[mcullinan]

Are you kidding me, tell him to sit and spin and spin and spin, until irritation occurs and hemmeroids (hammer Roids) flare!!!!!!!
Mike

[weirdo]

  It would be different if they had some exclusive dealing territory, and everybody in the area needed to buy from them.  But in that case, Devore wouldn't stand for the $1500 audition fee (as it would effectively mean that nobody in the area would buy the speakers).  But as there are other dealers, customers just go elsewhere: this is exactly what this dealer wanted.

The only really surprising thing about this arrangement is finding just how lucrative the custom HT installation business must be.  Essentially, this dealer is telling you that between actual revenues forgone, inconvenience and overheads of maintaining an audition space, the costs associated with taking time away from custom installations in HUGE.


Then they should have the common courtesy to just say that. Auditions are a part of this business.  do they audition their HT gear with the same arrogance?

[Robert57]

This $1500 audition fee is disgusting and reminds me why I prefer to browse and audition at a major show like RMAF, particularly for speakers. Admittedly, the hotel rooms are hard to set up for ideal sound, but at least I can get a general feel for the sound, sample synergy with other components, and meet truly knowledgeable dealers and mfrs. without any expectation of an immediate sale. I agree, the dealer who sells out of his home can offer a much better room set-up, and presumably less sales pressure with the lower overhead. But for two -channel hi-fi, with the myriad of fine small makers, who increasingly are choosing to sell direct, I think the traditional store-front retailer model is an endangered species and offers a very unpleasant experience, with more impatient attitude and arrogance than satisfying value added. I have read that many mfrs. who still rely on retailers privately will admit they resent how little the retailer does to earn their large mark-ups, with the poor mfr. still having to provide most of the pre-sale information and post-sale advice. I wonder how many retailers even allow in-home trials or offer set-up assistance any more.

So what is the future of hi-fi retailing in mid-sized or even larger cities? I like the idea of the manufacturers and major dealers banding together and creating an "audio-mart" facility for smaller or low-volume elite brands, as the furniture and decor mfrs. have done in major cities. It could be a converted large home or a commercial building, depending on the city and the market size. The expensive inventory could be consolidated in a central location, and the rooms could be staffed by a rotation or combination of mfrs. and local dealer personnel, with the mfr. getting a larger margin. The rooms could offer a far more extensive variety of equipment, set up in more pleasing home-like environments, for a meaningful audition. This would alow even small makers to have their wares seen and heard in better controlled rooms, perhaps by advance appointment. Even a modest audition fee of a $50-100 would be fine with me, to separate the genuine shoppers from the tire kickers. Still, without a firm commitment to a hi-fi focus, I'm afraid the HT gear would probably crowd out the two-channel gear since that's where the money is. I like to think that after living with a Bose surround system for a while, people will rediscover that a 2.1 channel hi-fi rig works great for both music and movies, and is a whole lot more economical and space efficient than 5+ -channel.

[TONEPUB]

I'm going to drop a link of this post to John DeVore...

He is a really nice guy and I'm sure would be mortified
if he knew that this was going on.  It sure doesn't do
anything to help his reputation or feed his family!

Sorry you had such a bad experience.  This is the kind
of thing that really hurts the industry.  Hope you get a
chance to listen soon.  I'm a happy DeVore owner, so
best of luck to you!

[gooberdude]

That's a great idea Robert.  


Here in Chicago we have Luxe Home, which is a hi-end home finishes (bathrooms, kitchens, etc) mall of sorts where the public can roam and 'take in' design ideas from dozens of local contractors.   its located inside the Merchandise Mart.  

A few years ago the idea was on a higher floor, and kinda spread out.   Now, Luxe Home is the entire ground floor and folks can shop and gawk and talk for hours.   the displays have some of the nicest kitchens and baths you'll ever see, and great salepeople.    The typical customers seem to be contractors, so the general public isn't ever pressured into sales...  many couples looking to re-model their homes can spend an entire weekend browsing and walk away with designs that will make their neighbors jealous.

LuxeHome revived the entire Mart actually...

Its also given really small companies with killer ideas, like concrete countertops/sinks etc, major exposure to customers who don't subscribe to hi-end finish magazines and the like, but want to get a taste of how the other half lives.

