[jones rush]

"I have early version of Le Amp 2 hooked up to a pair of 9.0s for testing. I invited Namphung to listen. Her comment was it sounded the same as Le Amp. My feeling is that there are differences in sound but these are mostly due to the addtional power and not a characteristic of the amp itself."

So, Namphung thinks it sounds just like the first Le Amp ?. A bit of a disappointment, don't you think ?. I mean, the review of the original Le-Amp at TNT was good, but far from superb, at least when money is no object. Also, people like Curt found ways to improve the sound of the Le Amp, by a pretty discernable factor. Also, Michael now tell us to compare the Le Amp against any other amp in the world. If the Le Amp 1 is,sound quality wise, just like the 2, then I don't see the 2 compares very favourable against ANY other amp in the world, as TNT already said.

I hope that eventually the Le Amp 2 will turn out to be more than just a cosmetic face lift + more power.

There are less powerful amplifiers than the Le Amp 1, which sound much better, they also cost much, much higher, but Michael said "money is no object" about the Le Amp 2.

[hk29]

I'd wait for more reviews.  The LeAmp2 is a completely different amp design than the original LeAmp so there's no way they'll sound the same.

Eitherway for $400 for the original LeAmps and $600 for twice the power than the original LeAmps it is still a bargain.

But that's just my opinion.  I can't wait to hear the reviews.  THere are a few LeAmp owners that bought the LeAmp2 so we should get some great reviews...

[jones rush]

hk29,
The fact the Namphung said she didn't hear a difference between the Le Amp 1 and 2, bothers me less than the fact that Michael then said something like "good amps should all sound the same"...
Don't get me wrong, I agree with that statement, since after all, all amps tries to create a reproduction of the original sound, and those which are very authentic at doing it, will sound the same, very much like the original sound itself.

But, the Le Amp, with all due respect, does NOT sound as good as ANY amp out there. In all of the reviews of the Le Amp, the reviewers always said that it's not as good as some of their ~$2000 (for two channel) amps.

Now Michael is saying that the Le Amp 2 should be as good as it gets for this type of amp technology. This makes me wonder, then how come he agree with Numphung that the difference from the original Le Amp isn't big enough ?, this suggest that if Michael's theory about the Le Amp 2 is correct (that it IS as good as it gets) then the difference between the original Le Amp and the best amps out there, is only minor, and all the reviewers are just nit picking when they say that the original Le Amp is not as good as the best amp they have ever heard. This also means that if Namphung would have heard the orginal Le amp against a superb $5000 USD amp, she would have said that they sound exactly the same.

Namphung made things so complicated now!. Why couldn't she just say: "OMG!!!, the Le Amp 2 is so much better!!!, it's like a veil has been removed from the speakers". I mean, people were saying the exact same thing after Curt's recommended tweaks for the orignal Le amp, so why can't Numphung say that for a WHOLE NEW DESIGN ?, which incorporates into itself all the tweaks the Curt suggested, plus many many more. And more important, why did Michael had to agree with her ?, or at the very least, why did he have to post all this stuff ?.

[Marbles]

hk29,
The fact the Namphung said she didn't hear a difference between the Le Amp 1 and 2, bothers me less than the fact that Michael then said something like "good amps should all sound the same"...
Don't get me wrong, I agree with that statement, since after all, all amps tries to create a reproduction of the original sound, and those which are very authentic at doing it, will sound the same, very much like the original sound itself.

But, the Le Amp, with all due respect, does NOT sound as good as ANY ...

Jones, take it easy....

I've heard the LA with the cap installed in my system, and I've heard the LA2's at the Midwest audiofest.

I was not familiar with the source components used at the MAF, but they were played on custom speakers made for me.

The systems did not sound alike to me, but again I was not familiar with the room or source equipment.

The LA2's sounded more Bryston and clean than the original LA's w/cap.

At the time I recomended them pretty easily as amps for surround channels for HT's.  They could be great amps for primary speakers but I never AB'd them so it would be hard for me to say.

What I can say was the system seemed very "clean" sounding.

I'm sure they are worth every cent you paid and compared to the competition at similar prices, I'm sure  you will be very happy.

