[Reverie]

Hey all,

I’ve been making adjustments to the 41hz Amp4 kit for some time now, so am now down to the much finer (and perhaps trivial) parts of the kit.

In this thread, I’d like to ask about what difference what solder you use to assemble the kit has on the sonic results. 

Now some people, have said that using different solder has only physical effects, ie. affects only how you solder it (temps ect), and how strong the resulting hold is. However, others have said it makes a ‘huge’ difference, and have recommended silver-containing solder, specifically WBT or Audionote UK.

I’d be very interested in knowing your opinions on this!

Thanks,
Peter

[PSP]

Hi Peter,
This is Peter... 

I have never "heard solder", but I have heard bad solder joints (cold, crystalline, hazy, clunky-looking) that come from not getting enough heat into the joint, moving something before the joint cools, or not getting things clean enough before you solder (I like to draw component leads through a folded over piece of emory paper that I keep on my workbench).  IMO, bad joints sound harsh, like there is fuzz in the tweeter.  When I have just put in a bunch of new parts and the sound is suddenly distorted or harsh, the first thing I do is look at all my solder joints under an illuminated magnifying glass, and reheat anything that looks remotely suspicious.  In 5+ years of DIY/tweaking, I have probably had half a dozen clear cut cases... reheat a couple of sketchy-looking solder joints and suddenly the music is sweet again.

Solders vary in melting point and wetting properties.  A low melting point and good wetting are "good".  Finally, solders that melt at (relatively) low temperatures and spread nicely make soldering quicker and easier.  This puts less thermal stress on botique caps, opamps, and circuit board connections.  Certainly, it is possible to screw up a nice cap by heating it to too high a temperature for too long, so speed is good here.  IMO, these are the ways that "solder influences sonics".  I like Cardas eutectic solder, not because I think it sounds good, but because it melts and flows like a dream.

Good luck,
Peter

[BobM]

How many times have you soldered a piece, only to look afterwards and see that you inadvertently leaned the barrel of the hot soldering iron on another component, melting its casing and making it unusable? I've done this to a few caps in my day. I now make sure to order a few extra's and keep them around for those ham fisted mistakes that I am loath to admit to anyone.

As for solder, I picked up a 1lb spool of Kester "44" a few years ago when I needed to fill out a Digikey order to avoid the extra charge if under $25, and this has served me very well on any number of projects. Low melting temp and a very clean join - flows beautifully.

Enjoy,
Bob

[JoshK]

I like Cardas eutectic solder, not because I think it sounds good, but because it melts and flows like a dream.

Ditto, same reason....its fantastic to work with in particular with small PCB work.

[navi]

Reverie

I've never done comparisons with different solders. I use WBT silver solder because it's cheap and has a low melting temp. High grade silver solder isn't that expensive- WBT, Cardas, Audionote........... You might as well buy it instead of cheap stuff

[LightFire]

Hey all,

I’ve been making adjustments to the 41hz Amp4 kit for some time now, so am now down to the much finer (and perhaps trivial) parts of the kit.

In this thread, I’d like to ask about what difference what solder you use to assemble the kit has on the sonic results. 

Now some people, have said that using different solder has only physical effects, ie. affects only how you solder it (temps ect), and how strong the resulting hold is. However, others have said it makes a ‘huge’ difference, and have recommended silver-containing solder, specifically WBT or Audionote UK.

I’d be very interested in knowing your opinions on this!

Thanks,
Peter

As far as it is well soldered. It, obviously,  will cause no sound difference at all.

[Reverie]

As far as it is well soldered. It, obviously,  will cause no sound difference at all.

Having read all the excellent feedback on this thread, I can now safely say I agree with this. I had the suspicion all along  .

I think I'll look towards getting some of that Cardas eutectic solder. It appears small amounts can be found cheaply on Welbourne Labs. 

However, slightly off topic, to make the postage worth it, I could add something else to the order. As it happens, I'm after some hookup wire too.

Slightly off-topic I know, but does anyone have any general opinions on the Cardas Hook-Up Wire they sell? Would I want shielded? 

Thanks!

[Folsom]

WBT also uses organic resin. The stuff is not so harsh to get a wiff of. Also lead is nasty stuff. It is easy to work with but produces a lot of nasty resin; it makes stuff look dirty. The silver is a bit of extra touch. The length of signal travel through it is so short it is hard to develop much characterstic from it, but if you do it in 20 spots along the signal path perhaps it will make a small difference. After all once you get to a certain point DIY or commercial it is about huge price/tweak for small gains because there is no where else to go.

[audioferret]

How many times have you soldered a piece, only to look afterwards and see that you inadvertently leaned the barrel of the hot soldering iron on another component, melting its casing and making it unusable? I've done this to a few caps in my day. I now make sure to order a few extra's and keep them around for those ham fisted mistakes that I am loath to admit to anyone.

Oh, God - I have done this ONCE.  I was trying to install a IC pin adapter into my P-Tech P3a DAC so I could swap out OPAMPS.  BIG mistake.  Small-IC circuit boards are not made for my clumsy hands.  Actually, my hands are not made for circuit boards and ICs.  I melted a few bypass caps and damaged the circuit board trying to remove the ICs. A Couple-Hundred dollars later - I am sticking with point-to point wiring and .25" quick-connects.  I let the professionals do the tricky work.  I am simply not equipped or experienced enough.

As for solder - you can still achieve great results with quick-connects and screw-down barrier strips.  I still use solder on my signal path, but I don't bother with power supply wiring.  If you look at the internals on high-end components, you be surprised to see how much is quick-connects (for ease of manufacture - of course, but still sounds great).  The solder I use is a simple silver-content solder I got from the local electronics store.

[Imperial]

Soldering the connection...
Let me quote Fire Marshall Bill on this issue:

"LET ME TELL YOU SOMETHING"!

The solder is not there for the signal to traverse...

You use the solder to grip the components, holding them together!
You do not use solder as a conductor.

When soldering, it is much more important to get the solder and joints to the correct temperature.
You should get "an oily sheen" on the solder when soldering. That is the proof that it was at the right
temperature before it starts to cool...

If the solder makes a big difference... are you using the solder as the conductor?
I would not do that...Its not the pudding I tell you, its the cook!!!

Imperial