[John Casler]

UP, DOWN, On, or OFF???

Your DUST COVER that is.

I have a few thoughts on this, but wanted to hear what others do, and why.

Do you play your TT with the Dust Cover UP, DOWN, On, or OFF???

And why?

[Scott F.]

Hiya John,

For me its OFF on my Audio Note TT-1 (and also my old Systemdek 2X2). The dust cover tends to ring and color the sound pretty heavily. I actually removed the hinge hardware. When the table isn't in use, I still use the dust cover for protection.

[gooberdude]

This is a great topic.    take it off!!!  take it off!!!

I'm always amazed when I see folks keep the dust cover on...it vibes somethin' terrible IMHO.

I have a reltively new Pro-Ject Expression and it only sounds good when the cover is off.

On a whim i removed the hinges & that improved sound by quite a bit too...I hate to admit that.

For a newer lightweight budget belt driven table like mine with no suspension (i removed the stupid rubber feet) the vibrations caused by the spinning platter & stylus interaction have to be taken seriously...removing anything attached to the deck that's not needed (hinges + screws for the on/off switch) allowed a lot of music to become audible...less muddy - more bass, better imaging, more real.

In order to keep the cover on when the table is not in use, i keep a thin strip of blue painter's tape on 2 sides of the cover and tape it to the tt base.  When i'm spinnin' the cover sits against the back wall on the floor.  been using the same 2 pcs of tape for almost a year now...

My reasons for leaving the cover off only deal with the bad vibes the cover imparts to the sound when Lp's are playing.  I have no experience with, say, the sound emanating from the stylus and bouncing off the cover and back into the stylus..though I've heard this mentioned as another reason to remove the cover during play.

If anyone has never tried this simple and free TT tweak, take a leap of faith and give it a whirl.
nasty vibes are not snake oil...setting you TT free of the shackles might bring a smile to your face.


matt

[TheChairGuy]

Off when playing - on when sitting to keep grubby 3 year old hands off my precious $60 Grado  (same reasons as Scott F. mentions - ringing/vibrations transmit into the music)

[shep]

Off. A friend of mine made a wooden cover, using the plastic one as a template. I think it was heavy ply, but he played it open.

[John Casler]

Great comments.

It seems we all agree that if possible we need to stay away from both "airborne" and mechanical vibrations, so to that end, the current plastic dust covers "suck"

But, they also protect from "dust" which is also an enemy to vinyl grooves.

Now I know some might think that the dust is a minor problem and all you need do is clean your record before playing . . . . But. . . .

A spinning record is a "DUST VACUUMN"

Here is what happens;

As a record spins, the air immediately above it is also set into motion spinning in the same direction.

This, motion them causes the air to move outwards to the edge of the record.

This action creates a vacuum above the record and sucks a column of air from above the record downward and across the grooves, including all of the airborne dust in that column.

Because the stylus and the vinyl have a tendency to create an electrical charge (static electricity) much of the dust (which I believe is positively charged) is then attracted to the record.

Oh boy!!  So now the spinning record is not only a dust vacuum, but also a dust magnet

One method to deal with this is the "dust bug", especially the one with a "ground wire" to drain off the static charge.

However, one need make sure the bristles of the bug are not too stiff.  I remember the first time I heard them through the cartridge when they were too stiff.

So I wonder it is is possible to build or fabricate a "dust cover" from a material that would not only protect the record from this "overhead column of crud", but also reduce the airborne vibrations to the arm, record, cartridge and all surfaces exposed to them, or maybe a way to damp the existing cover.

I remember years ago closing the cover and placing a pillow on top of it, to a good result.

Anyhow, that was what I was driving at.

[gooberdude]

i'm all about the grounded Dustbug.  It seems to lower audible surface noise in addition to being great for removing static here in the chilly North.

The DB works so well that i've stopped brushing each side with a carbon brush before play...the Nitty Gritty rcm and Dustbug do all the cleaning duties.  eliminating the AQ carbon brush allows me to flip sides & lp's faster...

i figure that by elminating the AQ brush i'm not sharing as much dirt amongst the LP's...periodically i spray the DB ends with a pure alchohol cleaning spray and blot clean with a cotton towel.

throw in a magic eraser cleaning once each session and i think i've got all the bases covered with fewer steps than ever.  definitely better sound now.

given that i'm a freak about bad vibes i was certain i'd 'hear' the dustbug.  it isn't so.  i can't tell any difference whatsoever except the benefits listed above.   

spinning vinyl w/o fretting about cleanliness is lots more fun...

I now use the AQ carbon brush as a precleaner for thriftshop LP finds.

[TheChairGuy]

John,

You HAVE given this inordinate thought, no? 

Vacuuming the record (via machine), once only in it's entire lifetime, seems to do the trick forever in improving playback. 

