[Zissou]

After thinking I was getting somewhere with this company I am up against a brickwall. I will send this amp to any independent lab for testing.

Original post.

Have owned the Cinenova 5 for quite a while with no problems. Well I have had an issue, not a small one, and am very upset with Earthquake's response. We had the system on playing a movie as background noise when I heard a loud POP and a strange noise I'd never heard before. I glanced back at the amp and saw flames shooting from the top of the amp about a foot and a half to two feet in the air. Needless to say I ran to the amp and shut it down but it had already blown the wall plug breakers. The smell of an acrid electrical fire filled the air and I stood there stunned for a few moments. When lucidity kicked in I started wonder what else it had taken out, my speakers or pre/pro perhaps? I also started thinking I'd better call Earthquake but first we wanted to take the top off and see what damage had been caused. Luckily it looked like most channels were intact, no fuses had blown(???) and the 20 amp circuit breaker had not shut down. The huge capacitor on the channel that had literally "fried" was scarred black and had a hole and crack blown in it.
I called Earthquake and "luckily" the manager was in. After explaining my issue he immediately starting talking to me in a mocking tone of voice explaining he's never heard of this happening. I replied that I could care less if it hadn't happened before it had happened NOW! I explained that I lived in Canada and when I had purchased the amp the previous owner had phoned Earthquake and arranged for the unit to be covered. He started laughing and said that's impossible as we only cover the original owner. Now I know this to be false as I have recommended and probably sold more of these units than most dealers have and I know that warranties are transferrable as all the amps I had recommended to friends and colleagues had gone through this procedure. He then started to get rude and said well it doesn't matter as we do not cover any warranties in Canada. His voice started to raise and unfortunately instead of taking a deep breath I got angry as well and he hung up on me. So much for good or even reasonable service.
At this point being angry I decided to check deeper and see what damage had been done. This next bit attests to the superb build of these amps. I pulled the fuse from the literally "blown" channel and unhooked the two power wires running to it and damned if I didn't get 4 channels working perfectly. This after having flames shooting out of the top of the amp. At this point thinking my wife might do a better job, having a cooler head than I at this point, she called back and no they will not cover this under their ten year warranty so we're stuck for now. On one hand the sound is sublime, on the other hand since the unit is on 24/7 I do not know what would have happened had we not been home. There are curtains as room treatment fairly close to the amp and they easily could have caught on fire. To say I was alarmed and upset when I called might be an understatement but to have the manager, and he says he's been there 20 years, treat this so lightly and in such a condescending manner has shocked me and this happened 5 hours ago.
. I have probably recommended and sourced a dozen of these amps for people and I always talk highly of their sound quality, that still exists, and of the integrity of the company. When I first purchased mine and it replaced a Krell I was so excited I called the company and talked for half an hour to one of the engineers about all manner of music and sound. Clearly his friendly demeanor was an anomaly at Earthquake.
I am upset, angry and a little shaken up right now. I was expecting great service and instead I was derided and made to feel like an idiot. I hardly expect any resolution from them at this point but if they do I will update this posts. Until then I would be wary of purchasing what really is an amazing product.

We received the second confirmation of a fire as foloows:


Zissou,
I was just doing my weekly reading on this forum, not very active actually, and stumbled across this thread. I actually had the same issue with a Cinenova 5. I was lucky though as it was a brand new amp. When I uncrated it I was very excited. I got everything ready and was going to try it out. I was lucky the amp was so large as I couldn't get it in my equipment closet without help so I just left it out front of the equipment. After I connected everything I plugged it in and turned it on. Everything was sounding wonderful for about 30 minutes to 1 hour than I noticed a slight buzz or crackle on one of the channels. It got increasingly louder then popped. When it popped flames began coming out of the top of the amp and rose nearly 8-10 inches. If I had this thing in my rack it could have seriously damaged my ICs or other equipment. The amp was okay in the other 4 channels but is completely burned out the one channel. I worked with Earthquake and my dealer and did get some of the same attitude you got. The dealer offered a full refund or getting the amp fixed. I got a great deal on his last unit so I wanted to keep the amp. When working with Earthquake on the RMA and getting the unit fixed, they gave me the thrid degree on how everything happened. They told me they just couldn't believe one of their amps was shooting flames out of the top and then if it was it had to be my fault. Anyway, they did fix the amp but I had to pay shipping back to them on the module. My dealer ended up reimbursing me on the shipping so I ended up happy but overall I was definitely wary of their idea of customer service. Hopefully if anyone else has had this issue they can report it. I know that there have only been 2 reports but the first customer with a house fire from one of these amps will make headlines.


