SET recs for <$1k

sts9fan · « **on:** 19 Apr 2007, 12:41 pm »

I am a total noob when in comes to tubes. I now find myself with a pair of Druids so I think it is only right that I try out a SET amp. I am looking to spend no more then $1000 shipped. I have been eyeing the Fi X and some decware models. I will absolutely buy used so anything <$1.5k new is probably ok. Also if anyone wants to trade for a Odyssey Khartago let me know.

Kris

robert1325 · « **Reply #1 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 12:44 pm »

Hi,

Just a question, is your SB3 still Stock? It might be better to have it modded by boldercables

Just a suggestion, you'll probably get a much easier smoother presentation with more depth and good bass.

sts9fan · « **Reply #2 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 12:51 pm »

Its on the list but not really high in the que. I need to fill my amp needs first. A modded sqeezebox with no amp don't do much.

robert1325 · « **Reply #3 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 12:57 pm »

the trends amp

The saying goes, Shit in is shit out

A better source might do more than a better amp

I could be wrong ofcourse

sts9fan · « **Reply #4 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 12:59 pm »

I am looking for amp recs and I am not putting shit in so thanks

robert1325 · « **Reply #5 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 01:13 pm »

Sorry, didn't mean to assault (edit: insult

) you ... Just something I've experienced when changing to a lesser quality source.
The t-amps sound very different with different sources.

I have listened to a Yarland el34 SET, it had slightly more details than the trends ta-10. a more open sound. But it did sound a bit light. Especially the highs and lows.

mcgsxr · « **Reply #6 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 01:17 pm »

If you would consider a Single Ended Pentode, I highly recommend being on the lookout for an old Magnavox EL84 console pull. I have one, and use it with my high efficiency Visatons, and it is quiet, and nice. FWIW, I use a Bolder modded SB3 into it, as my pre, and source.

Picked up my functional Maggie for less than US$200 shipped off eBay...

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=31096.0

If a 50+ year old amp suggestion does not float your boat, I have heard excellent things about the Almarro EL84 amps. Usually under $500 on Audiogon, when I see them.

lcrim · « **Reply #7 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 02:11 pm »

sts9fan:
As you are aware that you can use the SqueezeBox as your volume control you are probably looking for a power amp. I happen to like the EL84 pentode sound as Mark suggested. Its a nice warm sound and the tubes are relatively inexpensive in comparison to 2A3's or 300B's for instance. Since you have such efficient speakers, power is not an issue but there is a kit version of the old dynaco st-35 http://www.dynakitparts.com/store/ Which is an easy build and sounds terrific, it uses the EL84 is a push -pull topology and makes around 17 watts per. Hudson Audio http://www.hudsonaudio.com/ will build it for you if you don't feel up to DIY and he also has other alternatives. Check out his site and give him a call. I have no relation to this business, BTW.

JoshK · « **Reply #8 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 02:16 pm »

I'd probably look at Almarro amps, kits or vintage amps for restoration if it were my $1k and building it yourself was out.

miklorsmith · « **Reply #9 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 02:18 pm »

I had a Decware Taboo and sold it to Duggie. He liked his Almarro A-205 better. I found the Decware nice, but almost SS in its cleanliness. Neither of these amps are true SETs though.

As you know, SETs vary significantly in power output. Unless you like mellow music at quieter volume a 45 amp will probably run out of gas. As your rockin' goes up the scale, you'll need more juice. I think Sean at Zu likes 845-based SETs, which should put out in the neighborhood of 20 watts.

While the Druids are quite sensitive, I've heard they appreciate a little more juice in the caboose. When I had mine I only used them with small amps. In a large room, I found they can jump pretty high with 6 watts. Could you get away with a 2A3? Probably. Would you want a 300B sound? I wouldn't (generally) but you might.

Does the Fi give you the choice of 45s or 2A3s?

It would be hard to wrong with the Almarro.

JoshK · « **Reply #10 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 02:22 pm »

Welbornelabs has a DRD 300B SET monoblock kit starting at $1340 not including tubes (I'd skip the TJ tubes and opt for EH or JJ 300B's seperately anyway). Its a little over your range, but this is a proven and excellent design, mono blocks and has a high resale value.

http://www.welbornelabs.com/drd300b.htm

Bottlehead sells a SET kit or two as well...don't know their prices.

If you can't solder sling, you might find a buddy, local audiophile or a techy that would do it for you. This is a pretty straight forward amp to build, with no super complicated tricks.

JoshK · « **Reply #11 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 02:27 pm »

link to bottlehead's kits...

http://www.bottlehead.com/et/adobespc/paramount/paramount.htm

I like the fact that they use an active load on the input tube to linearize that stage. The input stage is the defining stage in a lot of SET amps anyway. The Camille CCS is one heck of a good active load too.

mcgsxr · « **Reply #12 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 02:28 pm »

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=40079.msg357145;topicseen#new

Here is a SET, right here on AC, and in the price range too - never heard it, just saw it.

Scott F. · « **Reply #13 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 02:40 pm »

Here is a very good sounding 2a3 that comes from Anthony Cirella at Handmade Electronics. I own an older version of this same amp and it is spectacular sounding. I don't think any amp in double its price range can touch it.