Then, each play use a carbon fibre brush while touching a grounded piece of equipment (you pick, anything with a three prong cord) and you'll be fine I think. 

Again, I've re-vacuumed records a year or two (and many plays) afterwards and never got the sizable jump in playback quality (quietness, air, etc) again.  Seems the first one is the only HUGE benefit, after that simply carbon-fibre brushing does just fine.

I have heard some small benefit in using a mold release cleaner first, then anti-bacterial agent, then vacuum cleaning via machine......but I just vacuum clean once now as the additional benefit was small (or all in my head).

No matter what hand cleaner I've used...nothing compares to vacuum cleaning (I have the chepest Nitty Gritty and use alcohol-free formula I bought from LAT INtenational long ago)

[John Casler]

John,

You HAVE given this inordinate thought, no? 

Hi TCG,

Just my nature.

But more than thought, lots of it is observation.

On happenstance, I was "Vinylizing" one afternoon years ago, and the sun came through my basement window and shone across my turntable.

A friend had stopped by with an herbal smoke he was enjoying.  I watched as the smoke and "easily seen" dust particles moved slowly over the turntable and decended to its surface, and slid across.

That is when I realized what was happening.

Might be insignificant, depending on size and consistancy of the "stuff".  Here in LA, the air is filled with all manner of gunk.

My thought was that I find it unusual that TT's haven't covers that not only do the dust cover thing, but also are made from a material or construct, that might damp airborne vibes without truning them into mechanical ones transmitted to the table.

But again, just my nature to look for a "better way". aa

[Psychicanimal]

But again, just my nature to look for a "better way". aa

All you need is an ozone/ negative ion generator--for the'*herbal* smoke & everything else.

Found my picture w/ Yaxeni Oriquén.  She's one tough mami!


***

[John Casler]

But again, just my nature to look for a "better way". aa

All you need is an ozone/ negative ion generator--for the'*herbal* smoke & everything else.

Found my picture w/ Yaxeni Oriquén.  She's one tough mami!


***

Hi PsychicA,

I have recently read reports (valid who knows) of the - ion generators causing lung irratation and such.

No verification, but on an FYI basis, it might be good to Google such before investing.

[lcrim]

Just saw this thread and the original question-dustcover off or on while playing? I am forced to disagree and after years of removing dust covers while playing, now keep it on all the time except when making adjustments.  I have never detected any ringing or vibration and it keeps my records cleaner.  Asked my analog guru about this subject and was told - on at all times.
I use an antistatic gun when I clean records, just before putting them in the dustcover.  Also I do reclean records from time to time.  The steps when playing includes a dust brush on the record and a swipe of the stylus back to front with a wet stylus cleaning brush.

[Magic Robert]

One more reply to this topic.  I am ratting around the forumson the ocassion of buying a new (used) Project Xpressions with a Grado Gold.  I am pumped.  But enough about depleting wallets...

I had a B&O turntable (okay my wife has it; it's lovely) that really does a serviceable job (an old 1700 with a MMC 20 EN).  I noticed the cover seemed to have a significant effect (it is VERY) low.  What seemed to make a difference was just padding the lip where it sat on the plinth. 

I understand the problem with reflected vibrations from the cartridge/tonearm, but what about all the severely time-lagged and out-of-phase vibrations that hit the tonearm, album, catridge form the music being played.

I founf that leaving the cover on, but decoupled from, the plinth seemed to make it work as a nice vibration barrier.

Of course, I have always wondered why covers were not built to 'sink' sonic vibrations in addition to stopping dust...

[Wayner]

I'm with Icrim. I leave my covers on all the time. That should help with a little air to stylus feedback and it may help keep dust off the record. If it doesn't do any of that, I can't hear anything that it does that is bad....no rattles, vibrations or whatever.

W

[In The Groove]

I don't have a dustcover on my new ScoutMaster.  I keep a white microfiber towel on it at night but remove it while I am playing records.  I may eventually get a Gingko cover.

[Befuddled]

Stay away from the ionizers, they charge all matter of cruddy particles that then agglomerate and look for a place to land (stick). The air is cleaner, everything else is not. I think that particles small enough to be truly free floating - Not the obvious scales, hairs, agglomerations, etc. that thunk down on the surface and are easily removed by a dry brush or vacuum - tend to be affected by the same principle that causes ground effect in airplanes. They just aren't going to land on that spinning platter..... All charges being equal
Joel

[beachbum]

hello john i just came across this thread and dont know what this is
"One method to deal with this is the "dust bug", especially the one with a "ground wire" to drain off the static charge."
i am playing lps right now and on removing a lp it became so charged it crackled when i took it off,
i use the audioquest brush, and i destatic also, and use a magic eraser after each side, my aires three does not have a cover.
thanks mike