SILVERRR Cables @ GREAT Prices.....Highly Reviewed (Updated)

TheeeChosenOne · « **Reply #40 on:** 15 Jul 2003, 01:30 am »

Just following up with you guys about the much raved about $75 Grover Silver ICs that Steve Hoffman recommended over his $2k reference IC.

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?s=1350c71d65c573b59326f318c642917f&threadid=13962

If you guys have any questions about his IC, Grover Huffman can be reached at: groverhuffman@hotmail.com

He offers a 90 day money back guarantee on the ICs. He'll take check or money order with 5 dollars shipping and handling per pair in the US.

His Address is:
Grover Huffman
P.O.Box 4734
West Hills, CA 91308

Pricing:
1/2 meter pair: $60.00
1 meter pair: $75.00
2 meter pair: $100.00

I'm still waiting for Grover to get back to me about terminating his cables with Eichmann Bullets and Bybees. I'll let you all know what he says.

FWIW, apparently he's also coming out with speaker cables too.

vpolineni · « **Reply #41 on:** 15 Jul 2003, 04:16 pm »

theeechosenone,
thanks for doing all this work... you're basically doing the research i've been doing-now i can sit back, relax, and wait for your posts

i'm curious as to what grover will say about bullet plugs and/or bybees. his interconnects have been HIGHLY reviewed over at steve hoffman's forum. he uses vintage rca plugs that are pure silver i think right now. keep us posted about what he says. if he would use bybees and bullet plugs, i think it would be cheaper than over at cryotweaks.com
thanks.

JoshK · « **Reply #42 on:** 15 Jul 2003, 04:41 pm »

Quote from: Danny

I have made my own now for a long time. Braiding Teflon Silver plated Copper wire is pretty easy you know, and sounds really good. It can be found really cheap too if you know where to look.

Where do you look?

TheeeChosenOne · « **Reply #43 on:** 16 Jul 2003, 12:28 am »

Well, Grover emailed me back concerning Bybees/Eichmann Bullets for his ICs. This is what he said:

"I looked at the Bybee review and not very impressed, sorry. I understand your desire for the premium silver connectors, do not like copper very much. I also very much like my vintage connectors as the silver travels completely thru the plug. Give them a try at this price they are insane.
--Grover--"

BTW, I emailed Grover the Bybee review on Soundstage.com. Obviously, he wasn't "impressed."

Oh well. Worth a try.

Best thing I guess is to try a pair of Grover ICs for $75/1m and a pair of Cryotweaks with the Bybee/Eichmann Silvers for $379. Since both have a money back guarantee (90 day for Grover, 30 day for Cryotweaks), there is nothing to lose but insignificant shipping. However, if they pan out, then I'm saving substantially in the long run.

Bogdan also will put Bybees in his Eichmanned ICs for about the same price as what Cryotweaks quoted (assuming you buy Bogdans's Silver Stealth @ $269 instead of his cheaper Silver ICs which start @ $99). Only problem with Bogdan is that he has no money back guarantee. Yet many users have indeed raved about this guy's cables against hefty multi-kilo buck stuff, so it may be worth the risk to some.

Heck, if I like Grover's stuff enough, then maybe (since Grover's ICs are relatively cheap anyways) I'll ask Drew Baird ( drubrew@bellsouth.net ) ( http://www.moon-audio.com ) to put some Eichmanns/Bybees for me. His prices are fair and he'll play around with any cable in a very professional manner--I just began talking to him about some options...................There is a means--especially at these prices! Think about it: $160 ($80 Eichmann Silver Bullets/$80 Bybee) on top of Grover's $75/1m equals $235[/u]. Toss is shipping and Drew Baird's work, and I think you're still well under $300 -- for a potentially state-of-the-art cable at any price!

Also, RS Audio silver IC for $99/1m shouldn't be forgotten also. The Ultra/Soundstage review likened them close to the hyper-expensive Nordost Valhalla. Such a great IC cable could also benefit from a Drew Baird custom job with Bybees/Eichmanns--still in the under $300 realm when all is said and done.

satfrat · « **Reply #44 on:** 16 Jul 2003, 08:36 am »

Another route to take would be to get your "stock" Grover IC ($79) and one of Wayne Waananen`s Bybee inlines w/silver bullets ($200). $279 total,,,, done deal!

Regards, Robin

Danny Richie · « **Reply #45 on:** 16 Jul 2003, 02:57 pm »

Okay Josh,

But this has been kind of a secrete.

Go here: http://www.apexjr.com/wire.html

Three runs of 18 gauge (one positive, and two negative) in a simple three wire braid is great for long runs, and it cost a whooping .13 a foot. Unless you buy it in 100 foot rolls like I do then it is only .12 a foot.

