[JohninCR]

You got me putting quotes on "biggest".

[Steve Eddy]

You got me putting quotes on "biggest".

Oh! Yeah, that I did do. Sorry. 

se

[rajacat]

Is Denny Hastert your idea of a sweetheart? 

http://www.hastertforcongress.org/images/user_images/photogallery/ag_denny_press.jpg[img]

[rajacat]

Omega Super 3 Bipoles cast a huge sound stage while imaging nicely. They sound similar no matter where you are in the room. Of course, there can be only one sweet spot but IMO a speaker designer should aim to minimize the degradation of sound quality as you move away from that spot. It is really nice to wander around the room and have the fantasy that the musicians are in the room with you can walk among them. aa

Raja

[JLM]

Large sweet spot invites room interaction issues/challenges (translate problems) and in my experience a lack of imaging definition.  Size of sweet spot is only an upper midrange and higher phenom where first room reflections come into play.  The omni or dipole radiators produce a blob or wall or sound, which is more natural than you might think, but precise imaging (the very hallmark of stereo and IMO the premise for entry into audiophile-dom) is lost.  And of course trying to achieve a large sweet spot in a small room is an excerise in fustration.

Personally if I'm listening seriously, I'm happy to be doing it from "the" chair where images (with the right recordings) lock into place, especially under nearfield conditions.  And if I'm just listening casually the high frequency roll off and loss of imaging are acceptable.

[sts9fan]

Yeah I don't see a line array in my near future.  I am think about something that will be extremely enjoyable for the whole living room.  I am not talking room specifics because I HOPEFULLY will be moving soon.

[woodsyi]

Constant Directivity Wave Guide on VMPS ribbon monitors really widened the sweet spot to just about anywhere in front of the speakers.   I have only heard the CDWG on my RM40s but I am sure the guides work on the other models.  So in general, line source speakers with 180 dispersion pattern would give you a large sweet spot. 

[shep]

God is obviously not an audiophile or he/she/it would not have made us with only two ears, badly placed, on each side of the head.  Bad design. Good for detecting predators coming out of the bushes on either side but lousy for speakers in front. Now a third ear in the middle and some dedicated brain lobe to handle the extra input would be just the ticket! I appreciate the info. a few steps above. For years I have been driving myself crazy trying to have a big sweet spot, moving speakers around like some a crazy, when it never was going to happen. Now maybe I can sit still and listen! What about add-on leather flaps for the ears, a bit like the OB designs? any ideas here?

[jholtz]

Sorry guys, but he did ask "biggest" and simple physics indicates line array.  It's really not even a close call.  Horizontal directivity issues apply the same as they do for point sources.  Of course arrays aren't without their compromises with the primary ones being distortion in the size of the image and driver costs to do it right.  No other speaker fills a room with sound more evenly, whether it's an arena or home listening room, and they're as different from point source speakers as open baffle speakers are from boxes.

Since I've had line arrays for several years I'll interject one thought. The "bloated" image is only on incorrectly designed line arrays, IMHO. If you employ power tapering as out lined by Dr. Jim Griffin in his line array white paper, the image becomes full sized, not bloated, and is very clearly defined. Also, the excellent and controlled dispersion patterns inherit to a properly designed line array eliminate many room problems experienced by point source or di-pole speakers.

HTH

Jim

[rajacat]

Large sweet spot invites room interaction issues/challenges (translate problems) and in my experience a lack of imaging definition.  Size of sweet spot is only an upper midrange and higher phenom where first room reflections come into play.  The omni or dipole radiators produce a blob or wall or sound, which is more natural than you might think, but precise imaging (the very hallmark of stereo and IMO the premise for entry into audiophile-dom) is lost.  And of course trying to achieve a large sweet spot in a small room is an excerise in fustration.

Personally if I'm listening seriously, I'm happy to be doing it from "the" chair where images (with the right recordings) lock into place, especially under nearfield conditions.  And if I'm just listening casually the high frequency roll off and loss of imaging are acceptable.

