Heard the Linkwitz Orion's today...

toxteth ogrady · « **on:** 21 Aug 2003, 02:00 am »

Sigfried Linkwitz was gracious enough to invite me to his house to hear the Orion speakers. I'll spare you most of the details, but they are without a doubt one of the most musically satisfying speakers I have ever heard.

I am a perfectionist at heart and always find something to be critical about, but for the two and half hours I spent with the Orion's there was not one thing I would change about their sound.

They are truly full range without the typical behemoth construction you find in most full range speakers.

I love their diminutive and self-effacing construction, but most importantly I love the fact that these things can sing in real world environments and without any compromise I could find.

Mr. Linkwitz encouraged me to walk around so I could judge their performance from all parts of the room.

Whether I was sitiing at the front of the room or standing at the back, I was really impressed with how engaging the music was.

I positively will be building these and intend to dress up the cosmetics a bit, but I still have a couple weeks until my upgraded North Creek Okara's are finished.

I'll post pics as I make progress.

cheers

t. ogrady

Sa-dono · « **Reply #1 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 05:08 am »

Any chance you can list what gear was used?

toxteth ogrady · « **Reply #2 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 05:58 am »

The Orion's were mated to the 8 channel ATI amp that Siegfried recommends on his website. The preamp was a Lexicon model but I'm not sure which. Source was a Pioneer DV45A universal player and speaker cables were zipcord. Not sure about interconnects though. Makes me wonder what these would sound like with a better source and cables.

The sound was truly superior to anything I heard at this years HE show in San Francisco and (here come the flames) more enjoyable to my ears than
the RM40's I heard last year. Don't get me wrong, the RM40's are amazing speakers that do many things right, but a couple things just don't work for me. The Orions are a better fit for my lifestyle and sound incredible to boot.

Sa-dono · « **Reply #3 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 06:23 am »

Thanks T! And no worries...everyone is welcome to their opinions. I'm glad you've found some speakers you love

I'll look forward to your future pics.

mac · « **Reply #4 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 01:49 pm »

Quote from: toxteth ogrady

The sound was truly superior to anything I heard at this years HE show in San Francisco and (here come the flames) more enjoyable to my ears than the RM40's I heard last ye ...

I've been running Orions now for 8 months. Without question they are the finest speakers I've owned by a significant margin. I have not heard a box or "ribbon" speaker that is in the same league as the Orion.

Quote from: toxteth ogrady

Makes me wonder what these would sound like with a better source and cables.

I don't run SL's "recommended" amplifiers. Although I've heard nothing but good things about the ATI amp, I'm using a set of Audio Refinement Multi-3's. For interconnects I use HGA Super Silver and for speaker wire I use Polk Cobra Cable (best cost-no-object wire IMO). Preamp is a DIY built SLA battery powered "passive" buffered unit with Hagerman phono stage. For analog, I use a Teres TT, ET2 & DV 20XL. For digital playback I use an SACD1000. My Orion XO has been built with “upgraded” parts and uses a better-than-average power supply design. The system sounds simply awesome IMHO. Cheers, mac.

audiojerry · « **Reply #5 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 02:56 pm »

Sounds super!
Who can build a pair for us, and
how can AudioCircle get a demo pair to evaluate?

Mr. O'grady or Mac, maybe you could talk to Mr. Linkwitz and tell him what a great bunch of guys hang on on AudioCircle and persuade him to join us. He could rub elbows with the likes of Curl, Crump, and Nathan.
Then, once we get him cornered, we will trick him into building a demo pair of speakers for us to try out!

JoshK · « **Reply #6 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 03:10 pm »

Funny how he gets good results with using a processor as a pre. I haven't heard the Lexicon but it makes me want to. I owned the ATI before and it is a good amp for its price range indeed, although not the end all be all.

Occam · « **Reply #7 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 06:12 pm »

The Bob speaker that is.
http://www.doddsy.net/steve6_009.htm

Using SL's design, with a digital equalizer, the dbx driverack.
Now if someone could lash digital outputs to the Behringer 9024 (or just get the frigg'n thing to work as advertised) and output it to tripath's new 6 channel digital input driver (incl volume control), which they announced and then unannounced...

Occam · « **Reply #8 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 06:43 pm »

My mistake, the tripath 6 channel digital input TCD6000 is still there....
Just hard to find.
http://www.tripath.com/data.htm

KeithR · « **Reply #9 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 07:34 pm »

Quote from: JoshK

Funny how he gets good results with using a processor as a pre. I haven't heard the Lexicon but it makes me want to. I owned the ATI before and it is a good amp for its price range indeed, although not the end all be all.

I haven't heard great 2 ch things about the new Lex's at all...rather, the opposite and people going to Meridian or Theta.

audiojerry · « **Reply #10 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 08:17 pm »

I'm not sure of the model number either, but my buddy has a rather expensive Lexicon 6 channel processor for his HT system. He also has a $750 Adcom linestage. When used with his Odyssey Extreme Mono's, the Adcom is more transparent and sounds better for two channel audio.

