[nodiak]

Spend for one session with a shrink, learn that lesson, then come back to the fold, it's a better deal !

[Carlman]

I'll be honest, this thread of psycho-semantic tweaking rhetoric is one of the most annoying I've read in a while.  I can't see how it's really related to only 2-channel so I'm moving it another place so all people who want to confess to whatever they want can do so.
-C

[TheChairGuy]

I'll be honest, this thread of psycho-semantic tweaking rhetoric is one of the most annoying I've read in a while.  I can't see how it's really related to only 2-channel so I'm moving it another place so all people who want to confess to whatever they want can do so.
-C

Hey Carl - muchas gracias for that 

I confess to chasing the elusive tweek....but am slowly learning my lessons.

No matter what is tried, folks......I'm not sure CD playback will ever be a proximity of live/real.  So, spend less, go analog (and/or superior DVD-A) and load up on those drinks.  Relegate CD's to background music and you'll be fine - some of the urge to tweek will pass once you get over it (that is, hoping CD will someday sound anything more than passably good or decent)   

[Dave G]

"psycho-semantic"

Is that the way crazy people talk?

[hmen]

If you don't hear a difference after applying a tweak it's probably because you haven't given it enough break-in time.

[Rob Babcock]

Yeah, always give it a good 1 year break-in.  Or til 30 days after the return policy expires.

[Scotty]

I removed my mostly off topic comments
Scotty

[eric the red]

I'll be honest, this thread of psycho-semantic tweaking rhetoric is one of the most annoying I've read in a while.  I can't see how it's really related to only 2-channel so I'm moving it another place so all people who want to confess to whatever they want can do so.
-C

Am just curious why this thread annoys you so much Carl. Lot's of people tweak their two-channel audio gear and I can't see how this is not related to two-channel audio as most of us are two-channel audio geeks.

[Rob Babcock]

Scotty- I agree with your points, but I think that's irrelevant to tweaks.  Great system or lame one, Golden or Tin Earred, the issue is sticking with tweaks even though you 1) can't hear any difference or 2) even flat out know don't work.  Certainly that is a psychological question, not one of resolution.

Eric- I was as surprised as you were that Carl found it annoying.  I find it fascinating.  Perhaps you're run afoul of a sacred cow.  Many people get quite defensive when this topic is broached, although I see no good reason for it.  No one is saying that all tweaks are hogwash, merely discussing the issue of staying with them even when they don't seem to do anything.  No accusations are being made.

[Carlman]

Eric- I was as surprised as you were that Carl found it annoying.  I find it fascinating.  Perhaps you're run afoul of a sacred cow.  Many people get quite defensive when this topic is broached, although I see no good reason for it.  No one is saying that all tweaks are hogwash, merely discussing the issue of staying with them even when they don't seem to do anything.  No accusations are being made.

I kind of saw it going in the direction of saying it's all hogwash... However, some of the previous posts just got on my nerves... like the 'Due to our "illness"' remarks, audiophilia being a religion... and general audio nervosa comments... mixed with the guy saying that if you system isn't revealing enough is all a crock... etc.  It just seemed a bit too familiar after some of the power cord/conditioning discussions that have recently taken place. 

So, maybe my comments were a little over-the-top but such is the way with type... it all seems so permanent.  I don't really care so much right now.  But a little Laphroig goes a long way to make things right.

I use nothing that doesn't make a real difference.  If I did something that didn't... the only reason it's still there is because it's too difficult to change back.

[Rob Babcock]

Even AC luminaries like Marbles has admitted to making purchases to impress people in the past (not trying to take Rob out of context, just referencing a very old thread- he's a very knowledgeable guy, one who's opinion I trust).  I think some tweaks we stick with is out of our herd mentality.  Now I don't mean this as an insult, and at the heart of it that mentality has served us pretty well or it would have been deselected by evolution.  For example, I'm fairly cable agnostic- I don't doubt that the worst cable ever made could sound poor compared to the best ever made, but I've heard very little evidence of it.  Nor does prices and appearance seem to correlate well with sound.  Go ahead and feel free to impugn my manhood, my hearing, my system, whatever you like!   Still, I have spent more than I felt was strictly necessary "just in case", to counter that nagging worry that I might be "missing out", and to establish a bit more "cred" among my fellow audiophools.  Ultimately I think we all do this sometimes without thinking.  Again, if Marbles/Rob tells me a Z-Sleeve makes a big difference, I'm strongly swayed to hear that difference whether I want to or not (I'm not saying it doesn't, just using this as an example).  I may even buy a few for my system even if I don't hear any difference.  Perhaps my current gear isn't resolving enough, I tell myself- I'll just keep 'em til I get gear good enough to hear the difference.

I love tweaks.  And being very frugal, I especially love cheap/free ones.  I don't mind dropping a few grand on speakers, a couple grand on an amp, or a grand on room treatments.  But I ain't spending a couple hundred on a jar of pebbles or a magic clock!

Well, maybe on a Sonicrock.

[TheChairGuy]

Carl, u want the topic back in Two Channel then? 

Feel better soon, bud 

[loki1957]

Power cords, I have an 1600.00 cord and I'll be dammed if I can here ant difference with it.

[sts9fan]

I have 14 Clever little Clocks speard thoughout my house.  They seem to make the music more "In Time"

[Carlman]

Carl, u want the topic back in Two Channel then? 
Feel better soon, bud 

Thanks.. the meds are kicking in... I think I'm back to 'normal' at least for me...

You can move it if you think it's more a 2-channel type of thing... makes sense to me... I saw it as more an 'audiophile' type of thing... whichever is fine.

-C

[Zero]

I like my cables to look pretty

[Phil]

To me, a tweak is a cheap way to get an incremental (only) change.  I've never tried a tweak that dramatically changed the sound.  It is more on the margins -- fine tuning. 

Some of my previous tweaks are in the closet because my gear has changed and they aren't fit for that particular sound. 

I don't see the harm in indulging the fetishistic side of audio.  It should be fun.  And generally keeps you out of trouble.

Phil

[macrojack]

Once you've taken the plunge and bought the damn thing, you may as well leave it there if it isn't doing any harm, even though you have to admit it isn't doing any good.
The sound is subjective and we, wanting to belong, often agree to hear something because the reviewers heard it or it's all over the Net. We hear what we want to hear. Go back and read ten year old audio reviews. They are frought with experiences that duplicate the live performance and yet we still believe that the preceeding ten years has yielded tremendous improvement and innovation.
I think we audiophiles are eccentric as hell. The carrot keeps moving so we keep chasing it, even though every last one of us know that we could put together a very satisfying retro system for a puny fraction of the money we are currently holding in our audio systems, we continue to read and experiment and invest. The tweak market seems to be part rumor and part fantasy, and totally driven by a gambling urge.