[mdfoy]

I have an odyssey tempest pre, khartago+ amp,  and am wondering if it is too much power for my speakers.  I have a pair of onix strata minis, and can only get the volume to around 11:00 before "too loud" sets in.  I am not complaining, 9:00 is excellent, 10:00 is good, 11:00 the compression is setting in.  It sounds like the music is too much for the room.

[bpape]

Speakers being too much for the room - maybe.  Amp being too much for the speakers - doubtful.  Too much power - no such thing.  As long as the power stays clean, you're just operating in a more linear range of the electronics.

Bryan

[mdfoy]

Bryan,

Thanks for the feedback.  I was guessing that was the problem.  I have a pair of each of your 244s and tri-traps. These are excellent products, and make a world of difference in the quality of sound.  Without the tri-traps in the corners the bass booms even at low sound levels.  With the 244s at the first reflection point, I have greatly increased high end quality. The minis are kind of light in the high treble, but got a lot better with the 244s in place. GIKicks...!

[JLM]

What you probably have is too much gain.  In this case the output of your source plus the gain from your pre-amp exceeds the rated maximum input of the amp.  If you look into the miscellaneous category at audiogon.com you should find some nice in-line resistors to allow more useable range of the volume control.  This is a common problem.  I even have it with a passive pre-amp as my monoblock amps are rated at 0.6 volts to reach full power and my CDP is rated with a 2.0 volt output.

But I wonder what you mean by "the music is too much for the room."  Hopefully it was a room acoustics problem that the GIK panels solved.

[warnerwh]

It's better to have too much power than too little. Too little can easily end up in blown drivers.

[ooheadsoo]

I suspect that it's just your speakers running distortion through the roof.  I've experienced that with all my speakers in my room regardless of electronics and room treatment.  None of them sound clean and uncompressed in the 100db+ range.

[JLM]

Yes Warner, distorted signals (from overloaded amps) is the easiest way to blow drivers, especially tweeters.

That's the other possibility I was thinking of ooheadsoo (listening too damn loud, as my father would say).  IMO the distortions can come from resonances of room objects, feedback into the rest of the system, and limits of the human ear/brain to process that much input.


Public service annoucement:

Extended exposure to 85 dB or more will result in permanent hearing loss and can result in permanent pain.


Get a hold of a sound pressure level meter to confirm how loud you're listening.  Most listening at various audiofests I've attended average 80 dB and below.

[lonewolfny42]

I don't think anyone asked.....

mdfoy....how big is your room ?

[mdfoy]

The room is 12 X 18, with an 8 ' opening along one of the long walls.  I have the speakers set up along the short wall, 6' out from the short wall.   One GIK tri trap is in the corner behind the right speaker the other in positioned behind the left speaker.  The GIK 244s are at the first reflection points along the long walls.   

[JLM]

So the room and setup is apparently OK.

Have you tried using a spl meter yet?

Can Klaus (or is there any discussions on the Odyessy circle) of the usable range of the tempest volume control?

[dhrab]

#################################################

[Gaara]

Yep sounds like to much gain, the power is not the issue.

You could get a amp with half the power and it won't make much of a difference with your problem.

I had the same issue with a Modwright pre, I tried the Rothwells previously mentioned then used Endler Attenuators.

In the end I realized (With the help of Dan) that I didn't need any gain at all.  I went the passive route and i've never looked back.

As for the issue of the "music being to much for the room", this could be that you are playing to dam loud.  Get a SPL meter and figure out what levels you are at.

[mdfoy]

All,

Thanks for the feedback.   I don't get the too much gain thing, the Odysseys should match in that regard.  But, I will check out those attenuators.  I keep the volume at reasonable levels, with 9:00 being just right. The question was originally posted because cranking it is around 11:00 on the dial, with 6:00 as mute.

[JLM]

The Odyssey pre/power amps should be gain matched, but the Tempest was from a generation of equipment prior to the Khartago.  The operative word here is "should".

Even if they are gain matched the Khartago input sensitivity rating may be quite low.  My monoblocks are (it only takes 0.6 volts to reach full volume) and even with my passive (no gain) pre-amp (from the same vendor), it's volume control will max out the monoblocks at 10 - 11:00. 

The problem in my case (and maybe your's) is the source output.  Most are 2.0 volts, which could easily overload the monoblocks.  The Rothwell attenuators should take care of the problem.  Here's a current listing from audiogon:

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?accstwek&1195828780

[Steve]

Hi Mdfoy,

Just a thought about too much gain and solution. I do not do the mod, but if you are sourcing from a CD player, I wonder if you could get an upgrade by running a second set of output jacks, and bypassing the cd player's analog stage. One gets a little less signal, saves a stage, and gets better music to boot. May have to upgrade the caps in the supply as well when upgrading. Worked great with my old Rotel 865bx player, when I tried it.

Just a thought. Good luck.

[NewBuyer]

If you want to try the attenuators route, then by all means avoid the Rothwells and try something else instead (Endler, Goldpoint, Harrison Labs, etc). Out of all the attenuators I've tried, the Rothwells are *definitely* not audiophile grade. They sounded terrible compared with every other attenuator out there (I think I've tried the vast majority of them), and you sure don't need to add "bad source" to "sounds compressed"!

P.S. In my opinion the Endler shotgun attenuators are easily the best of the bunch, by no small margin...

[JLM]

Thanks for the heads up and link NB.