For so many people here in the U.S. its as if mass produced items are understood to be 'what's available' and all it takes is exposure to get the masses on board with something better.   Especially in the larger urban markets where disposal income is in vogue.  

[defgibbon]

I was made aware of this dealer's behavior yesterday and actions have already been taken. Thanks to all of you who brought this to my attention--this type of feedback is essential in order to maintain the very best dealer network possible. My company is very serious about our commitment to our dealership, but in return expect a high level of professionalism and passion for quality. We go so far as to buy back all demo units from misbehaving dealers in order to ensure a clean break.

Again, thanks to all of our customers and potential customers for your vigilance. You efforts help to make everyones experience in Hi-Fi shops better.

Sincerely,
John DeVore,
President and Chief Designer, DeVore Fidelity

[Charles Calkins]

Thank you Mr. John DeVore!!!!


                                Cheers
                               Charlie

[mcrespo71]

Wow, the power of the forums.  Classy, classy move by Mr. Devore.

[TONEPUB]

Told you he was a cool cat.....

[zybar]

Wow, the power of the forums.  Classy, classy move by Mr. Devore.

I wish more vendors were this responsive to feedback and comments.

Very nicely done Mr. Devore.   

George

[Audiovista]

WOW 

I am very impressed. A company to look up to. 

[kbuzz3]

There is a dealer in NYC that does this.  I told him he was crazy.  He believes his experience and "ears" are worth every penny.  However, he wanted $150 not $1500.  I wanted to audition the Elac line of speakers.

Mike, you should report him to Devore.  They may not want this type of dealer carrying their speakers.  I heard the Devores at "In Living Stereo" and paid nothing to listen to them.

                                                                                                              Jim

Is that the guy on second ave in the 80s.  I live around the corner called once a few years when the jolida cd player came out. They would not let me listen without a 50 dollar deposit. Geez i thought lyric was bad.....

[macrojack]

I'm not in a hurry to defend dealers but I can imagine how often a guy in N.Y. demos a product only to have the happy customer go home and buy it online either new or used. That's got to get old, and we all know it happens routinely.

[PhilNYC]

I was made aware of this dealer's behavior yesterday and actions have already been taken. Thanks to all of you who brought this to my attention--this type of feedback is essential in order to maintain the very best dealer network possible. My company is very serious about our commitment to our dealership, but in return expect a high level of professionalism and passion for quality. We go so far as to buy back all demo units from misbehaving dealers in order to ensure a clean break.

Again, thanks to all of our customers and potential customers for your vigilance. You efforts help to make everyones experience in Hi-Fi shops better.

Sincerely,
John DeVore,
President and Chief Designer, DeVore Fidelity

Welcome to AC, John!  Great way to make a great first impression, too!   

[zybar]

I'm not in a hurry to defend dealers but I can imagine how often a guy in N.Y. demos a product only to have the happy customer go home and buy it online either new or used. That's got to get old, and we all know it happens routinely.

That's why I don't go to dealer showrooms anymore. 

On the rare occasions when I do, I am very upfront with the dealer on my expectations and actions.  This way they can do the same.

George

[topround]

Let's say I wanted to buy them at list price.

Let's say I wanted to hear them and if I liked them looked for a used pair on Agon, because that is how I could afford to get into a pair of speakers I really liked.

Let's say I just wanted to hear them because I like hearing different things, just like those that attend RMAF or other high end venues. To be educated, and not just read reviews.

Let's say I heard them and couldn't afford them, but liked them and knew someone who could afford them.

Look what just happened here, a simple experience morphed into a larger more personal experience we all experience. This forum started a whole issue. I mentioned a simple experience to all who read here and there was a reaction, for the positive.

Also having a used market that is strong is very desirable for manufacturers.
I am sure many of us buy things here we know we can easily sell, just in case we don't like it.
Look at Honda, an old Honda with a million miles gets a lot more than a used Ford or GM product, it becomes a good investment, buy that Honda for 20K and sell it 4 years later for 13 or 14K $.
You want a robust used market it creates value.
Having people who want that speaker used justifies the price new, if it sells for 2k new and no one wants it used, who would pay 2 k when new?
It is pretty simple, I think

[Sonny]

Let's say I wanted to buy them at list price.

Let's say I wanted to hear them and if I liked them looked for a used pair on Agon, because that is how I could afford to get into a pair of speakers I really liked.

