[bubba966]

Any of you ever listen to redbook in 7ch Stereo?

I've only ever played with it once or twice in the past when someone's brought a disc over to mess with. In the past when I've messed with it it's felt like I'm sitting in the middle of the band. Kinda weird I felt.

But 'cause I'm bored I decided to toss in the single CD I own. And tossed it on in 7ch Stereo. And this disc doesn't seem to feel like I'm dead center of the band. It's actually not so bad, and I kinda like it in a way.

[shokunin]

When I had the DC-2 and MC12B, I did listen to redbook in Logic 7.  This was the one instance where I didn't really care for Logic 7.  Logic 7 defaulted for everything but 2 channel stereo listening (redbook).

However, L7 derived from 2 ch. wasn't bad, it was quite nice, it just didn't seem real to me.  It was the only time I felt Logic 7 felt a bit artificial and a bit center heavy.

[Sa-dono]

When I had the DC-2 and MC12B, I did listen to redbook in Logic 7.  This was the one instance where I didn't really care for Logic 7.  Logic 7 defaulted for everything but 2 channel stereo listening (redbook).

However, L7 derived from 2 ch. wasn't bad, it was quite nice, it just didn't seem real to me.  It was the only time I felt Logic 7 felt a bit artificial and a bit center heavy.

How much tweaking did you do?

[flintstone]

I do it all the time, rock music sounds much better. I do not car for two channel with only five speakers. The side channels from my sunfire theatergrand are derived from the front channels and not the rear, I find this much better for music. My room is on the large size: 27 ft. wide and 22 ft. deep so it's pretty easy to balance the sound. Sacd multichannel is were it really shines though.

[bob82274]

Not everyone has 7.1 bubba...  

But I will have 6.2 in a couple of weeks (phantom centre)!

Anyway... I listen to my techno and trance in 5 channel stereo all the time much to the dismay of my neighboors.  My favorite time to do this is when I am studying.  I can only imagine what everyone thought when I was doing it during exam time in the wee hours on the morn.  

[witchdoctor]

I use the same set up Flintstone has. I connected the side axis channels of my Sunfire TG3 to speakers that are above and to the side of my listening position. Great improvement in PL2.

[shokunin]

How much tweaking did you do?

Hey Sa-dono,

I tried extensively with the DC-2 and a fair amount on MC12B, on some discs the center channel would appear to be pumping (like vibratto) on/off on certain vocals, it was very faint and slight, but noticeable.  It didn't matter if vocal enhance was on or off.  Other times, the imaging just collapsed to the center and I had to fiddle with the center spread to get it the way I wanted and then realized I had almost had it back to stereo.  

L7 is pretty cool if you're just lounging and getting immersed in all around music, so in those instances it was fine.   There were a couple of the older DSP modes that I actually prefered over L7 on some R&B and Rock stuff.  I forget which ones on DC-2 and the MC12B (after the software update).

Don't get me wrong, I think Logic 7 is great and does wonders on DD/DTS and even more so on stereo TV broadcast.

[satfrat]

All this talk of 7.1 with the Sunfire GT2/3 has me wondering (and drooling). I have 6.1 in a 11'w by 17'long room. Works good with movies. Would wall speakers in the middle of the room be overkill and unappreciated or would they just complement the fronts? BTW, my front & rears are floorstanding. And would you mount the sides at the same level as the others (48")? Audiocircle is beginning to cost me mooocho money! And I`m lovin’ every minute. Regards, Robin

[flintstone]

Well Bubba, sometimes us audiophile/videophile types get to wraped up in our gear IMHO, music is for fun and to enjoy. I spend time on some of the other forum's and it seems like any mention of multichannel music in any form is a down right sin to some of these guys (I was of that mind at one time) I almost gave up the whole mess at one time, it was no fun anymore because everything always had to be just so (audiophile) in my systems, I hated those systems. Now I have a blast with my music, Most people that listen to my un-audiophile setup now days tell me that they have never listened to anything that sounded so good (of course I don't bring up the fact that two channel should never be played with more than two speakers). I still do listen to two channel sometimes, sounds great, but when the boy's stop by and the brews come out- 7 channel is were it's at in my room! Way more fun.

[Rob Babcock]

I agree on that: purists that balk at anything but 2 ch sitting in the dark in the sweet spot with a pipe and slippers can kiss off!   I've never heard 7 ch stereo but I often listen to rock & pop music in 5 channel stereo.  Sure, I can hear switching back and forth between direct 2 channel that there is some tonal change in the midrange, but 95% of the time, when people come over to listen to my rig and/or knock back a few cold ones, they much prefer the envelopment of MC.

Overall, though, I think PLII is the cats pj's.  Much better than 5 channel stereo with regards to the tonal balance matching pure stereo, especially with acoustic music.

But nothing can touch well done, true MC, IMOHO.

[flintstone]

Shure have to agree with you on the well done multichannel recordings Rob, I picked up the Beck multichannel a couple weeks ago-very good. I don't have PL II, wish I did as I have read nothing but good things about it for music use. I do have DVD-audio and SACD multichannel players though and some good recordings are now (about time) hitting the market.