They will not be the best amp ever at any price, since no amp is, was, or will ever be that to all people.

If your gripping because of the wait, just take a big breath, relax and tell yourself that no matter how long nOrh says it will be, triple the time and you will get pretty close to the actual release date.

[jones rush]

I'm sure they are worth every cent you paid and compared to the competition at similar prices, I'm sure you will be very happy.

Stop being cynical, what do you mean by "compared to the competition at similar prices" ?. The target audience that Michael aims for with the Le Amp 2 is EVERYBODY. "Everybody" means including those who are willing to spend thousands of $ on one monoblock. After Michael imply such things, how can you expect that I'll be happy if it will just be better than the crap which is sold at these prices at the U.S ?. I never heard Michael exaggerates about anything. When I bought my 9.0's, I got exactly what he said, one of the best dynamic cone, two way speakers money can buy. the 9.0's have proven to be exactly like this for the last two years, when I compared my 9.0's to just about anything I could put my hands on, and got to the same conclusion always, even when comparing to some speakers which cost x10 as much, the 9.0's, overall, sounded at least as good, or better.

I didn't ask Michael to hype the 9.0's as best in its category, he did it himself, risking his good and honest name, and he was right, at least according to my book.

I accept no less with the Le Amp 2, if Michael say it can go head to head with just about anything, I want it to be true. Sounding the same as the original Le Amp, only with more power, will not bring the Le Amp 2 to this level, and Michael knows it, so I'm totaly confused about this whole "Nampung say they sound the same, and to the most part I agree" issue.

[Marbles]

Well, Jones, you will just have to wait and hear for yourself then in your system.

[jqp]

Yeah, jones rush

Just chill. For someone with 2 posts, you sure seem to be on a mission. Don't try to torture something that mbarnes quoted Namphung as saying, put together with mbarnes theory about how pure amps should sound, into some kind of argument that Le Amp 2 will not be the best amp in the world.

norh isn't claiming that in the first place. If you want to try to figure out what he means, here is what has been said about Le Amp by mbarnes:

"Le Amp is a great sounding amplifier. It remains a great sounding amplifier. Le Amp 2 will be a great sounding amplifier. The major difference between the two will be that Le Amp 2 is more powerful. The sound is more powerful."

"What I mean by Le Amp 2 being the flagship is that we think that it will be our most expensive solid state amplifier and we see little need for a more expensive amplifier in our line. It achieves all the goals we set out."

"We invite people to put Le Amp 2 up against any amplifier and write about the results "

You ordered an amp (I assume from your post) from a company whose most expensive, flagship amp is $195, $300 after the special. I would take a step back and look at the big picture.

Don't kid yourself that "audiophile quality" means the very best in the world. That is just nonsense.

norh prides itself on making big bang for the buck audio gear that is audiophile quality. They even delight in showing how overpriced much of the audiophile gear is by coming out with low priced products, which also get very good reviews. Part of the norh philosophy is that at a certain point, a component is "good enough" diminishing returns kick in. When something new comes from norh we invariably find that there is something better out there, at some multiple of the price of the norh product.

Many feel that there are better speakers out there than the 9.0, although I am not sure about 2-way speakers. But I am not concerened. I have 2 pairs. I also have 2 Le Amps. I don't think they are the best monoblocks in the world either.

If you can't handle the heat, cancel your order.

[jackman]

Who gives a phucket what Namphong heard or didn't hear...

Jones Rush, did Namphong suddenly become an expert on what amps should sound like?  I don't believe she is the designer or the official listener of the products.  Secondly, she probably didn't do a side by side comparison of the two amps on the same system (a must for testing this type of gear) before making those comments.  I give her credit for being honest and offering her true thoughts (if those were her actual comments) on the LeAmp2 versus version 1.  It's all too common for people to gush over any new item their company puts out, regardless of its actual performance.  I do not know Namphung personally, however I met her at the first MAF.  She was a very nice and helpful person.  Someone who didn't seem to be afraid to speak her mind.