Handmade 2A3

He offers it in two versions, the Basic which uses standard parts (Hammond output transformers) and the Basic Special that has upgraded transformers and Teflon coupling caps. Mine is the Special except mine was built back when Black Gates were readily available. It has a rather industrial look to it, nothing too fancy but again, if you are looking to by 'pretty' with nicer casework, add to your budget. The review link on his website is to the old review I did over at TNT. Also, if you wanted to do a 45 version of the same amp, if you talked nice to him and sent him the money up front, I'd bet he's build it for you (I've heard the 45 version and it is just as good).

When it comes to triode strapping a pentode (ie, el-84, el-34, etc) or a chip amp, it just isn't the same as a true single ended triode. Not that the others can't sound very, very good.....it just isn't the same. There is more of the 'magic' in the sound provided by a 45, 2A3, 300B (pick you favorite triode) than the others. A replacement pair of 2A3's is only about $60. The Sovtek's he provides sound just fine BTW.

As others have mentioned, if your budget allows, the DRD's are very good. I own a pair and they are my primary amps. Some of the higher wattage (true) SET amps can be very good too if you can buy them right.

Just remember, when shopping for an SET (or any tube amp), caps and resistors can be changed out easily and inexpensively enough to bring more or less character or clarity to suit your tastes but the sound quality of the amp really boils down to this.......it's all about the iron. You will find the Bottlehead, Decware and Fi all use inexpensive iron. This is directly reflected in the price and sound quality.

robert1325 · « **Reply #14 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 02:45 pm »

Also have a look at http://www.tubelab.com/ , the SimpleSE amp could be very good ( kit form) Don't know exactly what it's going to cost but it's very flexible.

JoshK · « **Reply #15 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 02:51 pm »

Quote from: Scott F. on 19 Apr 2007, 02:40 pm

Just remember, when shopping for an SET (or any tube amp), caps and resistors can be changed out easily and inexpensively enough to bring more or less character or clarity to suit your tastes but the sound quality of the amp really boils down to this.......it's all about the iron. You will find the Bottlehead, Decware and Fi all use inexpensive iron. This is directly reflected in the price and sound quality.

100% agree. The James iron used in the Basic Special 2A3 you linked to is said to be very good iron for the money. For iron costing as much as his entire budget you can go to cobalt or nickel amorphous output, but with high quality silicon steel James is said to be up there among the best.

acresm22 · « **Reply #16 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 03:10 pm »

Here are a few SET suggestions in your budget:

Antique Sound Labs Tulip (used). This is a 2A3 amp that goes for around $700 on the used market. A friend of mine had one for a long time and loved it. I listened to it quite a bit too, and was mightily impressed. Also very quiet as far as SETs go.

I've also read nothing but good things about the Almarro A205, and these come in well under your budget (I've seen them used for under $500). I owned the Almarro A318...without having heard the A205, I think I'd recommend it before the A318, simply based on all the positive press. I liked the A318 well enough for awhile, but found that it lacked the bloom and detail of a DHT SET.

Much has been written on AC about the Vista Audio amps that Boris makes. I think his EL84 amps are particularly nice, based on the comments I've read.

Gabe Velez also makes a range of inexpensive tube amps, in kits or finished form. His 300B amp comes in under $1k, and he also offers a 6L6 SE amp and his stalwart Mag 15-15 EL84 pp amp, which is based on an old Magnavox circuit. Gabe also has a new EL84se amp that is based on a Magnavox circuit, which he's selling in finished form for $299. I've not heard his amps, but I've traded emails with him and he assembled a Bottlehead amp for me a few years back. Very nice guy. http://members.tripod.com/~gabevee/

Finally...here's one that I've not heard or seen, but there is a favorable review of it (also attached)....the IAG EL84 se amp. I'm also not sure if this amp is still in production, or if they'll just build one for you if you order. Sowter iron, high quality PCB, great looks....it deserves a close look.
http://www.iagaudio.com/
http://www.tubebuilder.com/EL84SE.html

Hope this helps.

Dan

sts9fan · « **Reply #17 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 03:10 pm »

Thanks for all the recs guys. I really don't want to do a kit because a I already have a few DIY projects that need completing (Zen V9 and Gainclone). I know I am not going to get a top performer but I am not expecting one. I want to find out what all the fuss is about for myself so I am not going to spend 1k on iron before I am sure I like it. I may go for a slightly more powerful tube amp to make sure I have bass.

mcgsxr · « **Reply #18 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 03:12 pm »

I know only enough to know that I won't get into a discussion around SEP vs SET!

Mine is not triode strapped, it runs pentode.

Here is a link to what some other knowledgeable folks had to say about the old Maggie.

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=80146

Dmason · « **Reply #19 on:** 19 Apr 2007, 03:23 pm »

www.diytube.com has an interesting 6B4G SET PCB kit with parts list, and Front Panel Express number for a milled chassis plate designed to fit the Welborne Labs hardwood chassis. It is designed for use with the James SE OPT, and by all accounts sounds pretty good. I am not sold on the idea of using boards for tube amplifiers. There seems to be a difference for the better in point to point soldered circuits, for a number of reasons I won't go into.

It is pretty hard to beat the sound of single ended 6BQ5's as well. NO, they don't have the DHT holographic sparkle and swirl sound, but they are warm, musical, and have plenty of bass. With good iron, these little tubes put out a cracking 4 - 6 watts in pentode, they are inexpensive and they ALL sound different.