[philltubes]

This rant not only applies to this website but also Audiogon.  OK, I am so sick of reading For Sale adds that state "well I paid $450.00 for this item so I am looking to get what I paid for it,$450.00.  You bought it, it sucks and you dont like it, so take a loss and move on but dont expect the next person to take care of your poor descision making unless it is a very good deal for the next person.  You got into this hobby, don't expect to have the next guy bail your ass out.  Alright, thats my rant, I feel better that I got that off my chest.

[acresm22]

People can ask whatever they want. If you think the price is too high, don't buy. If they bought something at a good price and it doesn't perform they way they expected it to in their system, why should they take a bath when reselling it?

I too have pet peeves when it comes to audio sales...I just don't share yours 

There's several frequent sellers on Agon that add a few too many rules and qualifiers to their classifieds..."emails such as 'is this still available' or 'will you take $x' will be ignored"...that kind of attitude irks me big time.

[philltubes]

I agree, people can ask whatever they want, although these type of adds are limited it just burns my a// when they say I'm just looking to get what I paid for it, leave that wording out of the add and ask more for it for all I care but sellers that have the attitude that they should recover the money they paid for a piece pisses me off when they actually state it in an add.  I know the price paid is what the market will bear.

[markC]

If you bought a used car for x dollars and it wasn't what you had hoped it would be after driving it for a month, wouldn't you expect to be able to sell it for the same price as you bought it for?

[philltubes]

Maybe so, maybe not, just dont be so stupid as to put it in an add that you are looking to get all your money back!!!  Most of the time I see this type of wording the asking price is on the high side.

[denjo]

A sale is a bargain between a willing seller and a willing buyer! The price stands between the buyer and the seller. If its too high, unless there is something beyond the intrinsic value, the buyer would not be prepared to go beyond the offer. The seller will be without a buyer!

However, I know where you are coming from and I have seen some secondhand pieces offered at unrealistically high prices! I guess that is the prerogative of the seller who must face the bitter pill of lack of interest and, consequently, no sale!

My pet peeve is for someone to advertise a unit describing it as the best piece of audio equipment that has graced his rig! If so, why is he selling it?

[jules]

Of course it might just be that Mr. "I paid $450 for this item ... " only paid $350 for it and the claim is there merely to try to raise the price 

jules

[markC]

Maybe so, maybe not, just dont be so stupid as to put it in an add that you are looking to get all your money back!!!  Most of the time I see this type of wording the asking price is on the high side.

I can certainly agree that this type of ad wording is foolish.  Kind of gives you a hint of who your dealing with. Buyer beware is the first thing that should come to mind.

[rockadanny]

My favorite ass burner goes like this:
Piece works perfectly, but one gewgaw is dented. I spoke with the manufacturer and they said it can be easily repaired for $.25 ... blah blah blah ...
To these people I say, so why the hell don't YOU get it repaired and sell it as perfect if it's so damned easy and cheap to fix?

[nathanm]

So if a person doesn't want to take a big loss on selling something which is just as good as new that's fine, but they simply ought not to say so in the ad? (speaking of ass burning...There's just one D in "ad", as in "advertisement" two D's in "add" as in "he added the numbers together"  This concludes today's spelling lesson.)  In this case honesty would not be the best policy?   But then again philltubes is being honest in his preferences I suppose.

I think one should buy and sell by the Golden Rule.  The fact that people collectively accept that used gear ought to sell for 50% of it's new price is one reason I had to cut down on gear swapping, it just isn't worthwhile.  As buyers we want sellers to take a bath (50% off or so)  on something which is perfectly fine but as sellers ourselves we don't want to take a bath.  I say treat people as you'd like to be treated.  I'd have no problem buying used gear that was only a few bucks cheaper than new.  I don't think it should be EXACTLY the same price, but a slight loss seems more fair than a major one.  But hey, these kinda things can't be planned they just happen.  It probably makes more sense to experiment with gear which already has a decent enough resale value.

Someone's fixing gewgaws for only 25 cents?  Cool, where?  Around here my local gewgaw repair shop is charging $2.50 per dent!  Bastards...

[Rob Babcock]

Stating that one only wants to get what they themselves paid for it isn't immoral, but it's gauche.  Sort of like telling your girlfriend she's almost as good in the sack as your ex-wife.   Honesty sometimes must give way to tact, and there's such a thing as over-sharing.

Obviously the value of a used component depends on a lot of things.  A very in-demand piece will often fetch far more than the 50% that most seem to get.  For example, if you ever find a pair of Salk's on sale at Agon you can bet you'll pay a pretty hefty percentage of the new cost for them.  After all, they're hand made with very long lead times, and few seem to ever resell them.  The Naim Nait integrated also sold for 85% of new price on the used market for about a year after TAS gave them a rave review, as did the NAD C320BEE.  On the other hand, a used pair of Infinity Alpha speakers won't excite anyone too much...there's tons of them on the market.

