Power conditioning and cryo treating

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byteme

Power conditioning and cryo treating
« on: 2 Aug 2003, 02:18 am »
This is going to be a relatively brief review of some things I’ve picked up and installed over the last two weeks.  Prior to these purchases my power setup was as follows:

Two dedicated 20amp lines each terminated with P&S hospital grade 20amp outlets.  One for digital one for analog.  Power treatment stuff consisted of Vans Evers Clean Line digital Jr. and Tripp Lite isobar for digital side.  PS Audio UO High Current and Ernies PoBox for the analog side.  Odyssey amp directly into the wall.  

With this I had a bit of hiss audible from 3-4 feet but barely noticeable from the listening position.  I also had an odd buzz (not ground loop hum) when nothing but the amp was on that went away as soon as I turned the preamp on.  Very odd.  On the recommendation of Pyschicanimal I picked up a  couple of OneAC isolation transformers off of eBay.  A CP1103 3 amp and CP1102 2 amp.  The 3 amp I have into the wall and it powers Transport, DAC, DVD player and Tripplite isobar for the rest of the digital stuff (changer, sat. box)  The 1102 plugs into the wall and powers only the preamp.  Upon first listen to these I sold the Vans Evers.  These things are awesome!  Especially considering I got both for less than $60 shipped.  Things were a noticeable notch quieter.  

Also on Psychic’s suggestion I ordered some Hubbell 5262 and 5362 double cryo’d outlets from Virtual Dynamics.  3 5262 (15 amp) outlets for the OneACs and two 5362 (20 amp) outlets for the wall.  I have to admit, I was more than skeptical about gains cryo’d outlets could produce – especially at $30 a pop.  Today I had a chance to open up the OneACs and swap outlets, while in there I upgraded the jumpers between the two 1103 outlets to higher gauge wire, cleaned everything, cut off the spade terminations on all of the wire going to the outlets and progolded everything.  I also used blu-tac equivalent on the face of the outlets that came almost in contact with the cases and also on the “’mickey mouse ears” on the top and bottom of the outlets so they wouldn’t vibrate or come in contact with the case at all.  I then replaced the P&S wall outlets with the 20 amp stuff and again, re-cut and stripped the wires and progolded them.  

I was absolutely NOT prepared for what happened when I plugged everything in.  Silence.  From EVERYWHERE, listening position, 5 feet, 3 feet, 1 inch.  Just quiet.  With only the Stratos powered on, quiet.  With all the 2 channel gear on, quiet.  With all the HT stuff on, quiet.  Get the idea?  So, how was it once music is on?  As you would expect, quieter backgrounds and more detail, but also, more emotion, more dynamics, more detail and clarity.  

If you are, or even if you aren’t in the market for power conditioning look into this.  For less than $200 I improved my system more than I thought it could have been with something so simple.  The only thing you have to be careful about is that you don’t “overdrive” the amp rating of the OneACs.  For anything but an amp or a receiver you shouldn’t have a problem.  I continue to follow the manufacturer’s instructions for amps – they go right into the wall (two via the PS Audio) so this isn’t even an issue.  Get one for your digital side and one for analog, sit back and be wowed!

Psychicanimal

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Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #1 on: 5 Aug 2003, 04:37 am »
What--no replies yet?  Ah!, one is supposed to spend a lot of $$$ to get proper filtration, I see...

Well, the answer is NO :nono:

I have seen the insides of the Vans Evers Digital Jr and let me tell you--it's a joke :jester:

Truth is cryo'ed outlets are THE most cost effective improvement in an audio system


Where's Eric the Red?

Where's Nathan?

Where's Kimosabee?


 :peek:



Yeah, right.

Tonto Yoder

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Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #2 on: 5 Aug 2003, 03:09 pm »
Quote from: Psychicanimal
What--no replies yet?  Ah!, one is supposed to spend a lot of $$$ to get proper filtration, I see...
.

