How to shop for a HD TV?

JLM · « **on:** 31 Aug 2007, 11:22 pm »

We're getting closer to the HD decision, but eventually the picture on every set looks alike at the store. It's hard to audition as the sets are somehow sharing the same signal (usually cartoons or specially recorded stuff, and never what I might bring from home - at least at the big boxes). Rarely can you sit in a room with similar ambient light/size to your own with the set at the height you'll use.

I've cut out various sizes to see how big seems "plenty big enough" as I fully expect broadcasters and studios to continue to cram more/smaller text and images into the picture. OTOH extra square footage of screen really adds up as you move from say 32 inch (same height as conventional 27 inch) to 42 inch and up. The set will be on the long wall of a 14 ft by 17 ft room that is all but dedicated to HT (already have the receiver/speakers in place). I'm shouting for a 46 - 55 inch picture. I know we'll be upgrading the satellite to HD, no antennas (yet?). Treatments will eventually go on the windows which are to the right as you view.

What features are important? 720 vs. 1080? HDMI? Is it true that only 3 or 4 vendors build all the screens? Is that important? What does the extra money for a Sony or other high-end brands go for? Is LCD flat panel "the way to go?". HT is not a hobby for me, so I don't want to be in the market for a new one anytime soon.

Thanks

BRILEY804 · « **Reply #1 on:** 1 Sep 2007, 01:27 am »

message sent......

JP78 · « **Reply #2 on:** 2 Sep 2007, 03:02 am »

jlm - do you need a flat panel? are you going to be watching far off-axis? how far away is the seating? what's the budget for the display, as well as the ancillary equipment?

best,

NealH · « **Reply #3 on:** 2 Sep 2007, 03:20 am »

All you need is a 50" Pioneer 720 set. Don't waste your money chasing the wind.

zybar · « **Reply #4 on:** 2 Sep 2007, 03:24 pm »

Quote from: JP78 on 2 Sep 2007, 03:02 am

jlm - do you need a flat panel? are you going to be watching far off-axis? how far away is the seating? what's the budget for the display, as well as the ancillary equipment? my company designs and builds theaters for a living and would be glad to give my professional opinion wherever possible.

best,

All good questions...

Here are a few more:

What will you use for sources?

What do you like to watch?

How long do you generally keep a display?

How picky are you? Do you want top of line or do you want something that is solid and good?

When the questions are answered, some suggestions can be made.

George

JP78 · « **Reply #5 on:** 2 Sep 2007, 07:21 pm »

Quote from: rnhood on 2 Sep 2007, 03:20 am

All you need is a 50" Pioneer 720 set. Don't waste your money chasing the wind.

i don't think thats a bad thought at all, but if he has room for a dlp and isn't viewing more than +/- 30 off axis something like a 70" jvc hd-ila 1080p display is 1700.00usd shipped from buydig.com coupled with a 350.00usd isf calibration will provide a stunning, immersive experience. when it comes to theater, there's no substitute for size, given a minimum level of performance.

JLM · « **Reply #6 on:** 2 Sep 2007, 11:23 pm »

90% of viewing will be on-axis. Couch is opposite the TV, but a love seat is on the side wall.

Primary viewing distance will be roughly 12 ft.

We will be upgrading from Direct TV to Direct HD and possibly adding a HD antenna as the local channels on Direct are in a different market (where wifey works) than we might reach (30 miles, open horizons) with an antenna (where I work).

Already have a $200 6.1 receiver, $1200 5.1 speakers, and $150 multiple channel DVD.

Budget is somewhat flexible, but frankly HT is a rather low priority. I would have gone cheaper on speakers, but already had most of them from earlier audio systems.

Expect to get a HD DVD or blu-ray by the following Christmas.

We'd use it mostly to watch TV (history, science, football, golf) and some movies (chick flicks, family friendly stuff, some action).

I generally keep the display as long as possible. My previous CRT's stayed until one turned green and the other was dropped.

With my rather low HT priorities I'm after solid and good versus top of the line.

And yes, if I don't get straight/sensible answers, I might just go 720p and forget about it. (OTOH I'm an "investment" kinda guy who wants to only do it once, if possible.)

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #7 on:** 12 Sep 2007, 03:29 pm »

We moved into a new house this summer and I needed to do something as we left our downstairs HT with projector. Like you, I wasn't figuring out much by going to the big box stores. I did a bunch of research here and at AVS forums. In our room we're sitting about 14' back and pretty much in front. I started out thinking towards a 42" Panny Plasma and ended up going with a 60" Pioneer (6070). I came to the conclusion that there were many factors that were more important to overall picture quality than 720 vs. 1080. I've been very pleasantly surprised by the quality of SD picture with this set. My son has a 42" Panny and said the SD pic on the Pio screen is smoother and cleaner. Very pleased and glad I went for this size and the Pioneer.

We have room to build a dedicated music/HT room (with PJ) but now with this set, I won't mind waiting a year or two to build that room. Frankly, I'm more anxious for a the music room than the HT room . . .

ricmon · « **Reply #8 on:** 12 Sep 2007, 03:47 pm »

If the term "factory refurbish" does not scare you check these guys out. I got a 32 inch Westinghouse HD TV/Monitor for 500 bucks with a factory warranty. I've had it for about 5 months with no problem. Great buy.

http://www.ecost.com/ecost/ECPLASMA/default_XML.asp

Dan Driscoll · « **Reply #9 on:** 13 Sep 2007, 05:28 pm »

I'll have to disagree with rnhood. At a screen size larger than about 45" I would not even consider a resolution lower than 1080p.

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #10 on:** 13 Sep 2007, 10:57 pm »

Quote from: Dan Driscoll on 13 Sep 2007, 05:28 pm

I'll have to disagree with rnhood. At a screen size larger than about 45" I would not even consider a resolution lower than 1080p.

