[DavidS]

This winter I will have new home office / library (son moving out to new community for a job).  I do lots of computer work at home but other than occaisional streaming radio over desk top speakers have only done music on my main two channel system in the living room.  My main system is Ellis speakers, Modwright sony universal, audio note preamp, PS Audio amp, and AV123 sub. 

I have nearly 1000 cds but am interested in using my pc to feed a small hifi system.  I am a complete novice with computer based audio - for $1500 max what could I put together for this smallish room (20 ft x 20 ft but 10 ft ceilings) that would sound good at not loud volume levels and let me explore a new source for music.  I am okay with used gear.  I am interested in streaming audio, some downloaded music, and I will definately play some cds.  Listen to a wide variety of music - favourites are alt rock / country, jazz, blues.

What advice do you have for me.  What has worked for you that could help me get into this new area of music.  Thannks for the advice.

David

[Bob Reynolds]

You might consider this NHT speaker setup for you desktop.
http://nhthifi.com/2006/pchifi.html

I guess the only other thing you'd need is a USB DAC.

[LightFire]

This might be just what you want. I have one and have no complains so far. Very silent. No fans in power supply. Analog or digital output.

http://www.apple.com/macmini/

[LightFire]

This might be just what you want. I have one and have no complains so far. Very silent. No fans in power supply. Analog or digital output.

http://www.apple.com/macmini/

...forgot to say it comes with remote control and you can add more hard disk space trough firewire/usb. Like this:

http://www.lacie.com/products/product.htm?pid=10476

[JLM]

Here's a compact alternative to your "traditional" audio system:

Source:  Squeeze Box, $300, http://slimdevices.com/pi_squeezebox.html

Hard drive:  Western Digital 400 GB external, $240, http://www.compusa.com/products/product_info.asp?pfp=BROWSE&N=200112+502463+4294967095&Ne=301050&product_code=338218&Pn=My_Book_Premium_Edition_400GB_Hard_Drive

Powered Speakers:  Mackie HR 624, $900/pair, http://www.proacousticsusa.com/productdetail.php?pId=6412

The Squeeze Box serves as transport and DAC when used with a PC to store music.  Exact Audio Copy (EAC) and Free Lossless Audio Codec (FLAC) are free downloaded software to allow ripping to your hard drive.  1000 CD's should fit in 400 GB.  Squeeze Box also provides a internet audio streaming (radio), high quality volume control, and many other features.  It can also be modded to provide extreme sound quality playback.  Squeeze Box can be operated with its own remote, or from your PC.  For a desktop system (or if you don't have a wireless system at home) you may want to save $50 and give up the wireless connection feature.

Home audio buffs continue to ignore the huge advantages of active speakers.  Here's your chance to experience ruler flat response, mindblowing amounts of bass from such small boxes, and the synergy possible when you allow the designer to mate amp to driver in one on one mode:  http://www.mackie.com/products/mackietechnology/Active_vs_Passive.html

And here's another, cheaper active speaker option:  http://www.music123.com/Yamaha-MSR100-Powered-Speaker-(B-Stock)-i269663.music

And another option (that would exceed your budget):  http://fostex.com/index.php?file=products/speakers/nx6a

[DavidS]

thanks for the great information.  I apologize if this is really basic but what I am understanding so far is:

1.  any music can leave my PC via USB port or other ways?
2.  something like exterior hard drive or squeeze box can be used to store additional downloaded files or even manage a streaming audio signal
3.  music will need to go from pc or external source through dac (imagine any dac such as benchmark or scott nixon for example would work) to convert digital to analog
4.  and then to amp/speakers or active speakers depending on my preference and budget

is there a good basic faq somewhere on this because there seems to be so much different information and terminology ... guess as usual its a matter of diving in and  letting your system evolve based on what works for my needs, but this discussion is good to get me to first base.

David

[Bob Reynolds]

thanks for the great information.  I apologize if this is really basic but what I am understanding so far is:

1.  any music can leave my PC via USB port or other ways?
2.  something like exterior hard drive or squeeze box can be used to store additional downloaded files or even manage a streaming audio signal
3.  music will need to go from pc or external source through dac (imagine any dac such as benchmark or scott nixon for example would work) to convert digital to analog
4.  and then to amp/speakers or active speakers depending on my preference and budget

is there a good basic faq somewhere on this because there seems to be so much different information and terminology ... guess as usual its a matter of diving in and  letting your system evolve based on what works for my needs, but this discussion is good to get me to first base.

David

The simplest setup and least expensive is to use the analog outputs from your PC's sound card connected to active speakers. You can play CDs from your PC's CD/DVD drive. You can play any audio file from whatever software you choose. Volume control can be done via software. All you need to buy is the active speakers and a cable to connect the sound card to them. Just like in your main system, the speakers will ultimately determine the sound of the system.

Good luck,
Bob

[PaulFolbrecht]

I disagree with the notion that the speakers are essentially the only "important" component when it comes to sound quality.  This is somewhat true with cheaper speakers and comparing similar brands and styles of entry-grade electronics; it's not generally true.  The source is where the signal starts.  Nothing that comes after it can do anything to repair damage/losses that occur at the transport/DAC (& amp) level.