I and my wife were called terrorists by the president of the company because I posted the truth. They sent an amp out to me on the 27th and on the 28th they cancelled it. It is sitting on the dock 3 hours away from me and they will not send it. They also cannot fix the unit I have as it does not use the same modules supposedly. He claims my piece is one of 100 hand made units and none of the parts are interchangeable. I am now stuck with a boat anchor. As to why my postings slowed down they threatened me that if I did not stop posting there was NOTHING they would do for me.

 I also have been told unless I shut up everytime I post something the cost of repair goes up $500. Now what am I to do?

 The unit they sent on the 27th was contingent on me removing any negative posts about the company from the internet. Once they got their way they cancel the replacement and the fact remains that 2 and possibly three of these units have burst into flames so this poses a real health hazard.
 My wife called them and the VP screamed and yelled at her for 10 minutes then hung up. We are at our wits end and she's in tears.

[JRace]

Was that amp purchased new?
Was that amp ever modified?

[Zissou]

Was that amp purchased new?
Was that amp ever modified?

Not purchased new, and never modified in any way whatsoever which is why I have offered to send it to any independent lab for testing as to why it caught fire. Was always plugged into the wall and never a surge/power line conditioner per Earthquake's instructions.
 The amp was installed and never moved and the speakers were never changed. When this happened a movie was playing in the background at about 60dB.

[rosconey]

wow-

[Zissou]

wow-
that my friend is why you buy from a company like odyssey or one of the other mfg here-

a service issue that can cause that big a problem like setting a house on fire  is a reason to sue the crap out of them-

i have never been a sue type person but thats just plain wrong

I don't believe in suing either but it was the way we were treated after reporting this to them that was so unbelievable. You are correct about Odyssey as well. Great amps.
 You know if I designed an amp that caught fire, and it's not just mine but others, I'd be a bit concerned wouldn't you?

[rosconey]

well word will spread fast-they might just regret not doing whats right

just remembered my friend had his jvc reciever go smoke and fire on him,they didnt believe him either till he went to get it repaired and saw what happened,they treated him very well after that-

[Zissou]

well word will spread fast-they might just regret not doing whats right

just remembered my friend had his jvc reciever go smoke and fire on him,they didnt believe him either till he went to get it repaired and saw what happened,they treated him very well after that-

We have completely given up on them after a week of abuse, mistruths and false promises. I will have a tech come to look at it and then report to various goverment agancies. At this point they have left us no other options. We have tried to deal with them but to be screamed and yelled at for 10 minutes before we can get a word in is not my idea of how I like to be treated. I don't even yell at my dog.  

[John Casler]

Was that amp purchased new?
Was that amp ever modified?

Not purchased new, and never modified in any way whatsoever which is why I have offered to send it to any independent lab for testing as to why it caught fire. Was always plugged into the wall and never a surge/power line conditioner per Earthquake's instructions.
 The amp was installed and never moved and the speakers were never changed. When this happened a movie was playing in the background at about 60dB.

While I hate to step into this type of "storm", I have seen this poster has posted a campaign of "anti" Earthquake posts regarding this all over the web, including AVS and AudioHolics.

AudioHolics investigated and took his post off their site.

It seems that he has previously posted that "HE HAD" not only opened the amp, which many times voids a warranty, but had also "modded" the amp.

I'm not sure of the game being played here, but this poster may be lucky that EarthQuake doesn't seek legal remedies against him.

I would suggest that this post be put into the Fight Club, Galactic Wastebin, or some such, since these are all unproven allegations.

I do however have copies of the poster posting that he had "opened and modded" the amp.

It should also be known that the EarthQuake warrantee is not transferable to a second owner (This amp had at least "2" previous owners) and it also does not warrant amps that cross borders, and this one went from the US to Canada.

It sounds to me like this poster, bought a used amp (twice over), then opened it,  modded it, possibly leading to a short circuit, and is now trying to "Bully" the manufacturer into fixing a problem he created.

Also if you notice, this posters very first post was to come here and "SMEAR" EarthQuake.

Then he decided to ask some questions, and within a post is causing friction with someone who tried to help him

Just my take on this poor excuse of a complaint used to cooerce a reptutable manufacturer.

Give it up

[Zissou]

While I hate to step into this type of "storm", I have seen this poster has posted a campaign of "anti" Earthquake posts regarding this all over the web, including AVS and AudioHolics.

AudioHolics investigated and took his post off their site.

