SB3 does not sound as good as FM radio with similar music.

rajacat · « **on:** 25 Feb 2006, 02:12 am »

My system is not yet totally audiophile quality yet but I'm heading in that direction. Stock PS> unmodded SB3> Pioneer VSX-D498 AVR 80watts/channel (purchased at Costco about 5 years ago)> Ascend 340SE's. No subwoofer yet but the Ascends do OK with the FM stations bass. I'm considering some mods and a new PS but the waiting lists for the most popular modders are long so I might go with an external DAC instead. I want to get good sound now! Is the AVR the weak link or is the mods/DAC/PS the area that I should attend to first. The Pioneer is certainly a garden variety AVR but still its output from FM is, at least, acceptable. BTW, I use WAV files.

jermmd · « **Reply #1 on:** 25 Feb 2006, 02:15 am »

Rajacat,

Does FM music sound better than a CD on your system? I'm not sure how your experience could be explained because radio is usually so compressed.

rajacat · « **Reply #2 on:** 25 Feb 2006, 04:07 am »

Quote from: jermmd

Rajacat,

Does FM music sound better than a CD on your system? I'm not sure how your experience could be explained because radio is usually so compressed.

Yes, most of the time the particular FM jazz station that I listen to sounds better than the CD's that I play on my CD (DVD) player. This jazz station has an excellent signal quality and doesn't seem to be compressed much. The Ascends are excellent with a good source so perhaps they are exposing the deficits of the rest of my system. Two areas in which the SB3 is not lacking is the separation of the instruments and the soundstage but the timbre quality is a little harsh. Maybe my system is a little too digital. Would some tubes help? I'm considering a DAC that has tubes and it is supposed to be smooth and not so analytical.

PhilNYC · « **Reply #3 on:** 25 Feb 2006, 12:31 pm »

First thing I'd do is to go to the Server Settings->File Types and make sure your SlimServer isn't converting your WAV files to MP3 before sending them to the SB...

JoshK · « **Reply #4 on:** 25 Feb 2006, 07:25 pm »

I find that some radio stations sound better with my SUMO Aurora FM tuner, but only really good quality stations, which pretty much means none of the ones I am interested in. The Rock stations are clear but way too "boombox" eq'd. The indy stations don't come in very clearly.

SB playing internet radio is so-so quality because the streams are compressed (usually ~128kbps, but a lot are 192kbps). This makes them great for background music while working around the house which is a lot of my listening time these days. But the programming is so good on some stations that the quality being just listenable is pretty moot. Music first, quality second, although I can't typically listen to horrible streams like some of the 64kbps streams.

It has exposed me to a lot of great music that I have since picked up and ripped for Flac playback.

rajacat · « **Reply #5 on:** 25 Feb 2006, 07:48 pm »

Quote from: PhilNYC

First thing I'd do is to go to the Server Settings->File Types and make sure your SlimServer isn't converting your WAV files to MP3 before sending them to the SB...

I went to File Types and observed that two of the three check boxes labeled WAV are indeed checked. The one that is not checked lists MP3 as the Stream Format Decoder, so I guess that my WAV files are not being converted "on the fly" to MP3's.

It looks that I will have to look elsewhere in my system to solve the sound quality problem.

Thanks for the reply.

Roy

rajacat · « **Reply #6 on:** 25 Feb 2006, 08:41 pm »

Quote from: JoshK

I find that some radio stations sound better with my SUMO Aurora FM tuner, but only really good quality stations, which pretty much means none of the ones I am interested in. The Rock stations are clear but way too "boombox" eq'd. The indy stations don't come in very clearly.

SB playing internet radio is so-so quality because the streams are compressed (usually ~128kbps, but a lot are 192kbps). This makes them great for background music while working around the house which is a lot of my listening t ...

In general, I don't like MP3's but sometimes I find a jewel like Allman Bros. live at the Atlantic Pop Festival 1970 (320kbps) that make me overlook the the limitations of the MP3 file format.

I haven't been able to locate the actual CD so perhaps it is a bootleg.
It's not perfect but it gives you the real feeling of being at a concert complete with numerous sound checks and chats with the crowd. Southern Rock in the raw.

JoshK · « **Reply #7 on:** 25 Feb 2006, 08:48 pm »

I hadn't read your post closely enough when I replied.

I see now what you were saying. I think your (stock) PSU might be the bottleneck, it is for me at least.

Then again it could be the internal DAC in the pioneer. Have you tried it with both analog in and digital in? With analog in there may be a chance that the DAC is bypassed and their analog stage is decent enough. That maybe why the FM sounds good.

rajacat · « **Reply #8 on:** 25 Feb 2006, 09:54 pm »

Quote from: JoshK

I hadn't read your post closely enough when I replied. I see now what you were saying. I think your (stock) PSU might be the bottleneck, it is for me at least.

Then again it could be the internal DAC in the pioneer. Have you tried it with both analog in and digital in? With analog in there may be a chance that the DAC is bypassed and their analog stage is decent enough. That maybe why the FM sounds good.

I have been using the analog in but could the internal DAC still be in the pipeline? I'm somewhat of a newbi here when I consider the tech questions. As I stated, the AVR is a couple of generations behind and not exactly top-of-the-line.

bubba966 · « **Reply #9 on:** 25 Feb 2006, 11:24 pm »

Quote from: rajacat

I have been using the analog in but could the internal DAC still be in the pipeline?

It could be if you're running it in "stereo" mode. Is there a "direct" mode on your receiver? That should bypass the ADC/DAC section.

rajacat · « **Reply #10 on:** 26 Feb 2006, 07:05 pm »

Quote from: bubba966

Quote from: rajacat
I have been using the analog in but could the internal DAC still be in the pipeline?

It could be if you're running it in "stereo" mode. Is there a "direct" mode on your receiver? That should bypass the ADC/DAC section.

I switched back and forth between direct and stereo and the direct had slightly better SQ but still didn't solve the overall SQ problem. I do have a cheap powered sub that I don't normally use, except with Rock. Yesterday I AB'ed it with some heavy rock and it seemed to take some of the load off the AVR with the effect of smoothing out the highs and mids therefore improving overall SQ. This indicates that I could use some more clean power for my mains. I think that my Ascends are pointing out the deficiencies in my system and I need to undertake some upgrades starting with the AVR.

Thanks for your response.

Roy

Roy