How differently do I hear from you?

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Russell Dawkins

How differently do I hear from you?
« on: 16 Mar 2007, 03:51 pm »
I though some might be interested in an important little experiment by Sennheiser about 20 years ago.

They make or made a tiny omnidirectional microphone element which they sold as part of a binaural mic rig configured like a doctor's stethoscope, except smaller at the ear, so it could be worn with the mic elements at the eardrum held by a shaft slim enough not to present a significant obstruction to the sound waves travelling down the ear canal. This allowed the wearer's pinnae to have the same influence they would have on the sound he would otherwise hear. This was, in effect a personalized version of the "Kuntzkopf" (dummy head) made by the hallowed manufacturer, Neumann.

They arranged a session where a number of engineers and skilled listeners sat with these on and listened simultaneously to a musical performance of some kind. The output from each person's pair of microphones was recorded on a separate pair of tracks on a multitrack recorder, and the sources noted.

The fascinating thing was that on playback, each person was able extremely easily to identify his own pair of tracks. Once this was done and the validity of the test thus demonstrated, this meant that the differences heard when listening to others "ears" could be believed as a rare glimpse into just how differently one hears from another!

Unfortunately, these are some of the very few people in the world who really do know just how differently one of us hears from another.

This may be something to keep in mind when puzzling over differences of opinion over the sound of the same piece of gear.
« Last Edit: 16 Mar 2007, 05:03 pm by Russell Dawkins »

miklorsmith

Re: How differently does one hear from another?
« Reply #1 on: 16 Mar 2007, 03:54 pm »
Wow, that's neat.  It could explain a lot of why we can't agree on anything.  For a nifty experiment anyone can do, try manipulating the outside structure of your ear while listening.  Push them forward, pull them back, put one forward and one back simultaneously.  The degree of change is astounding, WAY more than cable changes or CD treatments.   :D

Now think how everyone's ears are shaped differently.  The sound collection mechanism alone is delivering a different sonic profile to the eardrum, nervous network, and brain.  Each of these last three is likely unique as well.

I have really big ears, so I hear better than you.   :lol:

Russell Dawkins

Re: How differently does one hear from another?
« Reply #2 on: 16 Mar 2007, 04:00 pm »
Bet mine are bigger!

Do you remember those leather ear flap-augmenter things that some wore, not all in jest, in around 1988?

nathanm

Re: How differently does one hear from another?
« Reply #3 on: 16 Mar 2007, 04:44 pm »
I've always thought that surgery would be the final frontier for audiophiles.  Going in to get that $50,000 ear augmentation operation.  We seem to get cosmetic surgery for everything else on our bodies, maybe the next thing is physical enhancement.  They could sell you the Audio Man Super-Hearo package where not only are your ears surgically enhanced for increased bandwidth and dynamics (golden finish ear tattoo optional), but you get a cool Audio Man cape and leotard.  These "mutant" audiophiles would tour the country winning ABX comparisons right and left and helping manufacturers improve their speakers.

ZLS

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Re: How differently do I hear from you?
« Reply #4 on: 16 Mar 2007, 04:55 pm »
The Law of Unintended Consequences:

    Would not augmented hearing allow you to hear all the distortions that inevitable in music reproduction?  Would not the end result be less enjoyment of your sound system? 
    Related question; is perfect pitch a blessing or a curse?

nodiak

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Re: How differently do I hear from you?
« Reply #5 on: 16 Mar 2007, 04:58 pm »
Thanks for the post Russell. Good to spread that knowledge!
Don

macrojack

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Re: How differently do I hear from you?
« Reply #6 on: 16 Mar 2007, 05:19 pm »
Great bit of info. Stimulates lots of questions but foremost is the matter of a standard or absolute sound. Plainly there can be no such thing. All of us have excellent hearing on the hearing end and none of us can rightfully challenge anyone else's perception. A lot of progress could be made in this and other forums if that notion was universally accepted.
Nathan'a idea about corrective surgery providing us with Spaack ears or something of the kind is science fiction today but by next week we may be seeing ads for it.
Thanks, Russell.