It seems that he has previously posted that "HE HAD" not only opened the amp, which many times voids a warranty, but had also "modded" the amp.

I'm not sure of the game being played here, but this poster may be lucky that EarthQuake doesn't seek legal remedie ...

With all due respect John the amp was NEVER modded in any way and the only time the top was off was AFTER the fire to see if there was any damages. My first post here is verbatim what was posted elsewhere. Audioholics also said I lived overseas and well I don't. Again the unit is STOCK and as said I will send to any lab for verification of this fact.
 AGAIN NOT MODDED and we do not expect anything from EQ and were advised by another dealer to not give them any CC information. Let me guess John you're a dealer for them? How about the other person who had a unit catch fore as well as a dealer who experienced it? Again both were unmodded and NOT OVERSEAS. I still love the damned amp. nothing sounds better, but it doesn't sound good when flames erupt and it doesn't work. I expect nothing from them and will endeavour to get it repaired locally.  I have never modded a damned thing in my life.



Then he decided to ask some questions, and within a post is causing friction with someone who tried to help him icon_rolleyes.gif



I am unsure what this means but if you'd like I will ship it to YOU so you can see what happened here.

 I thought they were reputable as well and hadn't anticipated the crap we've been put through. Judging by a couple dealers I've talked to and a few owners this service is not the exception as I quoted one other gentleman in the first post who also had a fire.
 Telling the truth and warning about a potential issue is HARDLY a smear campaign.
 You know it's pathetic I have to prove anything but you tell me what to do, who to ship it to and you will have your proof.
 I by the way have VERY post saved I made anywhere so there better not be any editing done. I also have emails from the GM confirming he was shipping a replacement amp out. If that doesn't prove cuplability what does? Then they canceled the shipment claiming their legal advisers had recommended against. I have every email and telephone conversation well documented. Nice to have a good lawyer who's also a good friend.

[John Casler]

With all due respect John the amp was NEVER modded in any way and the only time the top was off was AFTER the fire to see if there was any damages. My first post here is verbatim what was posted elsewhere. Audioholics also said I lived overseas and well I don't. Again the unit is STOCK and as said I will send to any lab for verification of this fact.
 AGAIN NOT MODDED and we do not expect anything from EQ and were advised by another dealer to not give them any CC information. Let me guess John you're a de ...

On 2-06-06 you wrote on the AVS forum where you were addressing the removal of the Earthquake amp channels, and you wrote:

Zissou
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 109    Quote:

I've done it a couple times when doing mods but it would be easier to call the guys. A tech or the designer will answer the phone and their customer service is amazing.
_______________________________________ _
Last edited by Zissou : 02-06-06 at 05:26 AM.

[Zissou]

Hahahaha mods was cleaning dust out of it and making sure all fuses were in tightly. Hardly a mod as the unit is electronically all stock. Every resistor, capacitor and te power cord. And I will ship the unit to you to prove it is so.
 And how does it explain the other 3 stock amps bursting into flames as well?
 As for legal remedies from them they are lucky I DON'T start a suit. If they want to send a gaggle of lawyers to see a burned, stock Cinenova five my door is open to them 24 hours a day!

[jackman]

Hahahaha mods was cleaning dust out of it and making sure all fuses were in tightly. Hardly a mod as the unit is electronically all stock. Every resistor, capacitor and te power cord. And I will ship the unit to you to prove it is so.
 And how does it explain the other 3 stock amps bursting into flames as well?
 As for legal remedies from them they are lucky I DON'T start a suit. If they want to send a gaggle of lawyers to see a burned, stock Cinenova five my door is open to them 24 hours a day!

Zisso,
Just my opinion but something seems fishy about your post.  I think you are trying to smear this manufacturer.  If you were a regular on this board, I would view this differently.  Anyway, for what it's worth, I don't believe your post is truthful.  

Good luck with your "un-modded" amp.  

J

[Zissou]

Just my opinion but something seems fishy about your post.  I think you are trying to smear this manufacturer.  If you were a regular on this board, I would view this differently.  Anyway, for what it's worth, I don't believe your post is truthful.  


J

Well you're entitled to your opinion but everything posted has been the truth. I have nothing against the product or company but they sure don't seem concerned about 3 different amps catching fire. The various government agencies in California all seem to be taking it quite seriously.
 If you think this is a smear campaign perhaps I should post emails received from them so you can see their level of service and the abuse they laid on me and my wife.

