Need advice on buying better recordings

roymail · « **on:** 26 Jan 2006, 05:59 pm »

Hi all,

Let's say you have a nice music system, one you've invested lots of time and money to assemble, one which is able to play your best recordings so well that all you hear is the music in all it's glory... without the distraction of occasional gritty, compressed, distortion here and there, siblance, etc. You get the idea. Have you ever bought what you thought was a good CD, get it home and play it on your nice system only to hang your head in disappointment when you hear the poor recording quality? To be candid, THAT MAKES ME NUTS!

I'm sure we all have those treasured recordings that we play all the time because we just can't stand to listen to sub-standard recordings any more. So what advice can you give me about how to select better recordings? My preferences are nice vocals, jazz (vocal & intrumental), swing & big band, string quartets, piano and acoustic guitar.

Before you ask, my system consists of a RWA modded CDP-->RWA modded ClariT/Danish Audio CT2-->Omega Super 3R's. No need for a d/a converter according to Vinnie R. On those better recordings, they're extremely musical and satisfying with little desire for better gear.

I know there's a weath of experience and knowlege out there, so I'm hoping for lots of good advice and direction from you guys. Thanks for reading my post and any help you can provide.

-- Roy

randytsuch · « **Reply #1 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 06:08 pm »

What I have learned so far is some labels usually put out quality music. Companies like Chesky, Opus, Reference recordings, Linn are the ones I can name from top of my head. There are many other small labels that put out quality recordings.

I have also found that blues, as a genre seems to have a high percentage of high quality recordings. The audioquest blues series comes to mind here, but there are others. I like Keb Mo and Eric Bibb, to name a few artists.

Alison Krauss is another artist who consistantly puts out quality recordings.

Quality is out there, and based on your musical tastes, I am sure you can find quality recordings that you like.

Randy

Marbles · « **Reply #2 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 06:25 pm »

Roy, I had the same problem as you UNTIL I went with a PC as a transport to an Empirical Audio I2s Off Ramp to an EA modded Perp Tech P3a DAC.

What I found was mostly it was a bad pressing of a good recording. Burning the CD to my hard drive (EAC) solved most all of my bad recording problems.

You might want to talk to modded SB2/SB3 owners to see if their experiences mirror mine. If so, that is a pretty inexpensive way out.

If their experiences don't mirror mine, you might want to demo Empiricals products.

ricmon · « **Reply #3 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 07:17 pm »

You may want to take a look at Mapelshade Records. Like was said in a previous post the specialized small recording studios will take a lot of guess work out of the process.

http://www.mapleshaderecords.com/index.php

R_burke · « **Reply #4 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 07:18 pm »

I'm with Randytsuch in that I rely on labels

Besides the ones he mentioned I personally like:

Concord Music Group, which is among others:

Concord - Jazz, Latin
Fantasy - Rock and some jazz
Telarc - Blues, Jazz and Classical

randytsuch · « **Reply #5 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 07:41 pm »

One more thing, you could go check out
http://store.acousticsounds.com/store.cfm

They carry many of the smaller "audiophile" labels.

Analog Productions is another label I like.

Randy

mgalusha · « **Reply #6 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 08:01 pm »

Marbles makes an excellent point about playing from HD vs playing from an optical drive. Some CD's sound much better playing from HD as jitter is nearly eliminated and the CDP's error correction circuitry is not having to step in.

Even so, a good recording still makes all the difference. The labels listed above are pretty consistent. Also a lot of the Verve jazz releases are quite good. The Verve "Master Series" has some very nice recordings.

Tweaker · « **Reply #7 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 08:05 pm »

Seems kind of a shame to limit your musical choices to certain labels only, although the ones mentioned will assure you of the best possible quality. I would agree with Marbles that going to a pc based system takes care of much of the crappy sound that is really due to the cd and cd playback medium. A digital equalizer like the Behringer DEQ2496 helps a lot, too. Taming a ragged high frequency response works wonders for the listenablity of compact discs.

gary · « **Reply #8 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 08:10 pm »

Roy,

I agree with Marbles too. I recently upgraded to an iPod modded by Vinie, and recordings that sounded bad to me before with my transport & Nixon dac now sound fine. Especially with headphones. It may be as simple as removing jitter from the signal but whatever the cause there's no doubt in my mind that PC based audio is a huge step up from traditional cd players.
And I'm never going back.