The quality of the wire is great and it sounds great too.

TheeeChosenOne · « **Reply #46 on:** 16 Jul 2003, 03:00 pm »

Quote from: satfrat

Another route to take would be to get your "stock" Grover IC ($79) and one of Wayne Waananen`s Bybee inlines w/silver bullets ($200). $279 total,,,, done deal! Regards, Robin

Are yous talking about this?:
http://www.boldercables.com/Store.asp?m=TheBolderCableCompany&n=10&k=119266&s=Bybee+Quantum+Purifier+Products

IF so, a pair costs $350.

Plus I'm not a fan of having too many connectors in the chain as the signal gets diluted, right?

vpolineni · « **Reply #47 on:** 16 Jul 2003, 03:02 pm »

according to the bolder website, 200 dollars is for a single bybee/eichmann purifier. a pair would cost you 400 dollars which is more than the cable at cryotweaks.com would even cost.

Danny Richie · « **Reply #48 on:** 16 Jul 2003, 03:05 pm »

One more thing since you guys have mentioned Wayne's cable.

His cables may be one of thee best out there for the money. You guys should try them out. I am!

And those Bybee's are worth the money. Try them and see. I bet you Wayne will let you guys demo some.

TheeeChosenOne · « **Reply #49 on:** 16 Jul 2003, 03:20 pm »

Quote from: Danny

One more thing since you guys have mentioned Wayne's cable. His cables may be one of thee best out there for the money. You guys should try them out. I am! And those Bybee's are worth the money. Try them and see. I bet you Wayne will let you guys demo some.

I'm sure it's a great cable as it's ben highly reviewed on this forum, but it's still $670 for 1m Silver Bulleted Bybee IC.

http://www.boldercables.com/Store.asp?m=TheBolderCableCompany&n=10&k=100003&s=Audio+Cables

I'm very sure I can get a 1m Bybeed/Silver Bulleted Grover IC for under $300 when all is said and done w/ modding (as I explained earlier for those who are just joining the thread). Since it has already been raved as a "giant killer" IC for $75 on teh Steve Hoffman forum, an Eichmann and Bybee will only make this great cable better, right?.........I can have Grover directly mail the cable to Drew Baird for Eichmann/Bybee modding (to saving shipping one way), before I even see the darn thing completed.

Of course, that takes the curiosity away about how good the Grover IC really is in stock form

and, of course, voids the money back guarantee. The wisest way is to get 1 stock cable, try it, and if you like it, swallow the shipping to Drew Baird. Future Grover ICs can then be sent directly from Grover to Drew for shipping savings.......The same thing can be repeated with RS Audio (since it's also inexpensive, highly reviewed, & have a money back guarantee) if one chooses that route.

TheeeChosenOne · « **Reply #50 on:** 16 Jul 2003, 03:37 pm »

Ok guys. I tried to convince Grover about hime using Bybees again. This is what he sent me today:

"I know the Bybee can only hurt the purity and transparency of the
sound of the silver conductor. I am sure the Bybee's were designed for
copper conductors which inherently has the problems the article writes of.
Everything about the bybee's disturb me, the leads are copper? eck. rare
earth oxides what are those? This is going to help prue silver conduct
cleaner I don't think so. Send me the silver bullets I will use them for you
forget about the bybees they are for inferior cables. Grover"

As you see....different strokes for different folks for cable designers. Many here firmly believe in Bybees so it's not a wash that there is no merit to them. Oh well

Wayne1 · « **Reply #51 on:** 16 Jul 2003, 04:25 pm »

There are more to cables than just the parts.

I have heard "Pure Silver" cables that sound awful. I have heard copper cables sound fantastic. I have heard cables with Silver Bullets and Bybees sound worse than cables with Gold Bullets and no Bybees.

I have spent about two years working with the Bybee Purifiers. I have also spent about a year and a half using nothing but the Bullet plugs on my interconnects.

The geometry of the cable is as important, if not more important, that what it is made from. There is NO WAY you can judge what a cable will sound like from reading a description on the internet.

There is no question that you can purchase cables that cost less than cables I make. You can also pay more. The only thing that should matter is what they sound like in YOUR system, in your room. All the reviews are meaningless if it doesn't sound good with your gear.

I do suggest that if you are interested in ANY cable that you make sure you can return it if you do not like it. Silver cables DO take quite a long time to break in. I would suggest a minimum of 250 hours with normal level signals through them before you do any serious evaluation.

I do plan to send Danny some cables to listen to. Perhaps you might be able to convince these other guys to let Danny compare their cables to his and mine.

While it would not tell you what the cables would sound like on YOUR gear, it would give you all another data point.

