[Canyoneagle]

I know that Louis at Omega is in the process of tweaking an OB specifically voiced with the sig 30 in mind, and I'm following the developments as the process unfolds (I'm sure I'm not alone!   )

I've become quite interested in the idea of OB speakers, and have the ability to actually design my home with OB's in mind (probably a strawbale / timberframe). 

Without venturing too far into the "test bench" side of the fence, my main concern of the OB format is sufficient bass response (It is part of the musical performance, after all).
I've noticed that Hawthorne Audio Duet http://www.hawthorneaudio.com/speakers.htm  seems to address this, but I'm really drawn to a single-driver format (I'd love to avoid a crossover, or minimize the "re-integration" process).
Does anyone have experience with the Hawthornes or other OB speakers, especially with the sig 30?

Thanks!
Michael

[Canyoneagle]

Well, no sooner had I posted this, when I felt intuitively drawn to dive into the dark star thread.

Holy crap!

As Rosanne Rosannadanna used to say.......

"never mind"...............

Hmmmmmmm.......... I see MDF and a pair of B200's in my future......
Good thing my wife is a music lover, too!!!!!!

Michael

[Vinnie R.]

Well, no sooner had I posted this, when I felt intuitively drawn to dive into the dark star thread.

Holy crap!

As Rosanne Rosannadanna used to say.......

"never mind"...............

Hmmmmmmm.......... I see MDF and a pair of B200's in my future......
Good thing my wife is a music lover, too!!!!!!

Michael

Hi Michael,

Welcome to Audiocircle and the RWA forum!

Be sure the check out the new Open Baffle Speakers Circle:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?board=90.0

Louis is developing his own Open Baffle Hemp Drivers for use with his OB design (which is subject to some modification). 

As for DIY'ing, the B200s are a great value and you can start out with some plywood and a router.  You'll be shocked by how amazing these can sound compared to some much more expensive speakers.  Lots of info over at the new Open Baffle Circle and expect a lot more to come.  Jump on in over there and join in on the party 

As for the Sig 30... it is a fantastic combo with the B200s (I even added the B200s to my new links page: http://www.redwineaudio.com/links.html) and you better believe it will also be great with the upcoming Omega open baffle hemp drivers     I have a feeling that these are going to be my babies 

Thanks for joining here!

Vinnie

[Canyoneagle]

Thanks, Vinnie.

It feels as if I have found my way home after a long and exhausting journey through a dizzying array of distractions and traffic..

As I awake in this place that feels "right" for me, I am taking the baby steps of shedding the layers of grime that this journey has left on me 

I am reminded of the first time I heard Quad ESL's and knew there was something there that could not be quantified or explained.

So now, the journey begins anew.
Thanks for staying so engaged with your ever-growing group of customers, friends and fellow music lovers.

Cheers! :cheers:
Michael

[fu_man]

So Michael,
have you already bought the Sig 30 and are looking for speakers? If not - do it!

My  Omega Sig  30's are still burning in -  and getting better day by day.  I have  been toying with the idea of  low powered  amps (to drive horns - that  don't exist yet)  for a  while.  After  being so impressed  with Vinnies  mods to the Squeezebox I was  very keen on this amp.  I have electrostatics -  and AE1's  so I needed  something to  drive...

I actually  received the B200's  first  and and had  been burning them in with an  integrated  Exposure  amp.  The Sig  30 arrived a couple of  weeks  ago and they  were a  big improvement. Up until  a few  days ago they were  stuck in the corner of the lounge  playing - I finally moved the  stats and  put the sig  on the  rack - and the OB's with some space around them.
I'm not making  any final comments at the moment - but  I have had a  really difficult time coming off the Electrostats..  nothing much has taking my fancy as a  replacement.  However  - with the  Sig 30's  burning in, and the  setup ...setup - I'm not  missing my stats.  These open baffle are playing lovely music.  ( I use that term so as not to pretend to be trying to write a  review here)

As for  bass - I  had been using a  REL  sub  with the  stats, so anticipate using it  with the OB's - just  experiencing a  few  difficulties  at the moment  so can't comment on this. 
I would like  to know how  those  VBT /TBI  mini sized  subs  work  with these speakers.  Ha vent heard  much about those, but I keep my REL fairly low on the gain  so might be the sort of  person that those fast little  subs  suit.  If you like the  'presence' of  bass  -I doubt the OBs  will do it for you alone.  But  room effects yadayadayada who knows.

i tried my Sig 30 on a friends newly acquired Roger Studio 2A   - which he had running on his Quad  2's.  The bass became much more acceptable, well integrated, and the whole  sound  had much more  presence and life.

