Inexpensive PC's

lcrim · « **on:** 7 Aug 2003, 03:32 pm »

Can anyone recommend a low cost power cable that they have personal experience in using and provides good (great) performance gains.
I am not trying to start a debate but trying to get a recommendation and then try it in my system.
Thanks in advance.

F-100 · « **Reply #1 on:** 7 Aug 2003, 03:46 pm »

For a second, I was going to recommend you a Dell PC

If you're a tweaker, I would recommend Bob Crump Asylum PC. They're very easy to build and the price is cheap too

http://www.audiotweaks.com/diy/bobcrump_pc/page01.htm

cryotweaks · « **Reply #2 on:** 7 Aug 2003, 05:31 pm »

I am closing some out on my website..I decided not to sell them any more because the market is overcrowded. You can also look on AudiogoN for new/used ones as well.

Hantra · « **Reply #3 on:** 7 Aug 2003, 06:14 pm »

I agree. . .

I have made quite a few Crump Asylum cords, and they are the best for the money. If you want to spend a little more, I like the Virtual Dynamics Power II as far as sound. I HATE it as far as usability. It weighs like 5 pounds, and will be hell to use. Other than that, the Audience PowerChord are the best I have used to date. . .

B

cryotweaks · « **Reply #4 on:** 7 Aug 2003, 06:28 pm »

Only because you haven't used one of mine

Honestly though, I haven't heard the Audience Powerchord. I have heard many good things about it however.

Hantra · « **Reply #5 on:** 7 Aug 2003, 07:11 pm »

Quote

Only because you haven't used one of mine

Well. . .I'll try anything!

Honestly though, if I could bump myself to $599 for a PC, I would HAVE to audition the Kimber Palladian as well as yours. .

B

cryotweaks · « **Reply #6 on:** 7 Aug 2003, 07:21 pm »

Actually, the price is more like $399. I have gotten production time down from 10 or so hours down to 4 hours per cord. That saves a bit of $$$.

I may have some demo units in the near future. As soon as I assemble some more. Production is held up due to waiting for the adhesive backed ERS. I have been waiting since April for it. As have some of my customers. Nobody has any right now due to formula changes in the adhesive, and other production issues. A bit frustrating... Oh well. Mad Dog had an early prototype of my cord he was auditioning. You could try that to get a "taste". My new version uses 12awg wire, and Wattgate plugs/IECs. The version Mad Dog has uses 14awg Belden 89259 wire, a Schurter and Hubbell IEC/plug.

byteme · « **Reply #7 on:** 7 Aug 2003, 07:34 pm »

I've built a couple of Ernie's power cords, very easy build, very high quality. http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?cablpowr&1064251724

They are very similar to VH Audio's cables - http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?cablpowr&1065269029 and a similar price.

I've used Virtual Dynamics Power 3 and Power 1 cables as well as Zu Birth and the ones I made are at least as good, plus it was fun learning. Besides, I found it helpful to spend a little $$ and decide if power cords were "worth it" tweaks and if they really made a difference before spending the really big $$.

mojoman · « **Reply #8 on:** 7 Aug 2003, 09:41 pm »

I've been using Zu Births for a while. I can't really comment on any comparison wiht other cables because I've only heard the birth but they did make a difference from the stock pcs. You can buy these on ebay quite often for $60 or so directly from Zu.

Mad DOg · « **Reply #9 on:** 7 Aug 2003, 10:32 pm »

Quote from: lcrim

Can anyone recommend a low cost power cable that they have personal experience in using and provides good (great) performance gains.
I am not trying to start a debate but trying to get a recommendation and then try it in my system.
Thanks in advance.

i've auditioned the basic cryotweak cord at my home in my system on my preamp and i found that it is a good low cost cable. the differences weren't eye opening but they were apparent to my ears. whether the differences would be considered performance gains is dependent on your ears. i felt that it helped to tame some of highs which i liked. background was blacker as well. the difference was there, but not as great as upgrading my preamp. as with everything, your results may vary from mine so the only way to know is to audition it for yourself.

Mad DOg · « **Reply #10 on:** 7 Aug 2003, 10:55 pm »

Quote from: cryotweaks

...Mad Dog had an early prototype of my cord he was auditioning. You could try that to get a "taste". My new version uses 12awg wire, and Wattgate plugs/IECs. The version Mad Dog has uses 14awg Belden 89259 wire, a Schurter and Hubbell IEC/plug....

yes, i did audition this cord.

the above power cord is great if you are trying to eliminate the final bit of "brightness" in your system. it also serves to help increase blackness and decreasing floor noise. the decrease in floor noise was audible but not large enough to measure. i found that it worked better on some types of music more so than others. for example, the difference was quite apparent with classical music while not as much so with rock.

lcrim · « **Reply #11 on:** 7 Aug 2003, 11:32 pm »

I thank those of you who took the time to reply to my post re: cheap power cables.
A pc that costs a third of the price of the component it is carrying power to strikes me as massive overkill.
No offense, but a recommendation from a manufacturer is automatically suspect.
I guess I should have defined low cost-$100 give or take is a sane price, so other than Volex what does that leave?

cryotweaks · « **Reply #12 on:** 7 Aug 2003, 11:50 pm »

Just for the record. I did tell you that I had several discontinued cords for sale. They are $40. My apologies for neglecting to say that.