TheeeChosenOne · « **Reply #52 on:** 16 Jul 2003, 09:24 pm »

Wayne,
I agree with everything you say. Thanks for your input.

Indeed cables in any way, form, manner, material can sound like crap. It takes experience and good design skills which you and the guy from Empirical have. And system matching is important as well.

I'm definitely going to try some of these Grovers or RS Audios that come with such a guarantee. If I like one, I'm going to tweak it with Bybees and/or Eichmanns (Grover said he'd "Eichmann" the IC if you send them to him, albeit w/out Bybees--I'll henceforth do just that if I go with him). Maybe it'll sound great since I'm already working with good stuff. Maybe it'll sound like sh!t. But I strongly bet it won't as I'm apparently working with really highly reviewed stuff--just adding a different (state-of-the-art) connector and a Bybee....the cables inherent sonic charactersistics should inherently still stay the same and ultimately/hopefully improved.

Maybe if all works out well in some months, I can lend my tweaked IC to DAM for an all-star shoot-out eh? I'm sure Pez would be up for that.

Heck, if it can hopefully hold it's own against the likes of a Bolder Nitro or Empirical Holophonic, it's done it's job in spades!

[Maybe the DAM club independently shows interest on its own and tries the stock forms of these money back guarantee cables (i.e. Cryotweaks, RS Audio, Grover) just to put things in perspective from their end......]

JohnR · « **Reply #53 on:** 17 Jul 2003, 02:24 am »

Maybe part of the reason for the good sound of the Grover IC is the connectors he uses with that wire - ?

witchdoctor · « **Reply #54 on:** 17 Jul 2003, 02:34 am »

I will throw my Bogdan silver serpents into any shoot out as long as it's a blind listening test. I have not heard the other cables but am confident
these will take on all challengers. Their entry level cable crushed AZ Silver Ref 2 in a blind listening test in my very revealing system.
The Silver Spirit is much better and is around $279. It is pictured above.
Any takers?

TheeeChosenOne · « **Reply #55 on:** 17 Jul 2003, 02:52 am »

Witchdoctor,
I would love to try out Bogdan's stuff, but unfortunately the guy doesn't have any type of return guarantee.

I have read very impressive reviews of the Silver Spirit on other forums. Seems like it really can compete with the best out there in the shoot-out reviews I've seen. Plus, Ben will Bybee his IC if asked.

Maybe when I get a tweaked Grover or Rs Audio, etc., I can send it to you to try out and compare. Then maybe afterwards I can try out your IC in my system to see how they compare. Should be an interesting match-up.

In other words, I'm GAME! ......

witchdoctor · « **Reply #56 on:** 17 Jul 2003, 03:51 am »

Isn't there an audio show coming up some place where their will be like minded people? I am sure we could hijack a room after hours.
If not we can do the first fed ex shootout. I'll even try to round up a few other products to throw in the mix. All I ask is that we do a blind test
to make it as objective as possible. I will ask my audio dealer buddy
Bill Laurent from Eighth Nerve if he would like to get involved.
This shoot out can be an audio version of The Iron Chef from the food channel.

TheeeChosenOne · « **Reply #57 on:** 17 Jul 2003, 09:12 am »

Quote from: Danny

Okay Josh,

But this has been kind of a secrete.

Go here: http://www.apexjr.com/wire.html

Three runs of 18 gauge (one positive, and two negative) in a simple three wire braid is great for long runs, and it cost a whooping .13 a foot. Unless you buy it in 100 foot rolls like I do then it is only .12 a foot.

The quality of the wire is great and it sounds great too.

Not to get into audio theory here but I understand that many cable design gurus recommend 41 gauge for silver IC. If 41 awg teflon silver wire is your game as a DIY project, here is a good place to get it ($39.50/25 feet):

http://www.a-msystems.com/electronics/wire/silvertef.aspx

Danny Richie · « **Reply #58 on:** 17 Jul 2003, 03:17 pm »

Josh,

I use the 18 gauge for longer runs that I might need like 8 to 10 feet long. A shorter run need not be that large. 21 gauge is fine.

TheeeChosenOne · « **Reply #59 on:** 17 Jul 2003, 11:18 pm »

Ok guys, Drew Baird said he'll terminate your ICs for $5 per retermination point. Thus $20 per pair of ICs.

He can source the Silver Eichmanns for you at $85 but you'll have to source the Bybees (he said the factory requires $1k bulk purchase for an order). BTW, he HAS experience with Eichmann AND Bybee terminations.

FWIW, you can source Bybees thru a Google search.......Btw, Bybees do come with Silver leads instead of copper leads for those that want this option for a true all silver IC.

Again, Drew can be reached at: drubrew@bellsouth.net