I thought about  adding a  second  pair of driver to my OB's but  with Louis new  hemp drivers   somewhere over the horizon I think I will wait and see.

Straw-bale house ay?...  Have you read the Eighth Nerve theory on  room treatment   - the perfect  room being one without corners...?  I love the  massive proportions of walls in straw-bale houses  but have never  been a fan of the rounded corners...  this could convince me tho... at least in the listening room!

[Dmason]

The sound the Signature 30 and B200 on open baffle make together is something I believe would make most high end audio retailers very concerned about. Both amp and driver are absolute musical Monsters, in my thirty years experience of tweaking audiophoolery, I have yet to hear anything more standout. I also consider the Signature 30 to be a "triode" single ended amp, --without the tubes. I am by no means alone in that impression.

People are having audio epiphanies with either, and especially both. Every tune is a "live" musical event.

The coming Omega Hemp OB drivers should be equally interesting, and I find myself almost anxious to get going with the prototype evaluation. Mint chocolate flavor. I have discovered the 30 to have similarly incredible synergy with the hemp drivers, the Super Hemp in my case, and, all things being equal, I prefer the presentation of the hemp cone material. It seems like a modern Altec 604, or Tannoy Gold type of high-calorie vibe. In other words, a BIG sound, to it.

[Canyoneagle]

Hi there, Fu-Man.   Nope, I don't own the sig 30, YET.  I wil probably make a purchase this Winter (I have some other financial commitments at the moment - damn it).  I've come to roost in the RWA camp after much experience, research and contemplation.  At one time, I had a room full of very nice gear that seemed to satisfy my "audiophile" friends, but left me somewhat disillusioned due to the lack of "musicality".  I started experimenting with Naim electronics and Naim, Linn and Castle speakers, and got rid of all of my other gear (amidst the finger shaking and ridicule of my audiophile friends).
Now I am moving away from the power grid, and have the need for a music system that is musical, efficient (for an alternative energy system) and somewhat affordable.  In finding RWA, I feel that not only have those requirements been met, but I also feel that RWA would be my choice if I were still "on the grid".

Because I have a bit of time to see how things develop with the various OB options (Omega, the B200 pioneers, etc), I will stay in touch with the Audio Circle threads until it is time for me to make the purchase.
I enjoy working with wood, and am pretty handy with most DIY type projects (although I've never worked with electronics), so I'm intrigued with the idea of making my own speakers (even if I purchase some as well).
For the Low-Frequency stuff, one idea I've thought about is building an in-wall bass "tube" (horn) with a high efficiency driver with a sub-only crossover, driven by a basic "super -T" type amp.  This is something I plan to look into on the various DIY forums.  I've also wondered about using one of the Horn Shoppe's "Hornline" bass units.  I am trying to avoid AC current amplifiers to minimize inverter load on my home (which I am still designing).

So, I've got some time to research and perhaps listen to OB's at shows and/or houses..........

Until then, I will continue to enjoy listening to my AKG k-701's!

Cheers,
Michael

[fu_man]

Michael,
sounds  like  quite an  adventure you are  heading into. The older British  Exposure  gear was often mentioned in the company of Naim & Linn....  My little integrated is  quite nice on my AE 1's.  These  are fairly inefficient but I am curious to try the Sigs on them.   On the OB the Exposure is nothing  compared to the Sig. 
As I read your post  the El-pipe-o  came to mind....  Nelson Pass:
http://www.passdiy.com/projects/el-pipe-o-9.htm  ( includes  a beautifully simple description of how a bass reflex and transmission line work)
these  seem a little  scary - but i love the simplicity... a (big) piece of Sonotube with a driver  stuck at one end, playing together  with a   piece of board  with a  driver  stuck thru it... yes Dan,  maybe  that is something for  high end  retailers to get  worried  about.  Michael I don't think they will meet your low power  requirement tho.
I  wonder what  would happen  if  you stuck one of  those 25 inch hemp cones onto the end of the Sonotube

Dan,  do you think  my Plinius 125 W  class A ( all the  way) amps  might  do harm to the B200?  Seeing as I haven't quite  yet  fulfilled  my  promise to my wife to sell off gear as new  gear  comes in...  I may as  well mix it up a bit.