[satfrat]

Well Bubba, sometimes us audiophile/videophile types get to wraped up in our gear IMHO, music is for fun and to enjoy. I spend time on some of the other forum's and it seems like any mention of multichannel music in any form is a down right sin to some of these guys (I was of that mind at one time) I almost gave up the whole mess at one time, it was no fun anymore because everything always had to be just so (audiophile) in my systems, I hated those systems. Now I have a blast with my music, Most people that ...

                        Flintstone or Witchdoctor, if you would, could you go back to my previous post and take a shot at answering my question on the positioning of the wall speakers? I also got another one for ya, I`m seriously thinking of replacing my Yamaha 6.1 receiver with a Sunfire GT3 hooked up with 2 Butler Audio BTD3150 tube hybrid amps for a total of 6 channels. OR I might go with a BTD5150 and a BTD3150 for a total of 8 channels. It all depends on the addition of the wall speakers as I want the 3 speakers in the front/rear that I have now. Could you give me an opinion using the info at my previous post? And can BOTH amps be connected to the Sunfire s they`ll power up automatically? Thanks a bunch! Oh yah, Flinstone, GET DPL2!!! You won`t listen to anything else after you`ve heard it. (Or I should say, I haven`t) Regards, Robin

[satfrat]

This post is in reference to my last one that never showed up on the post site. Regards, Robin

[flintstone]

Hi satfrat, The sunfire has level control for all 7 channels, as I stated the side channels are derived from front L/R channels and not the rears as is the case with a lot of pre/pros. This works out best for me as it wraps the front action around me and give huge front soundstage and brings music a new life on lots of recordings (rock, newage, ect.) and is just plain FUN!  As to your questions, You may want to check out and give lots of thought and research to the many new Pre/pro's on the market, with the shape of your room you may need delay for side channels, theatergrand II only has level adj. (don't know about theatergrand III), also if I run my fronts as large, my sides are large (this is fine in my system) but may not be in yours? check out the Lexicon pre/pros and also Meridian for maybe a better answer to your room setup needs. If you like tube amps for your front L/R speakers you can do that (make sure they have enought power for your needs). As far as side speahers go in your system I'm going to guess that you have your system setup on the short wall for your fronts, if this is the case you may want to raise the side speakers up so that the are not right on top of you, I would say di-poles would work best if we were talking about movies, but we're talking about music so mono-poles may be best? (hard to say). Bi-polers may be just the ticket in your case. As far as adding more channels, you can add as many as you want but must remember (they would only be a copy of the channel you added them to with no real info. or level adj. of their own unless provided for in the pre/pro). I would set up on the long wall if you could in a room like yours, this would give you much more choice and freedom of side channel speaker type and placement (My other room is almost the same size). In this setup you could move your rear floorstanders to the sides and add some smaller speakers to the rear of any type you need. I'll explain my setup a little bit so you'll understand why what works for me , may not work for you in your room. I built a new room last year: My system is setup on the long wall (27 ft.) and fires into the short wall (22 ft.), my couch is somewhat centered in the room. This gives my great flexability in speaker placement and all speakers are around 9 ft. from me in this setup, it also allows all speakers to be at ear level for sacd and dvd-audio multichannel music (you should hear the Beck sacd in this setup). This is why I think long wall setup would be best for you in your room if you can swing it. I use a Bent audio passive pre/amp incorporated into this system for two channel listening and the sunfire as pre for movies and multichannel music. Front channel amp is a Krell Ksa-250 which drives my Vmps super tower/r's for L/R and a Krell Kav-500 drives my center, side, and rear speakers (Vmps 626's). I have an Onkyo M-504 power amp that drives my Vmps sub for LFE. Sony XA777es is my multichannel player for sacd's and Technics Dvd-A10 dvd audio player does movies and multichannel Dvd-A's. I built this system for high dynamic range movies and multichannel music for this larger room. I still have a small two channel setup in my other room with Apogee centaur minors for the audiophile thing once in a while, very clean and audiophile but not near as much FUN! Hope this helps, Dave

[flintstone]

Satfrat, I am checking out a tubed 7 channel dpl II pre that I read about on another forum, thanks.

[satfrat]

Thanks Dave, this is JUST what I was looking for. Time delay on the side is a good thought as I do have my setup on the short wall with my rears on either side of my chair at 10ms to offset the fronts 10 feet away. All my floorstanders are on marble so the heights are at 48". I do have a spare pr. of bookshelf that I`m not using but seeing how I`ll have 2 spare receivers now?, maybe I`ll wait on this. I`m about ready (minutes acually) of ordering the Sunfire and 2 Butler tube hybrid amps (3 channels each/ 150w per ch). I can always get another 2 channel amp later. But for now, I`ll be more than happy leaving mid-fi for the highlife. The speakers will have to wait tho. But I so do wish I could hear a system such as your own. I`d be cashing in my retirement fund for sure. Regards, Robin

[flintstone]

Robin, don't cash in those retirement funds, wait till ya retire (Retired a year ago and cashed mine in! L.O.L., glad I waited till I had more time to listen.