The fact no one has replied doesn't justify the conclusion that members are saying proper filtration has to be expensive. byteme's review seems sensible and might well lead members to check out isolation transformers or cryo'd outlets. Part of its appeal is its moderation--"If you are, or even if you aren’t in the market for power conditioning look into this. For less than $200 I improved my system more than I thought it could have been with something so simple."

witchdoctor

Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #3 on: 9 Aug 2003, 03:55 pm »
I installed cryoed outlets and noticed a substantial improvement. Bill       Laurent at 8th Nerve shared some outlet tweaks with me that take 2 minutes and will improve things another 10% and is free. I am sworn to secrecy but you can ask him at the 8th Nerve room.

Is that the kind of non expensive tweak you mean?

Psychicanimal

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Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #4 on: 9 Aug 2003, 11:19 pm »
Quote from: witchdoctor
I am sworn to secrecy but you can ask him at the 8th Nerve room.


Oh it's a secret.... :scratch:

I'll tell you one:  those Salamander clone racks 8th nerve sells won't get you far... :nono:  Keep it  a secret.

audiojerry

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Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #5 on: 13 Aug 2003, 02:38 pm »
I guess most folks have checked out for the summer...

For those still around, I am also a very satisified Oneac transformer owner. I have two 3 amp models. One for digital and the other for preamp and phono stage.  They were less than $50 each off Ebay over a year ago.

They make one of the most instantly noticeable improvements of any component I've installed.

I'm gonna have to try the cryo outlet thing on them when I get out of my lazy mode.

I should add that the Dezorel combined with the Oneac's made everything better.

Psychic, I hope you are taking care of that Dezorel - you have had it for FREE! I don't anticipate doing anything with selling it until Fall. No one seems to be interested right now.

Thanks for the detailed post, Byteme.

JoshK

Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #6 on: 13 Aug 2003, 03:33 pm »
Jerry,

When you say Oneac "transformer" are you referring to what they call a line conditioner?  What model do you have, or would you know?

audiojerry

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Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #7 on: 13 Aug 2003, 04:22 pm »
I don't know the model off hand. They are at home, and I am at work.  :cry:

The Oneac is a balanced isolation transformer used primarily for industrial / laboratory applications, I believe, such as powering electron microscopes, which need clean, grunge-free power. I guess you can find various used models from time to time on ebay. They are not attractive, but they really work.

byteme

Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #8 on: 19 Aug 2003, 03:32 pm »
Jerry,

No problem.  I was really rather blown away how much difference a little cleaning, some Progold, Dynamat extreme and the cryo'd outlets made.  As I said, before, when the preamp was off and the amp on, you could hear a buzz coming from the speakers.  Sometimes it was rather loud, usually later at night which was odd I thought.  However, now, just silence and much greater dynamics!  I wonder what better power cords would do??!?!??!   :o

It's worth it.

byteme

Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #9 on: 19 Aug 2003, 03:36 pm »
Quote from: JoshK
Jerry,

When you say Oneac "transformer" are you referring to what they call a line conditioner?  What model do you have, or would you know?


Josh, the 1103 is the model you're after if you want the 3 amp version.  It's not a line conditioner, although it does that too.  As Jerry mentioned it's an isolation transformer made to totally isolate everything behind it from everything in front of it AND put out clean as hell power.

There are two on ebay right now:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3041076720&category=20315  (been there forever, in my opinion they are asking too much)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3040888727&category=20315  

Oh, also, on my 1103, when I opened it up again to put in the Dynamat Extreme I took out the power switch and just ran the juice right in from the wall to the transformer.  It's easy to do and pulls a switch out of the chain, which has gotta be good!

ton1313

Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #10 on: 19 Aug 2003, 03:54 pm »
I have one of those, (maybe not the same mfg.) in my basement. It was pulled of of a large microfilm viewer/printer. It has an audible hum, but keeps the power quite level. I took it out of my system, due to some comments that "since it is made for copiers, not sensitive audio gear, it might be detremental. Any thoughts on this? If I should be using it, how do I get rid of the hum?

byteme

Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #11 on: 19 Aug 2003, 04:32 pm »
Ton,

I've heard that some of them do humm, and if I'm not mistaken that's why OneAC is preferred over some of the other iso transformer makers, they are quiet!  The humm is probably transformer humm and therefor I think you're stuck with it.  Maybe you could unload that one on ebay and use the proceeds to pick up a OneAC?