Scotty

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Re: How differently do I hear from you?
« Reply #7 on: 16 Mar 2007, 07:40 pm »
The last time I had my hearing tested was when I picked up some kind of upper respiratory infection which had affected my hearing. I heard a shift in the sound stage almost entirely into the left channel of the stereo system.This prompted a trip to an eye, ear, nose and throat specialist, and a referral to an an audiologist.The audiologist assured me that I really had nothing wrong with my hearing,  both of my ears had the the same measured response sensitivity which was dead flat within the error limits of the test procedure. They only deviated at 500 Hz where the right ear was down 6dB compared to the left ear. When I complained about how lousy my hearing was because of the hole at 500hz the audiologist laughed and said I had excellent hearing,in fact some the best she had ever measured. She went on to inform me that most peoples ears did not have any where near the same sensitivity curves compared one to another and they deviated from flat response a whole lot more than 6dB down in one ear at 500Hz. She thought I was being overly sensitive and a nitpicker about a very minor change in my measured response in one ear.   I eventually recovered the lost acuity at 500hz in my right ear after about three months. In light of what I was told by the audiologist the chances are excellent that from a physical standpoint alone we may not all be hearing the same thing.
In answer to ZLS, yes, possessing perfect and relative pitch is both a blessing and a curse. It impacts your enjoyment of flawed performances. It's like finger nails on a blackboard when someone is sharp or flat either instrumentally or vocally. Compositions with Dissonance are also kind of hard to take and I don't care for twelve tone compositions either. I don't know if it makes any difference to ones sensitivity to the distortions that occur when reproducing recorded music via our stereo systems. I don't think I am necessarily more sensitive or a better listener than
someone else. A trained listener can be just as sensitive to pitch variation
as I am and because of superior knowledge they can know exactly what note
is flat or sharp and where to find it on a piano keyboard. I, on the other hand because of a lack of education in music and specifically quitting piano lessons,
don't have a clue to what note is wrong or where to find it. In my view, training in listening is more important than having a natural gift.
Scotty
« Last Edit: 16 Mar 2007, 11:54 pm by Scotty »

stereocilia

Re: How differently do I hear from you?
« Reply #8 on: 21 Mar 2007, 04:40 pm »
If anybody is interested in further reading, the term you want to use to find information about head and ear-shape differences on sound is "head-related transfer function" or HRTF.  For measurement, it's more common to use a microphone outside the ear connected to a tiny flexible tube as close as possible to the eardrum.  Audiologists do that routinely when fitting hearing aids.  The way Sennheiser did it may be more accurate if not harder.

There are differences between people's HRTFs, for sure, but generally speaking there is a peak around 3 or 4 KHz.  Obviously, the curve changes as the sound source location changes.  So, the HRTF gives the auditory system critical information for finding where a sound is coming from.

It's interesting to think about that as a possible source for differing opinions about equipment performance.  But, my feeling is that ears are far less important in that realm than the brain.

Daygloworange

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Re: How differently do I hear from you?
« Reply #9 on: 21 Mar 2007, 05:21 pm »
Great topic Russell.

The answer to your question is apparently, lots. We just had another TAAS get together where we did some critical listening to a pair of turntables with different set ups, along with a CDP. We played the same vinyl on the tables, and the same recording on CD.

Although everyone heard the differences in TT's. People described the sound of the two tables differently, and had different ideas as to which sounded better, and for different reasons. I would say that there were basically two camps. It was fascinating, and, a little troublesome for me to reconcile, to be honest.

I noticed a similar thing at an after hours open house listening session for the TAAS at a local dealer's showroom. Same comparison. A/B different TT's, everybody hears the difference, but not everybody agrees. Again, it seemed like there was basically two camps.

Just for the record, my preferences seemed to be the minority. However, those that agreed with me, did so very strongly, and for similar reasons and philosophies. The ones that agreed with me, seemed to be ones with recording backgrounds, and electronic design backgrounds.

Cheers