[zacster]

Nobody mentioned the JJ?  They are supposed to be pretty good and relatively inexpensive.  I don't use 300b so I don't have 1st hand experience.  Check the SS vs. Tube thread running right now, Tan's amp uses JJ, maybe he has some words to say.

[JoshK]

I own the JJ's but I haven't tried them yet.  I haven't built the amps yet. 

[TONEPUB]

but the chinese tubes only last about 4000 hours and most of them are
in the 200-500 a pair range. 

That 200 a pair is rather optimistic....I hope they do not take other components with them when they fail!    

Sorry for not being clear about that, I meant most of the Chinese tubes were in the 200-500 dollar
a pair price range.  What I was trying to say was that the WE's are about 850 a pair, but they will
probably outlast quite a few sets of the Chinese tubes.

All the SET nuts I know, do agree though that they all sound a little bit different. 

My experience with the 300B in the amps I had (Pacific Creek, Monarchy, Bottlehead and Wavac)
was pretty similar.  The WE tubes seemed to have more punch and dynamics along with deeper
more controlled bass.  But again, every 300B circuit implementation is a bit different, so a different
tube may be your little slice of heaven.

But I really liked the WE's!!!

[BossaNova31]

It sounds like the WEs are the best so I'm going to save up for a matched quad. I read an interesting article on the Tube Depot website about the WE 300b production process. Impressive...didnt realize that the WEs are largely hand made and how many steps go into the finished product. Quality control seems outstanding as well.

http://www.tubedepot.com/westrex1.html

[JoshK]

FWIW, DIY'ers I know all are in agreeance that the differences in output transformers trumps the differences in output tubes by a large margin. 

[Scott F.]

Josh is absolutely right, its all about the transformers.

When it comes to the Sophia Carbon Plates, I've got a pair in house that I'll be writing about in the next month or so. Let me preface this by saying, I've not listened to a pair of WE's but I have been told that the Carbon Plates more than favor the WE's sonically. That said, I've found that the upper end of the Carbon Plates is a bit rolled. This isn't a bad thing if your system needs that type of taming. On the other hand, if you like your treble as it is with the TJ's, take that into consideration. What I'm hearing in the Carbon Plates, mirrors what I've read about the sonic qualities of the WE's.

Though I don't have a wealth of experience with 300B's, I have the TJ's, the Sophia Mesh Plates and some Shuguang 300B's. The Carbon Plates are in for review.

Hope that helps.

[JoshK]

Scott,

That raises a question about chicken and egg in my mind.  The mesh plates will have less miller capacitance, capacitance from grid to plate that causes HF loss if not driven by enough current.  However, if you had a driver tube with more current output you wouldn't suffer the HF rolloff with the carbon plates either.  So who is to blame the output tube or the driver tube?

Of course, in a typical [commercially made] circuit the carbons are more likely to have the HF rolloff. 

[Scott F.]

Josh,

It's really strange, both mesh plates and the cheapie Shuguang have more high frequency information than the Carbons. That said, the Shuguang sounds hard and brittle on the upper end in my system (Welborne DRD's with Lowther PM2As). Since the DRD's are essentially a straight wire with gain circuit (nothing between the driver tube and the output xfmr), if I had a coupling cap, resistor or xfmr coupled design, I'm sure it would tame the treble of the Shuguang.

I haven't made the phone call yet but I'm guessing Richard at Sophia voiced the carbons to sound like the WE's giving people a more affordable option.