[vman71]

Prefer something with the following:

Black
Remote control capability
No transformer

[miklorsmith]

And you will be spending how much on this?  I'm no electronics expert, but what preamp doesn't have a transformer?  Switch-mode supply?

What character of sound are you aiming for?  Do you care how many inputs/outputs?

[Sonny]

And you will be spending how much on this?  I'm no electronics expert, but what preamp doesn't have a transformer?  Switch-mode supply?

What character of sound are you aiming for?  Do you care how many inputs/outputs?

I would think the only preamp without a "transformer" would be a passive preamp.

I would recommend the Opera Consonance Cyber 222 ($1495)...which could come in black and has a remote.
Look at UltraVioletaudio and tell them that "Tuan" sent you.
It's sold direct from the distributor.

Tuan

[mca]

There are a few available here:

http://buy.audiogon.com/cgia/fsb.pl?prea

[vman71]

I'm clue-less when it comes to preamp's.  I was just told that for my chip amp, it would be better to use a preamp that didn't have a transformer.

I had no clue that preamp's were that important.  I was hoping to buy "used" and trying to stay under $1000.  As far as qualities that I'm looking for, here are a few: dynamic, warm, as neutral and quiet as possible.

[Sonny]

I'm clue-less when it comes to preamp's.  I was just told that for my chip amp, it would be better to use a preamp that didn't have a transformer.

I had no clue that preamp's were that important.  I was hoping to buy "used" and trying to stay under $1000.  As far as qualities that I'm looking for, here are a few: dynamic, warm, as neutral and quiet as possible.

Well, it is true, I am some digital switching amps too and driving it with my cyber 222 tube pre and it adds a little warmth to the neutrality of the digital amps...that's why I recommend that and it is dead quiet as well.

[flatmap]

Hi Vman,

I don't have one for sale, but you might consider a used Cary SLP-88  (line level -- no phono preamp).

It has the black and remote thing going for it.  It uses a  6SN7 tube for each channel so it will be more warm than cool. It has quite a bit of gain; I'm not sure if that is a plus or minus for you.  It is well built, has two sets of outputs and a tape loop and 4 line level inputs.  Here's picture from the positive feedback site http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue6/images/SLP88.jpg

I does have a power transformer, but I'm not sure why that would be an issue.

Steve

[doug s.]

i used to own a cary slp-98.  (better than the 88, in cary's pecking order.)  the melos ma333r i replaced it with was so much better, it made the cary sound mid-fi.  i was disappointed, really, cuz the cary had it in spades over the melos, appearance-wise.  but, the sound is what matters.   aa

i would be seriously considering one of these:

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?preatube&1199914149


or, if you could live w/o remote, this one is the dual-mono wersion.  (my preamp is the dual mono wersion, but a later iteration w/remote.):
http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?preatube&1199306616

doug s.

[chadh]

I'm clue-less when it comes to preamp's.  I was just told that for my chip amp, it would be better to use a preamp that didn't have a transformer.

I had no clue that preamp's were that important.  I was hoping to buy "used" and trying to stay under $1000.  As far as qualities that I'm looking for, here are a few: dynamic, warm, as neutral and quiet as possible.

My amps are chip-amps (Channel Islands VMB1 monoblocks), and I've always kept an eye open for comments people have made about using this type of amplification.  The impression I have is that this type of amplifier is particularly prone to transformer hum issues.  Transformers always present some possibilities of hum, so that a little DC leaking onto the AC line can cause a nuisance.  I don't know why chip amps would be more prone to this than other amplifier types, but I have the impression that they are.  (Mine do suffer from this problem at random times).

Perhaps it has to do with the sensitivity of the amp.  I know mine reach full output with some tiny signal (around 0.6v or something crazy like that), so it may simply be that small hums tend to be amplified a lot.  If this is the case, then one might be worried that a small hum from the pre-amp transformer might be amplified a lot as well.  This becomes more of an issue with the sensitive amplifier, as your pre-amp volume will probably be held relatively low, which will reduce the signal-to-noise ratio.

It's worth noting that often manufacturers of these chip amps pair the amp with a passive volume control rather than an active pre-amp.  They can do this precisely because the of the sensitivity of the amplifiers.

Of course, this hum issue only becomes important if your transformers actually hum.  And if you have transformers that hum, there are things you can do about it.  For example, Dusty at Channel Islands Audio has a gadget for blocking any DC from the power line.  PS audio has a "humbuster".  There are others that do a variety of things in a variety of ways.

Personally, I don't find the hum I get to be much of an issue.  If the amps are off, there is no hum.  If the amps are on and playing, I can't hear any hum.  It's only an issue if the amps are on and not playing, and if it's annoying then I can just turn the amps off (or turn some music on).  I don't think that the threat of possible hum should make much of a difference in your selection of an active/passive pre-amp.  Gain selection might be more important.  Due to the sensitivity of the chip amps, many pre-amps simply have way more gain that you could possibly need.  I lived in that situation for a while, and it was very annoying.  I couldn't turn my pre-amp volume control past 9:00.  But now I'm much happier.  I have a tubed pre-amp with very low gain, and I use a source that has maximum output of 1v.

I'm very happy with my pre-amp, but haven't heard too many with which to compare it.  If you're interested, you could look up the manufacturer, Albert, at http://www.space-tech-lab.com/ .  Albert will customize an amp for you.  It may not end up the prettiest thing in the world (unless you specifically ask for it), but it will sound pretty good.  Mine is his entry model, the QA001, and I use it with a pair of 6sn7 tubes which give the unit a low gain level.  Mine has a single input and a pair of outputs, so I can opt to use a sub-woofer if I wish.  I'm sure Albert can include a remote control if you need it.  You can choose from a range of chassis options.  Prices have traditionally been low, but he's in Canada and as the US dollar weakens, Albert's prices might be creeping up.  Still, you'll get a good deal.  I think I paid around $600 for mine, including up-charges for some cosmetic upgrades and the extra set of outputs.

Chad

[vman71]

Chad,

Thanks for the insight and recommendations.  The gentleman I bought the chip amp from said the same things.  Try and stay away from transformer-based preamps and look for preamps with little gain.  So that's what I'm trying to do.

What is considered little gain?  I don't know.  I'd prefer to find a active line stage (tubed vice SS).

Mike

[JoshK]

Less than 12dbs of gain (i.e. < 4x) is what *I'd* consider little gain.  Its hard to get that with tubes, unless it is just a tube buffer since tubes generally offer > 10x gain (20db+) or more.  You know you might want to check out the IRD Purist.  I am a tube lover myself, but I've owned one of the Purists and it was a very neutral preamp.  New it is ~$600 and it offers unity gain or 6db gain (2x) as a switch.  Its a very transparent preamp offering little if any of its own character.    IRD's amps are chip amps so you could say it is voiced for chip amps.