My very unprofessional review of the Nuforce 9 SE v2s (upgraded from basic 9.02)

mcullinan · « **on:** 12 Jun 2007, 04:10 pm »

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Ok. My system setup goes something like this I have an Audible Illusion Mod 3A preamp, Lavry DA-10 DAC, Squeezebox 3, Velodyne HGS-12 Subwoofer, and a pair of Merlin VSM-MX speakers, plus various interconnects.

I will try to be forthright as possible. My system has been going through changes recently, so I think you should average that in to the equation. Previous to my Merlins I was using MA Silver RS6 which is a very accurate, neutral speaker, this is what I used my Nuforce 9.02s on. I wont compare the versions but give you my impressions of the SEv2s.

Sometimes I forget why I started all this equipment swapping in the first place. Its the music dummy... Setting up was pretty simple, letting the amps play and play, jumping in the drivers seat to hear the goings on, hmm nothing special, play some more....

Bumps. ouch! Ok on my listening I did hit a snag, the presentation was forward and thin and compressed. A quick email to Casey at Nuforce and he mentioned that the original Nuforce 9.02 were out of phase and the V2s are in phase. He suggested switching the positive and negative wires on the speakers. Wallah problem fixed. Casey mentioned that some systems like out of phase better. I am no rocket scientist, and to my ears this definitely solved the issue.

Addendum: So it wasnt the speakers but the tube preamp and is phase inverting... So the final product is in phase by switching the positive and negative leads...

Last night: Turned off all the lights, turned off the thwackers, jangers, and whatchamcallits in the house to make it as quiet as possible. Long Island has a constant hum to it, and I find at around 11 11:30pm things begin to settle down. So I put on some Jimi Hendrix, Ultimate Experience... The presentation is a silky whole, a musical force filled with texture and images. The sound stage is huge, from wall to wall in my comfy 12 x 17 room with vaulted ceilings. Voodoo Chile is playing, Jimi is running back and forth between the speakers and off to the other side of the left speaker. Channel separation is awesome and my ears are being tickled. The SPLs changes from side to side are making my ears spin hehe.. and the subtlety and crackling of texture within the recording is amazing! If I was 20 again I might have thought I was tripping... anyways, like an artist dabs, splashes, and organically applys paint to a canvas , I feel the Nuforce SEv2 paints its sonic landscape, every nuance, every gesture is there if you wish to look. The amps do not pull apart the music at all, they reconfirm their goal which is to sing! I can say that compared to the 9.02s these are fleshy, natural creatures. Take the tonal correctness of the 9.02s and add attack decay and a fullness to the music.
More later. Must eat lunch.
Mike

stingfan · « **Reply #1 on:** 12 Jun 2007, 05:39 pm »

Thanks for the review Mike, it's finally great to see some end user feedback on the V2 performance. Seems like a not so insignificant snag there, talking about phase. It sure would seem to me that Nuforce would do well by explaining this in detail to all upgraders. Many of whom might not have the awareness to try such a phase adjustment.

Also, I can't tell, did you have 9SE's or just the 9.02s before the upgrade to 9SE V2. The reason I ask, is that your feedback sounds similar to my pre-V2 upgrade from 9.02 to 9SE. I think most of what you are noticing is the 9SE improvements upfront. I wonder if anyone has a pure 9SE to 9SE V2 A/B review coming soon. I'm contemplating the V2 upgrade to my new 9SE's, but await some more solid user review of the V2 performance/impact to the system. Thanks again Mike, happy listening!

mcullinan · « **Reply #2 on:** 12 Jun 2007, 05:55 pm »

They were just regular 9.02s. Casey mentioned that the original 9.02s sounded better playing out of phase, and the new upgraded v2 version sounds better in phase. My system (speaker) seems to like them out of phase though. For me it was a noticeable difference, in phase everything sonically was pushed up, no bass, forward, and edgy; out of phase went to a full, relaxed sound.
Mike

Russell Dawkins · « **Reply #3 on:** 12 Jun 2007, 06:02 pm »

mcullinan,
if you were using your sub, and depending somewhat on the crossover frequency to it, then the phase of the amp driving the speakers will determine whether your sub is in or out of relative phase through the crossover region. This will have a large effect on perceived bass through and near to that region.

nuforce-casey · « **Reply #4 on:** 13 Jun 2007, 03:43 am »

Quote from: stingfan on 12 Jun 2007, 05:39 pm

Thanks for the review Mike, it's finally great to see some end user feedback on the V2 performance. Seems like a not so insignificant snag there, talking about phase. It sure would seem to me that Nuforce would do well by explaining this in detail to all upgraders. Many of whom might not have the awareness to try such a phase adjustment.

For the interest of everyone following this thread, Mcuillinan revealed that his preamp is factory phase-inverting.

rustydoglim · « **Reply #5 on:** 13 Jun 2007, 08:00 am »

As for the V2 versus old 9.02 (ie V1) versus 9SE, we have specifically sent a Ref 9V2 to all the reviewers (all of them use Nuforce 9SE as their reference amp) for comparison.
So far all the feedbacks are that 9V2 is better than 9SE. Next they will hear 9V2SE. To put it simply, 9V2SE is a turbo version of 9V2, everything is just a little faster and more responsive.

By the way, we flip the heatsink on V2 board so it touches the top cover for better heat dissipation. Therefore V2 amps feel hotter on the top.

mcullinan · « **Reply #6 on:** 13 Jun 2007, 08:46 pm »

They sound really awesome!
Mike

stingfan · « **Reply #7 on:** 25 Jun 2007, 10:44 pm »

Great news here. Just shipped off my 1 month new 9SE's to be upgraded to V2. Already my favorite amps of all time, should be fascinating to hear the difference when I get back from my business trip on the 3rd of July. Review to follow for sure. Ready to push my Zu Druids to the next level.

mcgruder · « **Reply #8 on:** 26 Jun 2007, 02:09 am »

Congratulations on your decision to upgrade! Your impressions will be very valuable, especially to the SE owners.