Fortunately hard drives are great transports and there are not lots of cheap DACs, especially NOS DACs, that sound great.  These give really suberb music at low cost.

The chibi DAC is supposed to be great in USD as well as the MHDT USB DACs sold on eBay.  I have heard the latter.. so much better than the Tivoli CDP that I use at the office that I'm going to have to snag one myself soon. 

Try to listen to some of these NOS DACs or do some reading.  The believing is in the hearing and you will hear!!

That said, some like the DAC of a modified squeezebox just fine... but I've never heard good things about stock units.

One of these DACs would leave you well over $1000 for amp & speakers (more like $1250)... lots and lots of good combos possible there, especially used.  Depends on what you like.  There was an Onix Melody tube integrated on agon recently for $450 or so, if that is your thing.  I used to own one and that would be a steal and that little monster would have no problems with even hard-to-drive bookshelf speakers.

There are just too many choices in speakers almost to comment on.  I kind of hate recommending only what I've heard/owned because there is so much other stuff... but... the cheaper DynAudio monitors would meet your price range used, and are stellar. 

If you are going to go solid-state amp I would recommend at least 100W/ch to avoid any clipping at all, unless you're into hi-eff speakers.  It's when clipping is introduced that the cheaper, typical class AB SS amp starts sounding very fatiguing and unmusical. 

[JLM]

DavidS,

To go the audio PC/Squeeze Box route you need:

- free downloads of EAC (Exact Audio Copy), FLAC (Free Lossless Audio Codec), and Slimdevices software

- sufficient hard drive space to store your music (I suggested a 400 GB hard drive, because that's how much memory you'd need to store 1000 FLAC compressed audio CDs.  However a purdent person would buy 2 hard drives and use one as a backup.)

- The Squeeze Box (SB) is then connected to the PC that  via USB cable or wirelessly if you have a high speed internet service and wireless local network there.  The Squeeze Box then plugs into your integrated amp, pre-amp, or just your power amp.  (As the Squeeze Box has a high quality digital volume control and interfaces with internet audio streaming, you can do without a pre-amp or tuner.)

- Once you get through the setup (I barely did with help) and can keep it running (I had network/PC issues to the point I bailed out, but a modified SB was my the source in my main system) you're done.  If you're computer savy it should be no problem.

One of the confusion factors is the number of options that the Squeeze Box offers.  The SB has digital outputs, so some folks use it (in combination with the PC) as a "transport" and send the digital signal to the DAC of their choice.  The SB also has digital inputs, so you could use it as a DAC.  Or you can use it as I described above with the PC to replace a CD player and internet "radio" for audio streaming. 

And the SB can be fully modded, or just the digital half, or just the analog portion.  Fully modded its sound quality rivals Benchmark, Scott Nixon, and other similar DACs.

Squeeze Box offers better sonics than just using a PC and with it's remote and large display, the most convenience possible (after you've ripped the CDs onto the hard drive).  Additional SB's can be added wirelessly throughout the house that can simultaneously use the PC to play different music throughout (of course you'd need to add some sort of powered speakers or amp/passive speakers at each of those locations). 

Sonus is a similar product, but I'm not aware of audiphile mods for it.  It's remote includes the display.

[NewBuyer]

...The SB also has digital inputs, so you could use it as a DAC...

Hi JLM! Just wanted to clarify that regarding digital inputs, the SB has only an ethernet port (no coax or toslink). Fortunately the ethernet port is much better in this application!

[DavidS]

Hi all

This has been great primer which has helped me understand most of the other threads I have read. 

Lots of options on this but after reading lots of reviews and opinion think I will go squeeze box 3 with elpac upgrade from bolder from my pc to one of the cheap zero based dacs (like what I have read and price range of the MHDT dacs) into affordable low watt integrated (not sure tube or solid state yet) with pair of higher efficiency speakers.  Will be very different from my main system so should be lots of fun.  Can get sbox modded later - my goal is not absolute sound - more functionality, good quality sound at lower volumes, and streaming audio, even the odd ball game while I work.

David

[DavidS]

A month and a bit since my last post and have a new pc based system up and running.  Little different than I originally planned - including going over budget like always with audio gear.  My Dell PC is feeding an unmodded squeezebox 3 into a second hand Audio Zone Amp 1 with new Audio Note AX2 speakers and audio note cables (all still breaking in). 

I am most impressed with sound quality - using stock power cords no power treatment or squeezebox upgrades although have ordered Bolder modded elpac.  Most pleasant for me is streaming audio sounds nearly as good as ripped cds and with nearfield listening lower volumes very easy listening with lots of detail.  Enjoying Paris TSF 89.9 jazz tonight after KCRW earlier - barely used my main system waiting for me in the living room the last 3 weeks.  In hindsight should have got Bolder mods on the Squeezebox first - now not sure I can give it up for a month plus so may have to go dac route when the upgrade bug says how good could this really sound.

Only negative has been battling my boys for bandwidth to keep the streaming audio coming without interuption.


David