Amplification foir RM30

Eugene2 · « **on:** 29 May 2006, 01:19 pm »

I am new to audiocircle looking for amplification to support RM30s with all upgrades except TRT caps. I am thinking about Ampzilla, Nuforce 9se, Van Alstine 550 or Bel Canto modified 300 or 1000 monoblocs any opinions? Also have a Pass x0.2 preamp and Lector cdp7t with Serenity silver cable.javascript:emoticon(':roll:')

zybar · « **Reply #1 on:** 29 May 2006, 01:20 pm »

I would definitely add the Channel Island D-200's into the mix.

George

John Casler · « **Reply #2 on:** 29 May 2006, 02:40 pm »

Hi Michael,

I think an interesting thing you'll find with this question is that there have been many great pairings of VMPS speakers with amps across the board, and the differences are distinct and preferential.

It is often heard that VMPS sound great with tubes. (Kora, Van Alstine, Jolida, Hurricanes, Bruce Moore, etc)

Then there are those who like the sound with conventional Solid State. (AMPzilla, Pass, Plinius, Bryston, etc)

Now over the last couple years and "switching" amps become more refined, the reports are great with them too. (Carver Pro, Spectron, NuFORCE, etc)

I think you'l find that many suggestions will be made, and the input will be useful as long as you stay true to your listening preferences.

Do remember that the VMPS speakers are highly detailed and will show you what is being "fed" them.

They also like lots of current "if" you like to play them at high SPL's or have a large room.

I have a client who recently switched to running his RM40s from a pair of Son's of AMPzilla, (vertically biamped) 200wpc @ 4 ohms, to a CineNova (600wpc @ 4 ohms, for the woofer system, and a pair of the Son's using only one channel (like Brian does) for the mids and tweets. His room is HUGE and this works quite well.

A couple days ago, I took two pair NuFORCE Ref 9's (not the SE) and biamped, and the sound is beyond description.

So look at your requirements, your preferences, and your budget and get the best you can. It will be worth it.

meilankev · « **Reply #3 on:** 29 May 2006, 03:04 pm »

Mike,

Welcome to Audio Circles!!!

Just to let you know, I live in north Tampa, and I own RM40s. I know, I know - it's not the same exact speaker you are interested in. But if you would like to give them a listen, you are more than welcome to come by for a road trip. I have guys over all the time. Yesterday, I actually had two different groups come by. First, I had a couple of high school guys who claim to have never seen a turntable. Man, was that a blast seeing the looks on their faces. And last night, three men came by, and we spent 3 hours listening to some tunes. A great day, all around.

I drive my RM40s full range with tube monoblocks, which is fed the signal from a tube preamp. However, you would be welcome to bring any components you like to help get a feel for what you think works, and what doesn't.

Again, I realize this would not be an ideal demo for you, as I do not own RM30s - but it should provide you with some valuable info in your making an educated decision.

Let me know - I'm sure we'd have a great time.

Kevin

Briang · « **Reply #4 on:** 29 May 2006, 05:17 pm »

Small world. I live in Tampa too and I have an AVA 350 Ultra on the way.

Eugene2 · « **Reply #5 on:** 29 May 2006, 08:07 pm »

The replies have been useful, I am going to the Stereophile show next week to take a look. Hopefuuly that and the advice from these threads will help me make a decision. Tampa audiophiles, I am there on Mondays for staff meetings maybe I can take a listen to your RM40 setup with tubes.

meilankev · « **Reply #6 on:** 7 Jun 2006, 11:21 am »

Mike,

Any Monday is good - particularly now that it is Summer. I get home from work each day at ~5:00 pm, and we could get started soon thereafter. That would give you a full 2 or 3 hours to get a good feel for things, and still get you home at a reasonable time in the evening.

Kevin

mca · « **Reply #7 on:** 7 Jun 2006, 04:22 pm »

My vote would be for the Van Alstine 550 or a Butler TDB2250. I have heard them both on VMPS speakers and they they are both great sounding amps.

warnerwh · « **Reply #8 on:** 8 Jun 2006, 04:13 am »

Welcome to Audiocircle and to the VMPS Forum!

Of all the amps I"ve tried the two hybrid amps are the best sounding to me by a significant margin. First pick would be the Van Alstine Fetvalve's. The Blue Circle hybrid's are also excellent but don't have as much power and cost more.