But this is getting off-topic. I want to find a way of getting a pair of Orions to listen to.

toxteth ogrady · « **Reply #11 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 08:36 pm »

Hey Mac

I don't doubt one bit that your system sounds awesome given your equipment. I'm glad someone else can testify to how palpable the Orions sound. Siegfied Linkwitz told me he goes to the symphony pretty often and that one of the goals he had for the Orions was to try and elicit the same response he feels at the symphony - the tacit connection between the performers and audience. From what I heard yesterday, he succeeded.

John Casler · « **Reply #12 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 09:40 pm »

Very cool looking speakers.

The "open back" design remeinds me of my Dalhquist DQ10s, which I still pull out and "fire up" on occasion.

They too have a very pleasing and almost mesmerizing quality, and offer an interesting "soundstage", which I'm sure must be similar.

I remember when I first heard them in the early 70's. They certainly "blew my hair back" (and I still had some then)

OBF · « **Reply #13 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 11:09 pm »

Quote from: JoshK

Funny how he gets good results with using a processor as a pre. I haven't heard the Lexicon but it makes me want to. I owned the ATI before and it is a good amp for its price range indeed, although not the end all be all.

Perhaps this is an example of good engineering trumping all else. In some regards I find it amazing, and in other regards not so surprising that the Orion system with a pedestrian ATI HT amp, pre/pro, and Pioneer source could be yielding cutting edge sonics. Not only cutting edge, but reportedly the "best reproduced sound" a lot of people have ever heard. I suspect the key is good speaker drivers that are actively crossed, equalized, and triamped, and the positives of these design principles are greater than the sum of magic tubes, caps, Black Gates, wires, hand built circuits, isolation, damping, and all the other traditional ingredients to perfect sound. Now all these things may be additive to the Orion system, but that's largely beside the point.

toxteth ogrady · « **Reply #14 on:** 21 Aug 2003, 11:49 pm »

Quote from: OBF

Perhaps this is an example of good engineering trumping all else. In some regards I find it amazing, and in other regards not so surprising that the Orion system with a pedestrian ATI HT amp, pre/pro, and Pioneer source could be yielding cutting edge sonics. Not only cutting edge, but reportedly the "best reproduced sound" a lot of people have ever heard. I suspect the key is good speaker drivers that are actively crossed, equalized, and triamped, and the positives of these design principles are greater ...

Very well put.

Davey · « **Reply #15 on:** 22 Aug 2003, 12:27 am »

Quote from: OBF

Perhaps this is an example of good engineering trumping all else. In some regards I find it amazing, and in other regards not so surprising that the Orion system with a pedestrian ATI HT amp, pre/pro, and Pioneer source could be yielding cutting edge sonics. Not only cutting edge, but reportedly the "best reproduced sound" a lot of people have ever heard. I suspect the key is good speaker drivers that are actively crossed, equalized, and triamped, and the positives of these design principles are greater ...

Yes, very well put.

Davey.

Sa-dono · « **Reply #16 on:** 23 Aug 2003, 02:59 am »

I have moved all of the off topic discussion to the Fight Club. I'm as interested as the rest of you regarding what this was all about, but let's please keep the discussion audio related. Feel free to continue the other discussion here:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=4318

Mike B. · « **Reply #17 on:** 24 Aug 2003, 05:47 pm »

I have heard nothing negative about the sound of the Orions. I would love to hear them. My only concern is all the electronics associated with the speaker. You don't just build the speaker. You must use the electronic eq/crossover and amps I think?

WG · « **Reply #18 on:** 27 Aug 2003, 08:24 pm »

Mike,

The Orions are a fully active crossover design. You can build the crossover yourself or purchase it fully assembled. Shortly, you can purchase the whole system assembled. You do not have to use the suggested ATI amps, but the gain needs to be identical on all and you will want to read Mr. Linkwitz's recommendations and caveats for amplification should you elect not to go with the ATI's recommended.

Regards,
Will

JLM · « **Reply #19 on:** 27 Aug 2003, 09:29 pm »

This open dipole design is only a step away from open baffle design, where the baffle size dictates how much bass can be produced before front and back waves cancel each other out.

The direct connection between driver and amp is always to be desired. That's why I like single driver speakers. If needed for your room or listening tastes, a powered subwoofer can be added. (If you have to have a crossover, best that it's far away from midrange frequencies.)

Putting a single driver in an open baffle is oh la la! Use say a 4 inch driver like the Jordan 92S in a classic 31 inch x 39 inch baffle will provide bass down to 80 Hz. Your sub can handle the rest. Or use corner baffles that have the top and bottom open and the Jordan can reach 40 Hz on it's own. Note that with their up tilted treble on axis response the Jordans are actually designed for 45 degree angled setup.

The open baffles I've heard have a very big, natural, dynamic sound.

jeff