As for "not being for sensitive audio gear" that's bull.  If it can provide clean power then why not?  Whoever told you that must have spend over $1k on some Tice product!  Like I said, this it clearly (no pun intended) the best money I've spent on power and power conditioning, without question.

JoshK

Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #12 on: 19 Aug 2003, 05:30 pm »
Thanks Byteme,

One more question.  Does anyone know how large of one I would need for a computer?   I see that they have a 6.7amp model which would be good for preamps and such but I am not sure how many amps are needed for a computer.

I live in an apartment where I am sure all the plugs are on the same circuit.  I would like to isolate some of the noisy things like computers from dumping garbage onto the line that my stereo is on.

Psychicanimal

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Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #13 on: 19 Aug 2003, 07:00 pm »
I use a ONEAC 1107 for my computer.  Its rating is 6.25 amperes.  Sweet.

The ONEACs are musically benign because they're essentially a C-core transformer and capacitors used as parallel filters.

Tonto Yoder

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For the cryogenically-minded..........
« Reply #14 on: 19 Aug 2003, 07:10 pm »
http://www.virtualdynamics.ca/products/HWS/BKR

No exp. with these, but looks interesting:  seems like it'd be best to clean up as many links in the electrical chain as possible?????

ton1313

Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #15 on: 20 Aug 2003, 02:15 am »
FYI

The one I have is from IEPS Electronic & is the 12 Amp model.

Bwanagreg

Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #16 on: 20 Aug 2003, 02:20 pm »
I just picked up a pair of OneAC CP1110's - rated at 8.4 amps. They are very quiet. I can feel a slight hum when I touch the case, but can't hear it at all unless I stick my head next to the units. I plugged my digital (CD and DVD) into one, and my preamp into the other. The amps are plugged into the wall. I have to be careful with preliminary assessments (I got them last night), but I swear another layer of grunge and digital glare has been removed. And I did have an API power wedge before (I'm using it now only to isolate my subwoofer's Behringer parametric EQ). Sweet!

This may be one of the great bargains in audio. I am going to have a hard time justifying spending more on power conditioning in the future - my API was several hundred dollars!

byteme

Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #17 on: 20 Aug 2003, 02:42 pm »
Quote from: Bwanagreg
This may be one of the great bargains in audio. I am going to have a hard time justifying spending more on power conditioning in the future - my API was several hundred dollars!..


Couldn't agree more!  Better conditioning, better protection, lower noise floor and 10% of the price of most others!  Even after you tweak them with vibration damping and cryo'd outlets (possibly even upgraded power cord) you can't touch them for cost/performance.

Psychicanimal

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Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #18 on: 20 Aug 2003, 04:39 pm »
Quote from: byteme

Couldn't agree more!  Better conditioning, better protection, lower noise floor and 10% of the price of most others!  Even after you tweak them with vibration damping and cryo'd outlets (possibly even upgraded power cord) you can't touch them for cost/performance.


That is until you get a hold of bargain priced Clear Image T4 filters like I did...and a 2.6 KW Xentech Extreme isolation transformer for $70 including shipping!  :mrgreen:

Definitely the ONEACs are the most cost effective filters out there, dollar for dollar.  My 95 lb, 3000W ONEAC is pretty beefy and it filters hot. neutral and ground via capacitors.  :D

byteme

Power conditioning and cryo treating
« Reply #19 on: 20 Aug 2003, 05:47 pm »
Psychic - you think upgraded power chords would help these at all?  If so, which "flavor" CVH type cord would you use?