You are new to this site.  Hopefully, you will offer more useful commentary than your posts (to date) would indicate.  The Le Amp 2 looks like a very promising product.  It's priced right, looks to be high quality and well designed, and seems to offer a good value.  Why not at least wait until someone tests it up against other amps in a systematic manner before flying off the handle or jumping to conclusions?  Just a suggestion.

Jman

[Jason1]

I never heard Michael exaggerates about anything.

 

What I can say about the Pyramids is that they can be improved with a subwoofer but these sound very very close to the best speakers we have made above 70 Hz. The 9.0s are more refined. The 7.0s handle more power. the SM 6.9s have more bass. However, in terms of open, smooth, lifelike sound, I don't think even the most critical audiophile will fault this speaker. It sounds much better than we expected.

I can honestly say we think that this speaker sounds too good for the price. We have overshot our goal on this one.

You can look through every posting I have ever made you will not see me having made statements like this before.

I think that the Pyramids (in terms of sonics) is our breakthrough product. What is amazing is that despite its comletely new look, it has the same sound as our high end nOrh loudspeakers

[jones rush]

Guys, guys, I might be new HERE, but I'm not new to nOrh products, nor to forum discussions about it. I still remember the long debates we had about nOrh at Audioreview.com, when we hijacked the entire speakers forum there for several months ("Marbles" was there, I remember). After that, there was HarmonicDiscord, and then I kind of quit these discussions about nOrh for awhile, since I had no money left at the bank.

Anyway, the impression that Michael gives about the Le Amp 2, is that, if someone, who don't give a damn about money, comes into a store and ask for an A/B/X comparison of the best amps at the same category of the Le Amp 2 (meaning not tubes amps, digital amps etc.) he will find it just as difficult to reject the Le Amp 2, as to reject other $2000, $3000 or $X000 amps. That's "money is no object" class, by my book. It works for my 9.0's, I don't see why it couldn't theoretically work for the Le Amp 2. What ?, amps are a different story then speakers ?.

[Marbles]

Jones,

They could be the best amp in the world for you, and not for me, or vice versa.

Halcro amps are said to be best by some, but not others, same for Peter Thompsens Digital EAR amps.

"We invite people to put Le Amp 2 up against any amplifier and write about the results "

This is great PR, because if they "beat" the more expensive amp, that is a feather in nOrhs cap.  If not, the argument will be, that a $3000 should beat a $300 amp or something like that.


It MAY beat all amps out there, and it MAY not.

There is no reason to speculate on it though, until you get it in your system.  Then you can tell us how it compares to other amps you have had in your system.

[jqp]

... Anyway, the impression that Michael gives about the Le Amp 2, is that, if someone, who don't give a damn about money, comes into a store and ask for an A/B/X comparison of the best amps at the same category of the Le Amp 2 (meaning not tubes amps, digital amps etc.) he will find it just as difficult to reject the Le Amp 2, as to reject other $2000, $3000 or $X000 amps. ...

Ummm....that is the impression you want to create in your mind maybe

This is the impression he created:

"Le Amp is a great sounding amplifier. It remains a great sounding amplifier. Le Amp 2 will be a great sounding amplifier. The major difference between the two will be that Le Amp 2 is more powerful. The sound is more powerful."

"What I mean by Le Amp 2 being the flagship is that we think that it will be our most expensive solid state amplifier and we see little need for a more expensive amplifier in our line. It achieves all the goals we set out."

[jones rush]

I agree Marbbles.

But one more thing has to be cleared here:

Don't try to torture something that mbarnes quoted Namphung as saying, put together with mbarnes theory about how pure amps should sound...

jqr, that wasn't the way things were, I didn't try to weave this story out of small pieces. Michael wasn't being taken out of context there, all things were said IN context.

What I mean by Le Amp 2 being the flagship is that we think that it will be our most expensive solid state amplifier and we see little need for a more expensive amplifier in our line. It achieves all the goals we set out."

That's exactly the things which give me this impression.

You see, the nOrh 9.0s are in a certain league of sound, and so does the ACA2 pre, (and also CD1). If Michael thinks that he has achieved his goals the he set with the Le Amp 2 (he didn't say it about the original Le amp), then it must fit the league of the 9.0's and ACA2. Meaning, it shouldn't degrade from their capability to reproduce the signal in a faithful way. If the Le Amp 2 can achieve this, then it must be one of the better amps out there, in the money is no object class of products.

