What experiences have you had using upgraded power cord on phono preampl

fsimms · « **on:** 7 Dec 2007, 01:49 am »

I borrowed a friend's Virtual Dynamics Power 3 power cord and it made huge improvement on my TACT preamp. My friend said that it makes the most difference on the source. All the stuff comes into my preamp in digital form except for the vinyl. Should I buy an extra power cord for my Eastern Electric Phonostage?

What experiences have you had using an upgraded power cords on your phono preamp?

blakep · « **Reply #1 on:** 7 Dec 2007, 02:21 am »

My experience is that it is a worthwhile upgrade. I've used various power cords on different components over the past 5-6 years including the Cardas Golden, Blue Circle BC 62 and various DIY cords including the "Bob Crump" special based on Belden 19634/Volex cord and cords constructed with JPS in-wall cable.

I'm currently using DIY DH Labs cables (same cable as the DH Labs Power plus which retails at $200 and has received very positive reviews) on all my components, including an Aqvox Phono 2 CI phono stage. The DH Labs DIY can be done very inexpensively (about $60 for a 4 footer) with Marinco male and IEC. I have a cryo facility close by so I have also cryoed the cords I have in use which I feel is very worthwhile as well. The DH Labs does everything extremely well but is slightly warmer than neutral (which works great and was exactly what I was looking for in my system) but nowhere near as warm as the Cardas Golden. I think it's "the" cord for the money and reviews of the "factory" DH Labs suggest it holds its own with much more expensive cords (ie. $300-$500) and my experience would confirm this. It was a fairly significant upgrade to the stock cord which came with the Aqvox and I feel it is the best cable I've used, of both commercial and DIY offerings.

You could build one for your phono stage and if it didn't work out, you'll only be out $60. Chances are you'll find some place for it in your system. At 12 guage it is beefy enough to work quite well with power amps-I use one on my integrated and line conditioner as well.

woodsyi · « **Reply #2 on:** 7 Dec 2007, 12:54 pm »

I have tried a few cords on my Vinyl One: Signal Cable, Bolder, Verrastar and Black Sand to name a few. The difference was minute compared to the difference I got when I went from NS Sovtek to NOS Telefunken 12AX's. YMMV.

lcrim · « **Reply #3 on:** 7 Dec 2007, 03:14 pm »

I use Volex power chords on everything. I've been thinking about upgrading to maybe Signal Cables low end or Furutech's purple $100 low end but I remember when I changed to Volex from stock and the improvement was large but experimenting w/ others wasn't so much better as it was different. The Zu power cables also seem like a decent deal. PS Audio PC's look heavy duty but don't do as much as the very inexpensive Volex. I guess I'll stay with what I've got.

Dan_ed · « **Reply #4 on:** 7 Dec 2007, 03:16 pm »

I have had positive results upgrading power cords, but all power cords are not the same. So YMMV. It works well for me in part because my phono stage and preamp have separate power supplies.

For my system, the greatest change from a pc came when I added the right one to my amp. Bass control tightened up and the frequency extremes increased.

slbenz · « **Reply #5 on:** 7 Dec 2007, 03:50 pm »

Quote from: Dan_ed on 7 Dec 2007, 03:16 pm

I have had positive results upgrading power cords, but all power cords are not the same. So YMMV. It works well for me in part because my phono stage and preamp have separate power supplies.

For my system, the greatest change from a pc came when I added the right one to my amp. Bass control tightened up and the frequency extremes increased.

Same here. Greatest change was with the power amp. I am using Signal Cables throughout including my Jolida JD-9 phono preamp. Lower noise floor and smoother mids and highs going from the stock cord to Signal Cable's Digital PC for the Jolida.

Slbenz

fsimms · « **Reply #6 on:** 7 Dec 2007, 05:37 pm »

Quote

I have tried a few cords on my Vinyl One: Signal Cable, Bolder, Verrastar and Black Sand to name a few. The difference was minute compared to the difference I got when I went from NS Sovtek to NOS Telefunken 12AX's. YMMV

I agree that the smooth plate Telefunken 12AX7's are very good in a phono. That is what I have in my phonostage.

fsimms · « **Reply #7 on:** 7 Dec 2007, 06:22 pm »

Quote

Greatest change was with the power amp.

That is an interesting point. If I get a second PC then I can try it on the Amp and also on the phonostage. The will give me the info that I need for my system.