The planar/ribbon section will be letting you hear just how good the gear in front of them really are.

I have only used the hybrids on top in a biamp setup but have been told the bass is excellent by another RM 40 owner with the Fetvalve 550. No pure SS amp sounds like the hybrid amps. The hybrids seem to lose nothing to a pure ss amp as they're not tubey but have the qualities of tubes that make the sound more natural or real.

mlawson66 · « **Reply #9 on:** 20 Jun 2006, 08:10 pm »

Mike,

I have the same speakers that you do. They do double duty in my HT and 2 channel system. I started out with an Outlaw Audio amp (relic from earlier HT system). I couldn't stand it. The RM30s showed every wart, wrinkle and what-the-hell was that noise that came out of that amp...

Next we tried a Son of Ampzilla. That sounded really good, but the rest of the HT system had a lot more power behind it. The next phase was bi-amping, using the outlaw for the subs on the RM30s. The top half of the RM30s really came to life. Liquid mids an non-sibilant trebles. Very nice, but the subs were flubby, lazy and late, thanks to the outlaw.

In the next phase, we added NuForce Reference 9s for the RM30 subs. Excellent, tight bass. All the difference in the world. For the HT system, this was pretty close to Nirvana. In the 2 channel mode, that bottom octave was missing. The NuForce amps have a little higher gain than the Ampzillas, so the 30-60 Hz range was accentuated a bit, but the very bottom was missing. On the bright side, I heard detail in the bass/mid-bass that I had never heard before. The mids and trebles were (and still are) incredible. Close your eyes, and you can suspend disbelief, and be right in front of the band.

I had the Reference 9s stacked, and one day there was the tell tale smell of burnt phenolic, and the blue eye went out on one of the Ref 9s. Jason with NuForce had me fixed up right away. Those guys rock. If you go with NuForce, they will take care of you. I understand that the Ref 9s have been updated to include a thermal protection circuit, but to help them run cooler, I've added 2x2 strips of wood as foot extenders for better air flow.

Well, I contracted upgrade-idis again. That Outlaw amp was still in the system, driving the surrounds. That, and the 2 channel system needed a sub. Enter John Casler of Summit Audio, with some great ideas and awesome deals. We ordered a Larger sub (all upgrades), an LRC set up for bi-amping, all upgrades short of TRT, 2x Ampzilla 2000 monoblocks, NHT xover, CineNova 3, Bryston SP2 and 2 more NuForce Ref 9s. I'll be sleeping on the couch for a while, but at least I'll have some good company...

So far, the CineNova 3 and NuForce amps have arrived. The current configuration is: CineNova 3 running RM30s full out, NuForce Ref 9s on center and all 4 surrounds (626Rs). It has been running that way for a few days now, and the CineNova is breaking in nicely.

Impressions:

The CineNova arrived in a crate, like King Kong was inside or something. That is pretty much how it sounds on the RM30s. Very strong, full ranged and clean. Not as sibilant as many SS amps I've heard. Not as warm NuForce. Not as liquid and tube-like as the Ampzilla, not as tight as NuForce, but strong like bull. This is going to be a good choice for the subs.

NuForce for HT speakers. You get an sense of exact position of everything happening on screen. Usually when a round goes whizzing by, it just sounds like it was panned from one side to the other. Now, you can hear that it is cutting across diagonally, with a quartering tail wind, and the guy that fired the round had beans for lunch.

The center channel is very happy too. Gone is the hollow and recessed sound. You can actually understand what the extras are saying in the background...

Nice, nice, very nice. Will post again when new bits arrive.

Many thanks to John Casler of Summit Audio, and thanks to Jason and the folks at NuForce. If I didn't already have an Ampzilla, I would have gone with bi-amped Reference 9 SE's for RM30s, an SE for the LRC and Reference 9s for the rest.