Let's say I just wanted to hear them because I like hearing different things, just like those that attend RMAF or other high end venues. To be educated, and not just read reviews.

Let's say I heard them and couldn't afford them, but liked them and knew someone who could afford them.

Look what just happened here, a simple experience morphed into a larger more personal experience we all experience. This forum started a whole issue. I mentioned a simple experience to all who read here and there was a reaction, for the positive.

Also having a used market that is strong is very desirable for manufacturers.
I am sure many of us buy things here we know we can easily sell, just in case we don't like it.
Look at Honda, an old Honda with a million miles gets a lot more than a used Ford or GM product, it becomes a good investment, buy that Honda for 20K and sell it 4 years later for 13 or 14K $.
You want a robust used market it creates value.
Having people who want that speaker used justifies the price new, if it sells for 2k new and no one wants it used, who would pay 2 k when new?
It is pretty simple, I think

Well stated Mike...that is true...no one would buy expensive new gear if we could not get some money back for it to then turn around and buy something else!!!

Also, that gives the manufacturer an opportunity that if they come up with a new version of a product, the owners of the older products can sell and buy the new version.  It all works out fine, I think...and to use the Honda scenario, well, think of it this way, if we could sell our used cars, we definitely wouldn't be buying new cars at such an enormous rate or would dealers be offering a "lease" option on their cars.  Because who would actually buy the used returned cars?

Great point Mike!

[john1970]

I was made aware of this dealer's behavior yesterday and actions have already been taken. Thanks to all of you who brought this to my attention--this type of feedback is essential in order to maintain the very best dealer network possible. My company is very serious about our commitment to our dealership, but in return expect a high level of professionalism and passion for quality. We go so far as to buy back all demo units from misbehaving dealers in order to ensure a clean break.

Again, thanks to all of our customers and potential customers for your vigilance. You efforts help to make everyones experience in Hi-Fi shops better.

Sincerely,
John DeVore,
President and Chief Designer, DeVore Fidelity

I must agree a very classy move.  Wish you and your company much success.

Best,

John

[TONEPUB]

I think that is the most difficult aspect of being a dealer.  

In order to have a showroom
and pay employees (and keep the lights on, etc) it costs a lot of money.  Even a small
space in a major city other than Chicago, NYC or Los angeles probably costs 5-10 thousand
dollars a month when you add up all the costs.

You have to keep showing the stuff in the hope that someone is actually
going to buy, but if no one buys for a while, you go out of business.

I always tell people to spread the love around.  If you are going to spend
time at a dealer auditioning their stuff, at least try to buy something from
them, so they can stay in business, otherwise you won't have a place to
audition..

When the vendors go to a show like RMAF, they are there specifically to show
their gear to you and meet you. (and they budget accordingly, again it costs
the average mfr at least 10 grand to hang out in a hotel room and talk to you)

It's all about planting seeds and its easy to get jumpy when the crops don't
grow.  I understand the dilemma of both sides.

Personally, I hope that we start to see more small, regional shows so that
people can get exposed to more gear and raise the enthusiasm.

Unfortunately, the used speaker market doesn't equal the used car market.
More than likely if you buy a used Honda (or whatever) there's a good chance
you might take it back to the dealer for service anyway.  But with speakers
or most high end gear, it hopefully won't break, so why would you go back
to the dealer after you bought it used from a private party?

It's a tough racket indeed!

[Bigfish]

This is an interesting and emotional topic.  My guess is the the salesperson did not believe Topround was a potential serious buyer.  He probably threw-out the ridicious amount of $1500.00 to audition the speakers expecting to scare Topround off.  What do you think might have happened if Topround had countered with "listen I am really seriously interested in purchasing new high-end speakers and am not willing to pay $1500 for an audition but how about $50.00?"  Of course the $50.00 would apply toward purchase.

I am similar to everyone else I don't want to pay for something I can get for free.  However, a store, space, inventory and a saleperson's time cost somebody money.  Today, most people do research on the internet before they make major purchases.  You visit a store because you are seriously interested in an expensive product and you see/hear it.  You are most likely going to come across to the salesperson as a serious potential buyer.  I will end this by writing if the salesperson was truly set on $1500.00 for the audition then he was not interested in selling the speakers.

Ken