Thanks all for your comments

ricmon · « **Reply #8 on:** 7 Dec 2007, 06:29 pm »

Quote from: fsimms on 7 Dec 2007, 05:37 pm

Quote
I have tried a few cords on my Vinyl One: Signal Cable, Bolder, Verrastar and Black Sand to name a few. The difference was minute compared to the difference I got when I went from NS Sovtek to NOS Telefunken 12AX's. YMMV

I agree that the smooth plate Telefunken 12AX7's are very good in a phono. That is what I have in my phonostage.

Dido that

bacobits1 · « **Reply #9 on:** 7 Dec 2007, 10:25 pm »

As a matter of fact that is what brought me to change my PC's to all Signal "Magic" power cables. I had been a long time Cump/Volex/Asylum power cable user, that I made and had Cryoed. A very good cable for me for at least 6 years. The Magic is a heavy, 10ga, very stiff cable.

Bound for Sound did a review of the Signal Magic PC specifically on my EE Mini Max Phono Pre that he uses as a reference. Marty DeWolf compared them to some pretty high priced competition and liked the Magic PC cable best. I just picked up a used digital version for my CD and I like it. There are other discussions on AC in other areas if you look. Here are just 2.
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=48173.0
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=36380.0

I do not and will not spend thousands on cables. Remember though all systems and tastes are different. Most manufacturers have a 30 day trial period.

Affordable Audio has a review this month (Pg 29) Check it out.
http://www.affordableaudio.org/aa2007-12.pdf

D

BobM · « **Reply #10 on:** 7 Dec 2007, 11:36 pm »

Quote from: blakep on 7 Dec 2007, 02:21 am

My experience is that it is a worthwhile upgrade. I've used various power cords on different components over the past 5-6 years including the Cardas Golden, Blue Circle BC 62 and various DIY cords including the "Bob Crump" special based on Belden 19634/Volex cord and cords constructed with JPS in-wall cable.

I'm currently using DIY DH Labs cables (same cable as the DH Labs Power plus which retails at $200 and has received very positive reviews) on all my components, including an Aqvox Phono 2 CI phono stage. The DH Labs DIY can be done very inexpensively (about $60 for a 4 footer) with Marinco male and IEC. I have a cryo facility close by so I have also cryoed the cords I have in use which I feel is very worthwhile as well. The DH Labs does everything extremely well but is slightly warmer than neutral (which works great and was exactly what I was looking for in my system) but nowhere near as warm as the Cardas Golden. I think it's "the" cord for the money and reviews of the "factory" DH Labs suggest it holds its own with much more expensive cords (ie. $300-$500) and my experience would confirm this. It was a fairly significant upgrade to the stock cord which came with the Aqvox and I feel it is the best cable I've used, of both commercial and DIY offerings.

You build one for your phono stage and if it didn't work out, you only be out $60. Chances are you'll find some place for it in your system. At 12 guage it is beefy enough to work quite well with power amps-I use one on my integrated and line conditioner as well.

So ... what's the recipe? Where to get the cable itself and the plugs? I've been using the Crump cables myself, everywhere. I've been resistant to trying other power cords because I have all of my DIY Crump cords cut to the appropriate length for my racks and components. A stock 5 footer would be far too long for my needs, so a DIY version of these works out perfectly for me.

What was the difference between your DIY Crump cord and your DIY DH Labs, so I know what I can expect?

Thanks,
Bob

blakep · « **Reply #11 on:** 8 Dec 2007, 02:11 am »

Bob: Here is a link to a review of the DH Labs cable:

http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/dhlabs_powerplus.htm

There are links to other reviews on line as well.

I purchased the bulk cable from Parts Connexion for about $6 ft. I had Marinco connectors (5266 male and 320 IEC) which I purchased from Take Five Audio for other power cables I made, but I believe Parts Connexion will also have the Marinco plugs. Marinco, by the way, makes the Wattagate male and IEC that come on the preterminated DH Labs power cord which sells for $200. I've never really been able to see much of a difference between the stock Marinco and the Wattagate, although I'm sure there are some minor differences, just not enough of them for me to pay the Wattagate price. Parts Connexion is in Canada and ships to the U.S., but I'm sure that both the DH Labs bulk cable and Marinco connectors are easily found in the U.S. as well. You strip the ends of the cable, insert them into the appropriate ends of the connectors and screw them down (no soldering necessary); it's about as easy as you can get, even for a technically challenged guy like me.