[Brian Cheney]

I must sympathize with the poster whose amp failed.  I think he has a few options:

1. Use it on the four good channels.  Disable the bad one by removing the fuses.  The failure sounds like a bad power supply filter cap.  They can overheat and explode as described.  Also, it is possible the manufacturer is using them at the limit of their voltage rating which would cause a failure during power surges.  If this happened more than once, and I were the manufacturer, I would spec a higher voltage cap and check every one I had in stock. Plus I would be most generous fixing any bad channels in the field, in or out of warranty.

2. Make some arrangement with the manufacturer or a local repair shop to have the one channel fixed.  If it is only a bad filter cap you're looking at $40 plus labor.

[Zissou]

I must sympathize with the poster whose amp failed.  I think he has a few options:

1. Use it on the four good channels.  Disable the bad one by removing the fuses.  The failure sounds like a bad power supply filter cap.  They can overheat and explode as described.  Also, it is possible the manufacturer is using them at the limit of their voltage rating which would cause a failure during power surges.  If this happened more than once, and I were the manufacturer, I would spec a higher voltage cap and chec ...

Thanks Brian! We are going to get a local shop to see what they can do. It's far too good a unit to just throw it away. There are 5 huge caps in the piece and the one that flamed exploded was just on the one channel. That's about as technical as I can get but it has happened to others. Again thanks for the advice.

[John Casler]

This might explain a bit.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20205

[Zissou]

This might explain a bit.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20205

Right John. That is so full of crap it's unbelievable, wouldn't have anything to do with Audioholics getting review samples. It says I lived overseas, no I live in Canada, says it was modded, no the unit was stock and other crap.
 Love to know who visited me overseas and checked out my amp while they were there.   It was spin put on by EQ. You can believe Earthquake or you can believe me and two others who had their amps catch fire. Your choice means nothing to me as the VAST majority know what the truth is. I have offered to send you the amp to see if it was modified but you don't seem too interested. I'll let you know if I move overseas k' John? Oh and I never realized reporting problems with gear or with a company needed such validation. I've offered you to verify the condition of the amp just tell me where to ship it. Oh and you ARE an Earthquake dealer aren't you? You get better service than the other ones I was talking to then because there are some very upset dealers out there.
     
 Bet you'd change your tune really quickly if you saw some of the emails they sent us.

[Levi]

I am interested.  Can you post some pictures?

[Zissou]

I am interested.  Can you post some pictures?

I will post some later today but I don't want this to look like a vendetta. Someone else may have a totally different experience with them, even if ours has been a nightmare. Funny how people come out of the woodwork after a post like this. We have heard from owners and dealers who have some not good things to say about them but in turn there are probably many who have positives to say.
 It's truly a shame that things turned out like this as I have said over and over again this is a fantastic sounding amp and one I had hoped to keep for many years; one I had also recommended to many people. Not only have they lost a customer but they lost someone who truly believed their product was exceptional. Customer service is the one thing that truly sets a company apart. Look at all the amazing free advertising that Bobby gets for Merlin. A great product, one he's proud of and one he stands behind.
 If a capacitor had just blown and they'd taken care of it things would have been different. But when a cap blows and there are flames, and we know of at least two other units this happened to, then it's a fairly serious issue. What if we hadn't been home that day?
 We received a call and many emails from them on the Monday following this wherein they offered us a new amp and went so far as to say they'd throw in a free jacket and asked for my size. I refused the jacket. It was requested of me to remove all internet posts when they sent the tracking number and some were and some weren't because this didn't negate the fact that there remained a potential hazard here. I sent an email asking for an update and heard nothing. When I tracked the number I found out the shipment had been canceled. Draw your own conclusions from that.
 As an aside one of the potential reasons for this happening, as stated by their chief engineer, is that the electricity is different in Canada than the U.S. That was certainly news to me.
 Anyone can put whatever spin they want to on this but we know what happened, we know where we live and we know the unit wasn't modded and nobody has even seen or expressed an interest in seeing the piece.
 The way we've been treated by them isn't a big issue in hindsight, we're adults and can take anything they do.
 Since it's an UNMODDED unit located in CANADA I hope we can find a tech to fix it. Brian's advice was appreciated and right on the mark. If the channel module is shot then I guess we're out of luck as I will not deal with them anymore and apparently there are no modules that work in this one anyway.

[Levi]

Yes Please.  I want to see them.

I will post some later today but I don't want this to look like a vendetta. Someone else may have a totally different experience with them, even if ours has been a nightmare. Funny how people come out of the woodwork after a post like this. We have heard from owners and dealers who have some not good things to say about them but in turn there are probably many who have positives to say.
 It's truly a shame that things turned out like this as I have said over and over again this is a fantastic sounding amp ...