And Dan, you're getting  anxious???  I hear you and Vinnie are first in line!  ( quite  rightly too) but how long  till us little  people can get to hear it. ... actually I'm quite  chuffed  at being able to benefit  from your experimentation.
Given the status of the B200 I don't  suspect  that Louis would bother  releasing anything  until he thinks it is 'better'. ...how  can anyone  convinced on OB's  resist?

and finally back to bass -  I have my REL Storm hooked up and oh man... it  has all just  even better.  Actually now  with the  bass and  the Sig  30 a bit more  burnt in the system is starting to give me the goosebumps  that i  remember  when i  first set up my stats.  With the  REL in place  everything  seems smoother.

[Dmason]

I think the Plinius might sound fantastic. I have never read anything but positive remarks. I tried the B200 with a Hafler 9505 I used to own, so I can say that Class A sand amp sound good. Class A allows the music to flow. A good start.

[Canyoneagle]

That "el-pipe-o" looks right on with what I was asking about.  I could imagine many options to easily incorporate something like that into the design of a house to minimize te visual factor.
I guess another option is an infinite baffle, but that would probably be hard to implement in the house that I envision.

As far as getting good, flat, fast bass (to interface with an OB) with low power, what about an array of smaller diameter tubes?  Isn't it true that sensitivity/efficiency increases with more drivers, if they're wired correctly?  Hmmm, maybe 6 to 8 4" PVC or sonotubes cut to different lengths to spread the spectrum?  It would be pretty easy to build a "cove" along the wall behind the system to cover the pipes.  Or what about two pipes along the floor and tow along the walls, ported into the corners?  Didn't (cough, cough) Bose have one of these in the early days of home theater?  I recall seeing a theater system with a large diameter subwoofer tube (emblazoned with "bose") suspended from the ceiling at an upscale housing compound when I lived in Saudi Arabia.

Generally, the "tube" format derinitely appeals, as does the folded horn/transmission line/quarter wave type approach.

It is fun to consider the possibilities, and I can easily see some experimentation in the future.
Cheers,
Michael

[Russell Dawkins]

Many years ago, I used to babysit at a neighbor's and get paid in electrical parts. This man turned me on to hi-fi.

He never bought anything that he hadn't first considered making, and this went all the way from his house, through his hi-fi (mono), his turntable (he bought the cartridge, main bearing and motor and made everything else) - the cabinet in woven cedar for ventilation, the (Williamson tube) amp and even his TV (Heathkit!).

His speakers - there were 5 for the one channel - were completely hidden. Two fiteens for the bass were cleverly hidden on a wall behind a framed piece of burlap with a design in driftwood on it, the clever part was the "enclosure". Technically, it was semi-infinite baffle in that the back of the woofers emptied into a rather large clothes closet. The hanging coats and so on provided the damping! The midrange drivers were 2 - 12s also hidden in another wall behind some sort of screen. The tweeter was a multicellular horn sitting on top of the aforementioned closet, spraying highs up at the vaulted 14 foot high ceiling to scatter down like confetti. He mainly like pipe organ music and this was my first exposure to real hi fi (in 1959).

I bring this all up partly in honor of the man (Mark De Goutiere, who died a few months ago) but also to alert you to the possibilities of this configuration for bass.
I would not choose any form of tube or any tuned system for bass if I could avoid it. This flies in the face of what is so appealing about open baffle - the elimination of complex box resonances in favor of one simple resonance - that of the driver itself. IB or OB bass shares this characteristic, but IB tends to be much more practical, and space efficient.