If you are not concerned with obtaining a large sweet spot, why not use headphones for all "serious" listening?

[TheChairGuy]

Hey, great post!  Good info in it.

I'm inclined like JLM is to omni-directional designs for attaining that all-elusive sweet spot.  I have Maggie MMG's (dipoles) in a 12 x 15' room and they have a rather narrowly defined sweet spot....once it it you're fine; when out of it, it just becomes background music (and okay at that  ). 

With only a 12 x 15' room, I think even the smallest (48" tall) Maggie is hopelessly too large to have consistently good sweet spot/imaging.  I think, as JLM pointed out, you need a bigger room to really show off it's terrific virtues.

I have a Linaeum Towner speaker now that I listen to most.  It has the omno-directional Linaeum tweeter on top of the tower (it's only 30" tall in total, so tower is a kinda' funny term for it) and a 6.5" forward firing (only) woofer in an 8" wide cabinet with the simplest of crossovers.  So, it has the air and spatial cues of the omni tweeter without most of the low frequency inflections as it has the front firing woofer (with a front mounted port)

It works for me in my room really well.  Tho only 87db efficient, but with the simplest of crossovers, I can use a 10watt tube amp which drives them perfectly well and enlarge that sweet spot to fit my 12 x 15' room. 

Mirage might have the line that most closely approximates this...I'd like to hear them one day:

http://www.miragespeakers.com/v2/product_page.php?open=types&subid=692&id=876

[mcgsxr]

Interesting thread - I have heard the smaller Mirage speakers with the omnipolar tweeter mount etc - stand mounts, front ported, 6.5 and tweet I believe.

My best friend runs those in his "art" room, a relaxing reading room with fireplace, leather furniture, and bright native art.

I find those speakers nice, but placement is still an issue, for best omni reproduction - at least 1-2 feet from the walls allows the soundstage to eerily fill fully centered, even when off center.

Decent speakers, it would be interesting to hear the larger ones.

[tonyptony]

Tony, I'd only caution that I think that Shahinians only sound better than average when playing classical music or maybe light jazz.  I find them to be very quirky, even problematic with their tonal balance and so buying them sound unheard is very sketchy.    Mirage omnipolars are probably safer.  Also, I find that Shahinians fetch surprisingly high prices so aren't generally a great used value if you're not a Shahiniac.   IOW, the following for them is fervent, but very small. 

John, I respectfully beg to differ regarding the type of music that can be played through Shahinian speakers. In my experience (been listening to different models for about 20 years now), I've found that they can play all types of music no worse than any other speaker design. That is to say, I don't think there is one design over any other that is categorically the best for all types of music. I play rock through mine quite often, and what I've learned is that they can provide musical enjoyment even for most reasonably well recorded R&R. Yes, they may be a bit quirky, and are much more demanding of proper room placement and treatment, but I love 'em. 

[dB Cooper]

Large sweet spot does imply 'omni', and I have never heard the Allison speakers surpassed in this respect. They are forward omnis without splattering sound rearward, which I believe accounts for much of the mushy imaging some have mentioned in relation to omnis. My original Allisons (Fours) gave a respectable image even with one speaker completely obstructed by an open door! Sadly, the redesign/reissue Fours are IMHO overpriced at $2500-3000 a pair (paid $370/pr for the pair I bought in 1980.) My later CD8 towers had much better definition without giving up that nearly limitless 'sweet spot'.

Myself, I would rather give up a little 'absoluteness' in imaging than have a speaker that sounds totally different wherever you are in the room. To each his own, though.

[jonbee]

I have had several ohms, and linaeum, and allisons, as well as maggies, but the widest is my VMPS RM30s w/ cdwg. A true advance in this area.

[Imperial]

Pretty large sweetspot m'kay...

This is a Decware RL-3.0

Dont know if it got the biggest, but its very encompassing.

Imperial