Dac or CD player recomendations.

buckeyefanandy · « **on:** 20 Mar 2006, 01:08 am »

I am looking to find a cd player or dac to soften things up. I am fatigued after listening sessions. Any ideas or experience is appreciated.
I have looked at a cal sigma dac and musical fidelity xd10 tube buffer. I am on a budget and need to get things together soon, the grind is getting on my nerves.

I have also looked into a audio refinement cd complete or a music hall 25 and a norh cd 1. Rega and others may be out of my range.

andy

arthurs · « **Reply #1 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 01:20 am »

Look into the Liteaudio DAC60 at GR Research and discussed in several threads here. Unmodded <$500 and modded <$800 no fatigue at all....

kfr01 · « **Reply #2 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 01:23 am »

It is FAR more likely the fatigue is being caused by your speakers or room problems than your electronics....

What are you using for speakers?

GHM · « **Reply #3 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 01:26 am »

One word..OK maybe two

NON OS

buckeyefanandy · « **Reply #4 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 01:29 am »

I am switching to a pair of apogees ina month or so when I move.

I have a pair of Chapmans
A denon dcd 3520
Etesian pre
Khartago Extreme amp ( may move to monos)

Sonic Impact wires and ics.

kfr01 · « **Reply #5 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 01:37 am »

Quote from: buckeyefanandy

I am switching to a pair of apogees ina month or so when I move.

I have a pair of Chapmans
A denon dcd 3520
Etesian pre
Khartago Extreme amp ( may move to monos)

Sonic Impact wires and ics.

It would make zero sense to spend money before hearing your new speakers in your new room.

Remember, the speakers and room dictate sonic quality decades of magnitude more than any other component in your system.

GHM · « **Reply #6 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 01:39 am »

The Denons in stock form are quite fatiguing IMHO. Source is a good place to start. I've also noticed a little grain in the highs with my denon .

opnly bafld · « **Reply #7 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 01:39 am »

Hey Andy,
Monica DAC kit from diyparadise.com you can put in a case yourself or Red Wine Audio dac assembled(Monica) for $450.
Battery powered NOS DAC.
If you don't hear an improvement, I think you will, you could easily sell it.

opnly bafld

byteme · « **Reply #8 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 01:46 am »

Quote from: GHM

One word..OK maybe two NON OS

Agreed. A non-OS dac is the way to go. Nixon's tubedac is in my system and I love it. The ACK! dac I hear is good too but I've not heard it.

GHM · « **Reply #9 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 01:49 am »

Sorry... a room isn't going to make the music grainy. If your signal starts out like crap..no room or speaker will change it.

kfr01 · « **Reply #10 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 01:52 am »

Quote from: GHM

Sorry... a room isn't going to make the music grainy. If your signal starts out like crap..no room or speaker will change it.

First, did I say it fixed grain? Did he even say he has a grain issue? You are reading the word "grain" somewhere into the thread. I didn't see it. I certainly didn't say it.

Second, you're right about a room not being able to fix the specific "grain" problem, but a speaker and room can create some reflection problems, phase, frequency response, time, and distortion issues that lots of people would consider fatiguing.

These problems are far more real and of higher magnitude than any electronic induced problems, unless you use pure shit for a front end.

Look, he hasn't even heard his system in his new place with his new speakers. Now, I'm fine with upgrading for the sake of upgrading, but I think the smart move would be to wait....

If I remember correctly, his speakers have a titanium dome tweeter!

Now, which do you think is more probable, his electronics that likely measure flat are producing the fatigue, or his speakers with a titanium dome tweeter in a room that is likely untreated?

flintstone · « **Reply #11 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 02:06 am »

Every now and then an old Counterpoint DA-10A Dac with the Ultra-Analog card comes up on Ebay $400-$500...grab one and mate it with a $100 Pioneer 563A/578A untill you can afford a better transport.

I have one of these old DAC's...sounds as good as a couple $3,000 cd players I've owned...very "analog" sounding. Mine reminds me of how my Sony XA-777es sounded when playing very well recorded SACD's.

BTW...I owned Apogee Centaur Minors for a few years, I've had Apogee Duetta Signatures as my main speakers for the last three years...which Apogee model are you thinking about?