The topic drifted, as it usually does, but my original post was exactly what you asked for. It would be silly of me to offer you anything else...

Good Luck!

Regards,

Mike

ton1313 · « **Reply #13 on:** 8 Aug 2003, 02:33 am »

I second the Zu Birth, or any other PC from Zu. But for low cost, the Birth is the winner.

BOK · « **Reply #14 on:** 8 Aug 2003, 03:05 am »

I too "third" the Zu Birth..... picked my first one up (some time ago, btw) from them at auction , and just bought a 1.5 Birth last month on AGON.
Paid 75.00, shipped, for each. Excellent cord for this price... very good, in fact.

I also have built my own cords with 83802. Great DIY cord, and if terminated with good connectors, it is actually damn good.

I also use an HT Fantasy, a HT AC11, and a Audience PowerChord.

Against these pricier cords, you can do pretty well with the Birth and the 83802 DIY for the price.
Check out Audiogon, as used power cords are plentiful, and are not exactly selling like hot-cakes these days. You can find a nice cord for <$100., or near that, if you spend the time to peruse.

Good Luck,
BOK

satfrat · « **Reply #15 on:** 8 Aug 2003, 05:41 am »

Quote from: lcrim

I thank those of you who took the time to reply to my post re: cheap power cables.
A pc that costs a third of the price of the component it is carrying power to strikes me as massive overkill.
No offense, but a recommendation from a manufacturer is automatically suspect.
I guess I should have defined low cost-$100 give or take is a sane price, so other than Volex what does that leave?

Hi, I`m in agreement with your that +/-$100 is plenty enough to spend on a power cord that will give you positive improvements in a component`s sound/performance. I`ve replaced captive PC`s on all my components using Acme cryoed silver IEC panel terminals from DedicatedAudio. I`ve tried PC`s from SignalCable (so-so), BPT Clarity-10 (good), but I struck paydirt with Venhaus`s flavor3 for digital components w/o ground and flavor 2 for analog w/ or w/o ground (just a matter of removing the drain ground). Those PC`s have shined on anything I`ve tried them on from subwoofer, sat.receiver, tv, etc. For $60- $100, Chris VenHaus`s PC`s do the trick for me. So that`s where I shop for PC`s, 5 so far. Regards, Robin

satfrat · « **Reply #16 on:** 8 Aug 2003, 05:46 am »

Quote from: cryotweaks

Actually, the price is more like $399. I have gotten production time down from 10 or so hours down to 4 hours per cord. That saves a bit of $$$.

I may have some demo units in the near future. As soon as I assemble some more. Production is held up due to waiting for the adhesive backed ERS. I have been waiting since April for it. As have some of my customers. Nobody has any right now due to formula changes in the adhesive, and other production issues. A bit frustrating... Oh well. Mad Dog had an ...

You must be talking about the ERS tape, heh? There is no adhesive problem in the 8" x 11" sheets as of a couple of months ago. Regards, Robin

cryotweaks · « **Reply #17 on:** 8 Aug 2003, 01:14 pm »

It was the same adhesive for both. It was just so aggressive that once it was placed, that was it. That may work for the sheets, but when you are using tape, its nice to be able to lift the tape up and re adjust once in awhile. You couldn't really do that with the tape as it was. Hence the "new" adhesive formula. It is supposed to be more forgiving. Hopefully it will be out by late August. I don't know of anybody who has any adhesive backed ERS in stock right now. It is all gone...

Hantra · « **Reply #18 on:** 8 Aug 2003, 01:41 pm »

Quote

Hi, I`m in agreement with your that +/-$100 is plenty enough to spend on a power cord that will give you positive improvements in a component`s sound/performance.

OTOH, it depends on how much of that last few percent you want to eek out of a component, or system. Example. . . The best system I have ever heard was about 10% better than mine, IMO. That system was also about $135,000. So, to extract that last few percent, the price jumps suprexponentially. It is not unreasonable to think that a $1000 power cord will give only a few percent improvement over a $100 cord.

B

Occam · « **Reply #19 on:** 8 Aug 2003, 04:28 pm »

Quote

OTOH, it depends on how much of that last few percent you want to eek out of a component, or system. Example. . . The best system I have ever heard was about 10% better than mine, IMO. That system was also about $135,000. So, to extract that last few percent, the price jumps suprexponentially. It is not unreasonable to think that a $1000 power cord will give only a few percent improvement over a $100 cord.

And the very same can be said of the $6 Volex cord in comparison to most $100 power cords. Why the tremendous price differential? Because the Volexs (Belden sold their PC operation to Volex) are mass produced by machine, sold in mass to a far larger market that doesn't require endless hand holding and assurances to an insecure market. (I'm being far too charitable in calling it 'hand holding'.)

Folks will tend to dismiss these Volexes out of hand because they are so inexpensive, and to do otherwise would call into question their own purchases. I've used the Volexes and they're great cords. The improvements offered between the Volexes and the typical OEM cord are greater than the difference typically between a Volex and the 'high priced spread'. Their sins are of omission rather than comission.

Buy the Volexs and be done with it. If later, you can rationalize the incremental costs for those incremental benefits of the audiophile approved cords (I have), put them on your computer, your tv... their sheilding will keep the noise from the switching supplies from polluting the ether and mucking up the sound of your audio system.