There has not been much written about these V2's so far, understandable due to the recent rollout of the product. Really looking forward to a magazine review.

Once the SE V2 amps have had ample time to break in and you've sampled a wide range of music references, I would really appreciate a substantial review of the perceived improvements, and degree of improvement over the SE sound. Trying to be patient here

stingfan · « **Reply #9 on:** 26 Jun 2007, 05:45 am »

Definitely. The great thing about my system besides Nuforce, are the speakers. The Zu Druid Mk4's are are incredibly sensitive/efficient and revealing, so everything from noise floor, coherency, speed, dynamic range, and transients are exposed and wide open at demo time. What this means is the subtle differences seem to be magnified or at least clarified for almost any type of listener from casual to audiophile. Certainly was the case between the 9.02s and the 9SE's. Yes, I too am anxious to here what the V2 is all about. More to come, stay tuned!

mcullinan · « **Reply #10 on:** 26 Jun 2007, 05:20 pm »

I would like to know your impressions between the SE and SE v2 also, since I upgraded from 9.02. How much is attributable to the v2 upgrade.
Mike

Occam · « **Reply #11 on:** 26 Jun 2007, 05:40 pm »

Quote from: nuforce-casey on 13 Jun 2007, 03:43 am

.... and Nuforce output stage is very unique, as we float the output stage in a 'balanced' configuration known as 'Full Bridge' vs. other Class-D in the market (UCD, Icepower), which used half bridge. Full-bridge output stage is not ground referenced.

Not that unique

Just as an FYI, the B&O IcePower amps are also floating (single rail) bridged output switching amps; as are most of the lower powered Tripath based amps, Trends, Sonic Impact, Redwine, etc...

nuforce-casey · « **Reply #12 on:** 26 Jun 2007, 06:25 pm »

Quote from: Occam on 26 Jun 2007, 05:40 pm

Quote from: nuforce-casey on 13 Jun 2007, 03:43 am
.... and Nuforce output stage is very unique, as we float the output stage in a 'balanced' configuration known as 'Full Bridge' vs. other Class-D in the market (UCD, Icepower), which used half bridge. Full-bridge output stage is not ground referenced.

Not that unique Just as an FYI, the B&O IcePower amps are also floating (single rail) bridged output switching amps; as are most of the lower powered Tripath based amps, Trends, Sonic Impact, Redwine, etc...

Yes, Icepower has a full-bridge output stage, while Hypex UCD uses a half-bridge output stage. We are not familiar with Tripath (and the company is not around anyway....)

avta · « **Reply #13 on:** 27 Jun 2007, 02:09 pm »

Is it safe to switch speaker connections ie polarity with all speakers? I've got Magnepan 1.6's which I run with 9.02's.

nuforce-casey · « **Reply #14 on:** 28 Jun 2007, 05:40 am »

Quote from: avta on 27 Jun 2007, 02:09 pm

Is it safe to switch speaker connections ie polarity with all speakers? I've got Magnepan 1.6's which I run with 9.02's.

Certainly it's safe to connect the speakers in reversed polarity (black to red and vice versa) to experiment.

Viclondon · « **Reply #15 on:** 28 Jun 2007, 09:09 pm »

I have a pair of Nuforce Ref9SE v2 (which I am not sure if reverse polarity) and a Minimax preamp (which reverses) so I was not sure what to do.
I tried reversing and to my surprise I could not detect any difference

stingfan · « **Reply #16 on:** 29 Jun 2007, 04:13 pm »

Quote from: nuforce-casey on 13 Jun 2007, 03:43 am

Yes, Icepower has a full-bridge output stage, while Hypex UCD uses a half-bridge output stage. We are not familiar with Tripath (and the company is not around anyway....)

Ahhh...come come now. Everyone in this market knows Tripath, they were pioneers in digital amp markets, and everyone knows Redwine, Sonic, etc. That's like saying you're in the mp3 industry but haven't heard of Apple iPod, or PortalPlayer (makers of the chipset in iPod). And how would you be aware that Tripath "wasn't around anymore" if you were following their recent misfortunes?

I think this original poster has done a fair job of posting the true comparables here in the marketplace. I think it is important to acknowledge them earnestly for the less aware customers.

nuforce-casey · « **Reply #17 on:** 29 Jun 2007, 06:28 pm »

Quote from: stingfan on 29 Jun 2007, 04:13 pm

Quote from: nuforce-casey on 13 Jun 2007, 03:43 am

Yes, Icepower has a full-bridge output stage, while Hypex UCD uses a half-bridge output stage. We are not familiar with Tripath (and the company is not around anyway....)

Ahhh...come come now. Everyone in this market knows Tripath, they were pioneers in digital amp markets, and everyone knows Redwine, Sonic, etc. That's like saying you're in the mp3 industry but haven't heard of Apple iPod, or PortalPlayer (makers of the chipset in iPod). And how would you be aware that Tripath "wasn't around anymore" if you were following their recent misfortunes?

I think this original poster has done a fair job of posting the true comparables here in the marketplace. I think it is important to acknowledge them earnestly for the less aware customers.

Partly true, and partly as a joke....... not familiar with their architecture being full-bridge or half-bridge, as if you dig into their technology description, they also never disclosed how they do the modulation.

nuforce-casey · « **Reply #18 on:** 6 Jul 2007, 09:00 am »

http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue32/nuforce_v2.htm

mcullinan · « **Reply #19 on:** 6 Jul 2007, 12:59 pm »

http://www.stereotimes.com/

Another review..