Dave

buckeyefanandy · « **Reply #12 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 02:09 am »

Apogee Centaur Minors, I bought a perfect pair from a guy that is in the area. His wife made him put them away after he bouth them because she did not like the looks.

I have the pioneer dvd player that you wrote about, got for $60.00

GHM · « **Reply #13 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 02:09 am »

kfr01
I agree with you to some extent. I just get tired of people using the room as an excuse for crap response speakers or front ends to begin with..specifically dealers . Then they buy a room correction device ..which is really a speaker corection device to get the correct response in the room. Nothing wrong with it... but it should be called speaker correction not room correction. The front end makes a real difference. Maybe not in your system..but in most audiophile's systems I know the difference is obvious. The front end is just as important as the room and the speakers IMO.

kfr01 · « **Reply #14 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 02:23 am »

Quote from: GHM

kfr01
The front end makes a real difference. Maybe not in your system..but in most audiophile's systems I know the difference is obvious. The front end is just as important as the room and the speakers IMO.

Oh, I'm not completely disagreeing with you.

Besides speakers, moving to a quality dac has been the largest sonic upgrade to my system I've made.

I just think he should wait until he hears the sonic character of his new speakers in his new room before spending more money.

This way he can demo and consider before / after impressions. This is the conservative route and appropriate for someone who admits he's on a budget, no? Certainly you can't disagree with being patient and taking time to carefully select components that have an overall pleasing synergy.

flintstone · « **Reply #15 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 02:30 am »

Ah, the Centaur Minors are nice little speakers. I drove mine with both SS and Tubes at one time or another. I last used mine as center or rears in an all Apogee surround sound system...sold them off not long ago and went back to my VMPS's for hometheater...more slam for all those booms and bangs. Hope you got the stands with them?...if not you'll want to find or build a pair.

Dave

GHM · « **Reply #16 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 02:33 am »

kfr01,
Yes this makes some sense. Although The new source should perform the same in either room. If he's like me..he's impatient

. He can always pick sources with return policies, so if it doesn't work out he can return it.
Once he hears a clear difference in sources..I doubt the speaker change will change his mind on a better source. He may find out his current speakers are just fine.

lazydays · « **Reply #17 on:** 29 Mar 2006, 08:17 am »

Quote from: buckeyefanandy

I am looking to find a cd player or dac to soften things up. I am fatigued after listening sessions. Any ideas or experience is appreciated.
I have looked at a cal sigma dac and musical fidelity xd10 tube buffer. I am on a budget and need to get things together soon, the grind is getting on my nerves.

I have also looked into a audio refinement cd complete or a music hall 25 and a norh cd 1. Rega and others may be out of my range.

andy

First of all let me tell you that it's a well known thing that digital music is fatiguing to listen to. Ever notice that you can listen to several LPs, but are hard pressed to set thru three cd's?
So much for that! If your looking at redbook players, and are on a budgit, then you might want to listen to a Jolida 100A. I've got one that put my Sony 900ES to shame playing redbook CDs. Another good one to check out is the Marantz 8260. I see them in Audiogon for about $750 every now and then (new in the box, and not "B Stock"). The 8260 is about as good as the Jolida playing redbook CDs, but not quit as smooth (close but no cigar). But that's with the factory tubes in the Jolida! But the Marantz will of course play SACDs, and does this better than that Sony in every way. Another way to go is to look for a mont Cal Delta and a good DAC unit. My upstairs system has one that feeds an MSB unit with the 192KHz upsampleing boards plust the HDCD decoder. It's close to the Jolida, but have never had the two in the same system to be sure.
Myself, I'd buy the Marantz, and be done with it!
gary

Eduardo AAVM · « **Reply #18 on:** 29 Mar 2006, 03:58 pm »

I really like the Berendsen CDP-1, incredible CD player: Sound has weight, openess, detail, try it.

Bob A (SD) · « **Reply #19 on:** 2 Apr 2006, 05:10 pm »

I agree with the recommendations for a non OS DAC. I've owned a dAck! from initial release and have taken it through upgrades to the current v2.0. I've heard nothing that does as well for my ears and tastes than it.

As for a CDP, I just went through a lengthy period of analysis and have just popped for an Eastsound CD-E5 which should be in my hands in a week or so. Lots of info on Head-Fi regarding this unit which is often touted as a "giant killer."

--Bob