I think it's a bit unrealistic to get everything you paid back in all cases.  If you bought it used, when you sell it it's even more used.  As in the example of the used car, it now has even more miles on it and probably is worth less.  The used gear was probably shipped an extra time, with another chance for dings, etc.  And while the 2nd owner might get the benefit of the original warranty, a 3rd owner might not.  And there's something to be said for the "chain of custody"- if I'm the second owner, and the original owner is someone I trust, I can claim to know a bit about how a piece was treated.  As the gear gets passed around more, less can credibly be said about it's history and condition.

Lastly, the price a piece brings used reflects the risk-to-reward ratio it carries.  If I want a Shanling CD player, and you want 85% of the new price for your used one, where does that fall on the scale?  It's probably out of warranty, and would likely have to be returned to China if it breaks.  The few hundred dollars is probably not worth the risk, at least to me, vs a unit with warranty.  But offer it at 1/2 retail and I'm more willing to risk it.

[chadh]

Stating that one only wants to get what they themselves paid for it isn't immoral, but it's gauche.  Sort of like telling your girlfriend she's almost as good in the sack as your ex-wife.  

Is that the voice of experience?

I thought I'd offer one observation.  The idea that used items sell for around 50% of the retail price seems to be dependent on the marketplace.  I used to spend time at Head-Fi, and was always surprised at how high the asking prices seemed.  Of course, this is a weird sort of environment in which half the people seem committed to turning over amps almost as often as their underwear. 

A typical experience would be that some manufacturer would announce the forthcoming introduction of a new headphone amplifier.  Suddenly, two hundred head-fiers would pre-order the amp.  Three months later, another manufacturer announces the forthcoming release of a new amplifier, and the same two hundred people would pre-order that amp as well.  Three months further down the track, the first amp would start shipping, and two weeks later one hundred and fifty head-fiers would start advertising them for sale.  They couldn't have all of that cash tied up given that the next amp had been pre-ordered and would be shipping really soon.  But all of these amps would be listed at 85% of the retail price, precisely because the sellers really wanted to recoup the purchase price to put toward the next amp.  But more importantly, buyers seemed prepared to pay those prices since the amps were only a couple of weeks old.  It seemed to me that everybody knew from the outset that any given amp was bound to change hands seven or eight times within the first three months of its existence, so each person really only pays a rental fee.

The lesson here is that, if you can possibly do so, try selling gear on Head-Fi, because buyers seem prepared to pay something close to retail for used items.

Chad

[markC]

Stating that one only wants to get what they themselves paid for it isn't immoral, but it's gauche.  Sort of like telling your girlfriend she's almost as good in the sack as your ex-wife.  

 

  But all of these amps would be listed at 85% of the retail price, precisely because the sellers really wanted to recoup the purchase price to put toward the next amp.  But more importantly, buyers seemed prepared to pay those prices since the amps were only a couple of weeks old.  It seemed to me that everybody knew from the outset that any given amp was bound to change hands seven or eight times within the first three months of its existence, so each person really only pays a rental fee.

The lesson here is that, if you can possibly do so, try selling gear on Head-Fi, because buyers seem prepared to pay something close to retail for used items.

Chad

I think it's a different story if the item is only a couple of weeks old, and especially if the new girlfriend relationship is only a couple weeks old you'd not likely be comparing her yet as you wouldn't truly know her full potential

[Rob Babcock]

Stating that one only wants to get what they themselves paid for it isn't immoral, but it's gauche.  Sort of like telling your girlfriend she's almost as good in the sack as your ex-wife.  

Is that the voice of experience?

I refuse to answer on the grounds that it might get me killed.

[JLM]

Internet sales, especially of used pieces is a buyer beware situation.  Try to pick buyers you recognize and learn the going rates.

Once the cat is out of the bag, some popular pieces can be flipped for near retail.  Same with hard to find or discontinued pieces that are popular.  Vintage stuff typically sells for more than original retail.  If I got a good deal on a piece perhaps getting what I paid for it makes sense, but its pretty irrelevant (plus its an invitation to offer less).  Normally the more owners, the more number of times its been shipped, the less it should be worth.  The above comments regarding warrantees and overseas service are good ones.

I don't flip much, so I try to price to sell and so far its worked well.  Currently I have two used pieces, two that are new, and a pair of commissioned speakers.  I appreciate the chance to sell used gear as I'm old enough to remember trying to sell audio gear before the internet and just figure the loss into the cost of the hobby.

[denjo]

Rob

Its called the privilege against self-incrimination! 

[MaxCast]

Stating that one only wants to get what they themselves paid for it isn't immoral, but it's gauche.  Sort of like telling your girlfriend she's almost as good in the sack as your ex-wife.  

Is that the voice of experience?

Rob, you got to break em in first 

I refuse to answer on the grounds that it might get me killed.