If it is indeed only more powerful than the original, and this excess of power is the only thing which creates the difference between them (like Michael said) then a lot of people are going to be disappointed, at least all those who made the tweaks for the original Le Amp. They will have to think of new tweaks to get the sound quality of the Le Amp2, to the one of the tweaked Le 1.

[jackman]

Hey Rush,

Maybe you should change your name to something like Jones "DON'T" Rush "to judgment".  You are putting too much in to too little information.  I'm not saying the LeAmp is a giant killer or the best amp ever made.  I don't even own any nOrh gear (although I have had some stuff over the years and it was all good).  Wait until you read a credible review from someone who actually listened to the amp and compared it to other amps in its price range.  If anyone in Chicago would like to compare it directly to my AVA amp (after Frank works his magic), you are welcome to come over to my house.  If these amps are anything close to the 550EX, they will be real winners.  

You sound like a guy at Harmonicdiscord who loved to jump all over nOrh for little or no reason.  It got old fast.  If you listen to the amps and compare them to other amps directly, post whatever you find, good or bad.  It seems like you are getting all worked up over very little.  At least wait until a couple people have actually tested the amp.  

If you are a troll (I'll give you the benefit of the doubt), you won't last long on this site.  

Good luck,

Jman

[jones rush]

I'm not a troll. I can prove with my nOrh 9.0 serial number.

[Marbles]

That's interesting, please PM me thier serial numbers.

[jones rush]

That's interesting, please PM me thier serial numbers.

Marbles, I'm going to send you the PM right away man, but that's so funny. I remember that at AudioReview, some long, long time ago, we asked someone to give his serial number of his 9.0's, I think it was that "Pazzi" guy from Florence, Italy, who later did two contradictory reviews of the 9.0, and everybody thought he got a new 9.0 as a present from Michael.

[Marbles]

I'm not a troll. I can prove with my nOrh 9.0 serial number.

I did not ask for them until after you offered to provide them.

To me they are meaningless.

We do not ask anyone to prove anything here.  Enjoy the site, and report on the LA 2's when you get them.

For future reference to all reading this, I have not found a nOrh speaker to have a serial number yet.  The drivers sure, but the speakers, nope.

So if anyone gives you a serial # on a norh speaker (as apposed to a serial number off a driver) be VERY sceptical.

At least the following speakers did not have serial #'s: 9.0's, 7.0's, 4.0's, 3.0's, 5.2's, and 6.6's

[jackman]

I remember that at AudioReview, some long, long time ago, we asked someone to give his serial number of his 9.0's, I think it was that "Pazzi" guy from Florence, Italy, who later did two contradictory reviews of the 9.0, and everybody thought he got a new 9.0 as a present from Michael.

Is there any chance that you were at the Dillon and the Dead show yesterday?  Just get lots of rest, drink lots of fluids and the voices should go away before long...

Next question, Rush.  I'd like to know, what planet are you from?  I was going to ask you what country you are from but thought that might be too personal.  

Lastly, I'm going on the limb, but I'll make a couple educated (okay, uneducated) guesses:

1.  You do not own any nOrh gear
2.  You are one of the A-holes who loves to attack nOrh products for no apparent reason
3.  You are a troll (there, I said it)
4.  This last one is a stretch: You are that crazy ex-business partner or designer that Barnes hired a couple years ago to do the Multiamps.  If my memory serves me right, you messed that up and are probably halfway through a bottle of cooking sherry trying to kill the tast of sour grapes.  

Do all of us a favor, tell us who you REALLY are.  I'm not saying you should stop posting.  Until Peter from AVReality comes back and has an episode, you're the craziest thing going.  

Marbles, don't hold your breath for this guy to give you seriel numbers from speakers he doesn't have.  That would be some trick!

Jman

[NealH]

Who in hell is Namphung?  Sorry about being stupid but I have been reading this thread and still don't know who this broad is.  Since she has been referred to as a she then I presume it is a female.  And, I know I will get riddled for this but, I never met one that had a good ear.  They sure seem to have an affinity for money though.