I'm going to respectfully disagree. I have a 60" Pioneer 6070HD and I have a tough time seeing how a 1080p could be better. I believe it depends on seating distance, other factors of PQ, source material and of course the individual's visual accuity.

JLM · « **Reply #11 on:** 13 Sep 2007, 11:07 pm »

Yeah, this is exactly the kind of stuff I read. Some say this, others say that, and I'm left throwing up my hands.

zybar · « **Reply #12 on:** 13 Sep 2007, 11:12 pm »

Quote from: Mike Dzurko on 13 Sep 2007, 10:57 pm

Quote from: Dan Driscoll on 13 Sep 2007, 05:28 pm
I'll have to disagree with rnhood. At a screen size larger than about 45" I would not even consider a resolution lower than 1080p.

I'm going to respectfully disagree. I have a 60" Pioneer 6070HD and I have a tough time seeing how a 1080p could be better. I believe it depends on seating distance, other factors of PQ, source material and of course the individual's visual accuity.

Mike,

You are quite correct that seating distance is the major factor in being able to see the differences between 720p/1080i and 1080p.

The further away you are, the larger the screen needs to be in order to see the differences. Past certain distances, you simply can't see the extra detail that 1080p can produce.

George

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #13 on:** 13 Sep 2007, 11:24 pm »

Quote from: JLM on 13 Sep 2007, 11:07 pm

Yeah, this is exactly the kind of stuff I read. Some say this, others say that, and I'm left throwing up my hands.

I hear you. I felt the same way until I spent enough time over at AVS to read thousands of posts and see certain very strong trends. I also took the time to read many of the attached links, etc. I didn't have the opportunity or option of doing a lot of looking . . . little time and few places to really look around here. But, I am extremely happy w/ my decision. . . . here's to you being as happy w/ your decision!

ctviggen · « **Reply #14 on:** 14 Sep 2007, 01:22 am »

I'm going to have to disagree with Dan, too. On AVS, someone took two front projectors, a 720p and 1080p and put them side by side. Somehow, each only produced half the picture. On a 100+ inch screen, I could not tell the difference between the two. Now, that doesn't mean that there's no difference in real life; but the difference is a heck of a lot smaller than most people think. Plus, 45 inches is really -- I hate to say it -- small. I have a 57 inch TV and I think it's too small. If you're gettin a 45 inch screen, unless you're watching from a few feet away, you won't notice the difference between 720p and 1080p.

Dan Driscoll · « **Reply #15 on:** 16 Sep 2007, 02:40 pm »

I have a 53" inch CRT-RPTV and I think it's pretty small, too.

It's about more than just subjective picture quality. I am well aware that under certain viewing conditions a 720p display can appear to look as good as a 1080p display, particularly if they are both displaying upscaled source material. But will those viewing conditions always remain the same and will the source material always be upscaled? What if he moves, his wife demands he rearrange the furniture or for some other reason they wind up sitting closer? Both HD-DVD and Blu-Ray are selling 1080p players now. The fact is that when all else is the same (size, display type, etc.), a 1080p display will produce a better picture than a 720p display. And 1080p source material will look better on a 1080p native display than if it were down-rezz'd to 720p. Somebody's going to win the format war, but regardless, of who does, 1080p will be the dominant resolution.

Below 40" I'm not even sure anyone is even making a consumer level 1080p display and I agree that you're unlikely to see a difference, if all else is the same. But at 50" I can see a difference, particularly at closer, but not unrealistic viewing distances, about 8 feet.

About the only reason I would consider a 45" or larger 720p display would be for serious budget considerations or if it was for a secondary system. And if the budget were that tight I would seriously consider putting off the purchase until the situation improved. That's pretty much what I'm doing now, I can't afford what I really want, so I'm sticking with what I have until I can.

satfrat · « **Reply #16 on:** 24 Sep 2007, 05:32 am »

FWIW, Directv will be coming out with upgraded receiver in November, HR21 HD DVR that will have a HDMI 1080p connection included for serious home theater enthusiasts. I'll settle for 1080i for the time being but when I do eventually upgrade my Sony CRT, it'll be 1080p HD projector.

JLM · « **Reply #17 on:** 24 Sep 2007, 09:24 am »

Good heads up Satfrat.

We already have directTV.

Unfortunately annual home insurance, wifey's 50th birthday present, an upcoming weekend getaway (our first fully legitimate "vacation" in 5 years), and a bunch of landscaping we're in the middle of is telling me that the new TV is off for a while.

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #18 on:** 24 Sep 2007, 07:17 pm »

Quote from: JLM on 24 Sep 2007, 09:24 am

Good heads up Satfrat.

We already have directTV.

Unfortunately annual home insurance, wifey's 50th birthday present, an upcoming weekend getaway (our first fully legitimate "vacation" in 5 years), and a bunch of landscaping we're in the middle of is telling me that the new TV is off for a while.

That's not all bad . . . they just keep squeezing a better picture our of less money. Maybe by next spring the Pioneer Kuros will have come significantly down in price . . . haven't seen one myself, but from how much I enjoy my 6070HD, I can only imagine how good the Kuro looks.

JLM · « **Reply #19 on:** 28 Oct 2007, 10:50 am »

Just bought a 50 inch Sony SXRD rear projection LCoS. Prices had just come down $500 and they had a $300 trade-in offer. It'll be going in a dedicated TV room in the basement, so ambient lighting isn't an issue. I couldn't pick it up Saturday as they were wiring Tom Izzo's (Michigan State men's basketball coach and current local sports icon) for 15 TV's! Caulk up another win for coach Izzo.