Eugene2 · « **Reply #10 on:** 24 Jun 2006, 05:47 pm »

Thanks for the info, you guys are great. My buddy just purchased RM30s, the big center channel, dipoles and two medium subs. He currently is using anthem equipment. I must say on two channel audio you can tell it is not broken in yet (a little bright and forward). The surround sound is incredible you hear every detail in movies. I am currently dealing with family illness so I have not been able to complete my system, which will be mainly two channel. There are a lot of amplifier choices out there, I have also talked to Klaus Bunge at Odyssey about some beefed up extremes, we'll see...
MB

mlawson66 · « **Reply #11 on:** 24 Jun 2006, 06:17 pm »

Sorry to hear about the family illness. Well wishes to you and your family...

Yeah, I think my RM30s are still breaking in. After 2 years, they just keep sounding better and better.

On my system, it seems like the biggest change is between 6 months and a year. They get more of a relaxed and effortless quality as they break in. Those mid panels are magic, and their is nothing sweeter than the ribbon tweeter for clean trebles. I do suggest either a tube stage or an amp with neutral to warm qualities. If you get a chance, check out NuForce Reference 9ES monoblocks. I believe they are in the same price range as the K&B, and do have a nice warm quality about them. That and very good control of bass. Here is a review of them...

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/nuforce3/9se.html

I believe they won amp of the year!

Zheeeem · « **Reply #12 on:** 9 Aug 2006, 07:22 pm »

I'm running Van Alstine stuff - Ultra DAC, T-7 pre and FetValve 350EXR. Unfortunately my RM30s - while ordered - won't arrive for a few weeks. I'm looking forward to telling you that it sounds fantastic. In september... For now, I can only imagine that it sounds fantastic. A bit like reading a review, really.

Darac · « **Reply #13 on:** 10 Nov 2006, 09:30 pm »

In german ebay seller offer the Mcintosh MC2600 2x600 watt/8ohms. What do you think ??

warnerwh · « **Reply #14 on:** 11 Nov 2006, 06:48 am »

I think a Macintosh amp would be a good match for Vmps speakers. I'm surprised more people haven't tried them because I think the Mac sound is a much better than usual match for Vmps speakers. Most SS amps are very similar but he Mac amps have quite a nice sonic signature, very controlled. Maybe it's the autoformers or transformer output stage but I remember distinctly liking it better than another amp when demoing them both some years ago.

As John said there's alot of Vmps owners using alot of different amplifiers. Some pure tube top to bottom, others biamping and most probably using a straight SS amp. The most important part of what you want is a quality power amplifier. The Mac I'd suspect is better than most but the speakers will output very accurately what's put into them. Make no mistake about it.

john1970 · « **Reply #15 on:** 11 Nov 2006, 02:43 pm »

I have a pair of fully-loaded RM40s (MLS cabinets, Blackhole 5 treatment, TRT caps, Supermax OXO). For the past few weeks I've been driving them with a Bryston 4B SST. IMO this amp is an excellent match for VMPS speakers. Like the VMPS speaker, the Bryston amp is extremely detailed and clear with extremely low THD (<0.007%).

The local VMPS dealer (Scott Mayo at Obsession Audio) also uses Bryston gear (6B SST and 4B ST) for a dedicated 5-channel setup.

Other highlights of Bryston equipment include excellent build quality, transferable 20 year warranty, better value than Macintosh gear which IMO is a bit overpriced.

Best,

John

Darac · « **Reply #16 on:** 11 Nov 2006, 06:44 pm »

Well boys ! Thanks for your advice and suggestions. I look the Mac amps like kid who look a brand new electric toys. My friend is dealer for Bryston in Croatia. If I decide to buy a Mac, maybe buy from second-hand.

Of course, solid state is first option !

Avalon_62 · « **Reply #17 on:** 1 Jul 2008, 08:59 am »

Quote from: Eugene2 on 29 May 2006, 01:19 pm

I am new to audiocircle looking for amplification to support RM30s with all upgrades except TRT caps. I am thinking about Ampzilla, Nuforce 9se, Van Alstine 550 or Bel Canto modified 300 or 1000 monoblocs any opinions? Also have a Pass x0.2 preamp and Lector cdp7t with Serenity silver cable.javascript:emoticon('')

On my own RM30Ms I have tried Audio Valve Challenger 115 , ( monos with six EL34 each ) rated at 115W with great results. The mids and highs are magic and the low freq also excellent!!! Even with the smaller amps of Audio Valve the mono Avalons ( 8 EL84 each rated at 60W ) the sound was great !!!