Frankly, I was never that impressed with the Crump/Volex cords. While I thought they were a minor upgrade from stock, I quickly moved on (about 5 years ago) to products like the Cardas Golden (about $375), which I liked but found to be a bit too syrupy and warm, the Blue Circle BC 62 (around $220) and ultimately to DIY cords which I constructed using JPS in-wall cable (a 10 guage cable designed for in-wall use which is quite a bit more expensive than the DH Labs). I've had a dealer tell me that the DIY JPS in-wall is very close to the JPS Power which sells for around $450 and is pretty highly thought of.

All of the above cables were, IMO, significantly better than the Crump cord right across the board: information and detail retreival, dynamics and slam, better bass performance (tighter and deeper) and more refined treble/high frequency performance. I'd rate the DH Labs DIY better than all of the above in all areas with the exception of bass performance from the DIY JPS in-wall. The JPS is a bit more defined and tighter in the bass with a bit more slam in that area (which is pretty much what the reviewer in the link above said). That being said, to me, the DIY DH Labs has a much more natural sounding midrange (as I've said before just slightly on the warm side of neutral) that is also a bit more detailed and is quite a bit less aggressive and splashy in the treble than the DIY JPS.

Cryo the DH Labs and burn it in on your fridge/freezer and you have a top notch cord that can compete with the best up to $400-$500 for $60. At $6 a foot it's just not expensive enough for audiophiles who want to spend more.

fsimms · « **Reply #12 on:** 8 Dec 2007, 02:27 pm »

I asked the Virtual Dynamics salesman if the way their power cords worked was to keep high frequency signals (ie: radio) from traveling down the power cord to the outlet and then to the other boxes in the audio chain. He said "Yes". Those signals are ground noise caused by ground loops and such. Power cords that only have wire in them, by nature, wouldn't have that filtering.

fsimms · « **Reply #13 on:** 1 Jan 2008, 05:10 pm »

Quote

Should I buy an extra power cord for my Eastern Electric Phonostage?

With your help, I bought a VD Power 3 power cord for my Phonostage. I am amazed at how much clearer the records now are!

Thanks again for all of your help.

AliG · « **Reply #14 on:** 1 Jan 2008, 06:27 pm »

fsimm, I'm glad that you like the VD power cord. I believe the magnet has a lot to do with the so-called "filtering", actually I couldn't care less about how VD explains their technology, most of it are marketing hyperbola. But I can appreciate the effect of magnet. I recently had my Tact modder made me a "magnetic jumper" to connect between the power supply and the motherboard, and I was stunned by what it does to the sound, I felt like I am listening to vinyl now

Listens2tubes · « **Reply #15 on:** 1 Jan 2008, 11:39 pm »

Well worth checking out is the K-Works Empowerwed Cord

http://www.ttvj.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=667

Enjoy!

BobM · « **Reply #16 on:** 2 Jan 2008, 03:13 pm »

Well, I picked up some DH Labs power plus cable and connectors from Parts Connexion and built a few to try out against my Crump Asylum cables. First, I did let them burn in for about 100 hours. I put them on my phono preamp, my power conditioner and my amp. My findings:

The DH cables are definitely more rounded on to than the Crump cords. So much so that I found the top end to be too flat for my taste, especially on the phono preamp. Switching back to the Crump cord there opened things up and gave life back to the music. Same with the amp cord. The bass was bigger, but the top end was missing sparkle. Put the Crump cord back in and all was fine again.

However, I left the DH labs cord on the power conditioner, which feeds the amp and source qeuipment. This was better here than the Crump cord, giving better bass to almost everything plugged into it and no hint of a top end rolloff. So that's where it stayed.

Funny how a cord can affect the tonality of the music. I would expect the dynamics and bass to change, possibly, but not the top end. However that's where I noticed the biggest difference. Go figure.

Enjoy,
Bob

twitch54 · « **Reply #17 on:** 3 Jan 2008, 10:35 pm »

Quote from: BobM on 2 Jan 2008, 03:13 pm

Well, I picked up some DH Labs power plus cable and connectors from Parts Connexion and built a few to try out against my Crump Asylum cables.

My findings:

The DH cables are definitely more rounded on to than the Crump cords. So much so that I found the top end to be too flat for my taste

Hi Bob, could you please use your 'magic decoder ring' to decipher your above quoted sentence ???? !!!

BobM · « **Reply #18 on:** 4 Jan 2008, 12:56 pm »

They were rolled off with no top end sparkle. Definitely not "open" sounding.

fsimms · « **Reply #19 on:** 7 Jan 2008, 07:22 pm »

Quote

They were rolled off with no top end sparkle.

Maybe the top end sparkle is from distortion?