointed out, sidewall reflections will have a great influence over the effect.  Also as jfreeman373 has demonstrated with our systems, you can pretty much create your own stage width by adjusting speaker spacing and toe-in... if you have the room width available to work with. 

Image depth and height are also affected by the above parameters, but they are a lot more sensitive to the potential of diffraction and other distortion artifacts to "mask" the effect.  This is because they don't have as much of the L/R phase steering cues that work to "drive" the effect.  As such, image depth and height are good indicators of just how accurate & resolving a speaker is - amongst other factors.

That leads me to the one issue I would like everyone that has heard our stuff and has become a "believer" (if you will) in our "gospel" ... to join with me in heralding to the masses.  ACCURACY!!!

Together we need to dispel the notion that permeates audiophilia... that accuracy = sterility, lifelessness & non-musicality.  BULLCRAP!  The present belief is that "excess" accuracy = excess detail = excess resolution = non-musicality & listening fatigue.  The fact is that excess high frequency distortion above 5kHz = excess "perceived" detail = excess "perceived" resolution =  sterility, lifelessness, non-musicality & listening fatigue.

If you eliminate high frequency distortion everything comes alive with detail and resolution... and an organic "musicality" that almost everyone is searching for but almost never experience.  There is no such thing as excess detail and resolution.  High accuracy = "detail when its there and none when it's not" = extreme resolution = extreme musicality and life-like reproduction.

opnly bafld pretty much sums it up:

The midrange will make every amp in the house sound like a SET.

How often do you hear that?

In fact, that was always the ongoing quest of "High-Fidelity" - at least in the early days.  Of course, that was back before so many self appointed "gurus" sprang up that had an excess of opinion and a deficit of knowledge. 

Back in those days - particularly in the professional recording world - every manufacturer was touting "accuracy."  The "pro's" interpreted that as meaning a flat frequency response, high power handling and (sometimes) some form of controlled dispersion - but that was it.  Few were looking at (and before the advent of computerized acoustic analysis) or even had the means to accurately measure high frequency distortion.  We do have the means now and whaddaya know... a lot of "so called" accurate speakers generate quite a bit of high frequency garbage.  So... in defense of the "gurus" I guess you'd say that's why this whole modern misconception of somehow accuracy being "bad" has come about in the first place.

I will tell you this much.  SP tech has always been about the fundamentals of sound reproduction and accuracy.  I have always adhered to the tenants of the "fathers" and persued improving the scientific fundamentals through optimizing the variables and observing the laws of physics.  Take a look at what we build... nothing but 2-way speakers!  Go back and read the old textbooks written by the founders of this science like "Baranek," etc.  They'll all tell you that in lieu of the perfect "one driver does everything" - the 2-way speaker is the best engineering compromise. 

Our products are all the end result of that thinking and those of you that have heard them have experienced the results of this approach yourselves.  "Ye shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free."  You now know the "truth," so on a certain level... it is now also your "responsibility" to "spread the gospel."

Obviously, all I can really do is ask for your help and in all actuality... I really don't "expect" anything.  You've "paid for your ticket" and deserve to "enjoy the show" accordingly - and nothing more.  But... if you're of a mind to hop on board, we can use all the help we can get.  In these days of much deception, this "gospel" is definitely a "tough sell."  I'm sure many of our audiophile "brothers" would appreciate their ultimate enlightenment.  I know we're trying to do our part.   Whether anybody ultimately buys SP Tech product or not, these are the principles we must all continue to pursue and promote.  Thanks for your help.

Have fun & enjoy!
-Bob

[mixsit]

That leads me to the one issue I would like everyone that has heard our stuff and has become a "believer" (if you will) in our "gospel" ... to join with me in heralding to the masses.  ACCURACY!!!

Together we need to dispel the notion that permeates audiophilia... that accuracy = sterility, lifelessness & non-musicality.  BULLCRAP!  The present belief is that "excess" accuracy = excess detail = excess resolution = non-musicality & listening fatigue.  The fact is that excess high frequency distortion above 5kHz = excess "perceived" detail = excess "perceived" resolution =  sterility, lifelessness, non-musicality & listening fatigue.

CAN I get a "Hey Now!   
Gospel for my ears!

Have fun & enjoy!
-Bob

I do, and I am!

[IronLion]

Does anybody know if the introductory price on Audiogon is still available on the Minis? 

[RodMCV]

It is advertised on agon right now so the ad price is true, knowing Bob.

[Double Ugly]

  You're one of the few recording professionals who's "gotten it", Wayne. 

Keep at it, my friend... eventually others will see the light via the superiority of your recordings! 

IronLion:  Don't think so... at least not the absurdly low AC intro price.  Selling brand new Timepiece Minis for $1349/pair was absolutely crazy IMHO, and those who picked 'em up at that price may have gotten themselves the deal of the century. 

FWIW, I'm pretty sure Bob was actually losing money on each and every pair sold at the introductory price.  Consequently, it's hard to blame the guy if he decides to stick to his guns re: the new price, especially considering the quality of the product.  At $2495, they're still a steal IMHO.

[RodMCV]

Hay Buddy-o Jim,

Thats what I mean, current ad.
Hope I didn't miss the spoke!
 

Rod

[mixsit]

  You're one of the few recording professionals who's "gotten it", Wayne. 

Keep at it, my friend... eventually others will see the light via the superiority of your recordings! 

Well, I'm only a part timer' there, but been doing it a long long time. Long enough to get it though.
But that's the easy part. 

[bhobba]

At $2495, they're still a steal IMHO.

They are - and the price can only go up as they get better known.  But even at the higher price I do urge potential customers to think about what they are getting.  First, you are dealing directly with the engineer that designs and builds them, an engineer committed to accuracy - not slick sales staff at some high end salon.  True, not all high end salons are like that, people like Karsten and Bill of Responce Audio, really know their stuff, but sorting the wheat from the chaff can be hard.  Secondly, I have read that audio gear typically sells for 10 times the cost of the parts.  Now if Bob is loosing at $1349 a pair, that would mean they should be selling for at least $13,490.  Only the Continuum 2.5 and Revelation MR-1 sell for more than that.  IMHO, Bobs speakers are a friggen bargain.  Go and listen to other speakers, and there are many fine ones available, but in terms of accuracy, and value for money, I believe you can't beat Bob's stuff, and believe me I have looked.  Of speakers that knowedgeabe reviewers like Jim Merod describe as among the finest on the planet, the Timepiece-mini would have to be the price/performance leader.

Rest assured, once I get my speakers, not only will I be posting a detailed review, I will be looking to have members of the Audiophile community in Brisbane over to hear what the fuss is about.  I would not be surprised if Bob got some more customers, and perhaps a distributor.

Thanks
Bill