Gary

Folsom · « **Reply #9 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 09:16 pm »

Go for the SB2/3. Jitter sucks and so does one pass readings of CD's....

Also though, http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/search-handle-url/ref=s_m_rs/103-9754025-3467843?page=1&url=ix%3Dmusic%26rank%3D%252Dprice%26fqp%3Dbinding%25018%2502is-popular%2501yes%2502keywords%2501mobile%2520fidelity%26nsp%3Dscore%2501proj-unit-sales%2502dym%25010%2502search-type%2501ss%2502fpn%25011%26sz%3D10%26pg%3D1&fpn=1&rank=%2Bsalesrank&x=11&y=11

all of those should play nicely, I mean they had better.

PhilNYC · « **Reply #10 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 09:49 pm »

Quote from: ricmon

You may want to take a look at Mapelshade Records. Like was said in a previous post the specialized small recording studios will take a lot of guess work out of the process.

There's no question that Mapleshade produces some of the most outstandingly recorded music in the industry. However, IMHO the quality of the performances by the artists at Mapleshade Records is *really* uneven...and none are what I would consider to be great...

Just my opinion...

PhilNYC · « **Reply #11 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 09:52 pm »

Also JMHO, but I can't go for the idea that removing jitter can make a poor recording sound like a good recording. IMHO, the improvements you get from jitter reduction are incremental...so a bad recording may sound a little better, but it will still sound like a bad recording.

roymail · « **Reply #12 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 10:00 pm »

Lots of good advice so far, and I'm keeping an open mind.

Marbles,

I'm sure that you and others are right about the superior sound quality of PC based playback. But carefully selected well recorded cd's will do fine for me right now. I just need advice on good quality recording lables like many have already suggested, and I appreciate it alot. LATER, who knows... I may give it a go.

Gary,

From your many contributions to this forum in the past years, I know you are seriously vested in this hobby like many others. So let me see if I properly understand what you're saying. You download music from your PC to a RWA modded iPod-->modded ClariT amp--> Bastini OB's. And, the resulting sound is far superior to your CDP/Nixon Dac combo amplified by your modded ClariT? You said "there's no doubt in my mind that PC based audio is a huge step up from traditional cd players." Well, maybe I'm just behind the curve.

Guys, I really appreciate your input on this topic, and I hope others will continue to join in. Thanks!

-- Roy

Russell Dawkins · « **Reply #13 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 10:01 pm »

I think errors of much greater magnitude than those introduced by jitter and inferior D/A design (not to speak of interconnects and cables) are introduced way upstream, in the recording, but especially mixing and mastering stages.
If I were forced to listen to most of what is currently popular, I would definitely have an expander inline, ideally in a proceessor loop in the preamp so you could hard wire bypass it when it wasn't necessary.
These days, you buy an expander only with a compressor which you don't need, but from Behringer the whole ball of wax costs less than a midprice set of interconnects and, once you learn how to use it will bring huge benefits. For example:
http://www.behringer.com/02_products/audio_index.cfm?lang=ENG

see the MDX 1600 and 2600 - well under $200.

Beyond this, I do agree with going with the smaller "boutique" labels, once you've determined you like their musical choices and basic sound, and I also agree with the labels mentioned, with the addition of BIS

http://www.bis.se/index.php

6 moons also has some pretty interesting stuff in their recommendations.

Marbles · « **Reply #14 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 10:30 pm »

Quote from: PhilNYC

Also JMHO, but I can't go for the idea that removing jitter can make a poor recording sound like a good recording. IMHO, the improvements you get from jitter reduction are incremental...so a bad recording may sound a little better, but it will still sound like a bad recording.

Phil, I agree with you on Mapleshade..

As to why my previously poor sounding CD's sound pretty darn good on my PC/EA system, it doesn't make sense to me, but I'm not arguing with the results.

Roy, no problem, you have some great label suggestions. best of luck.

gary · « **Reply #15 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 10:41 pm »

Quote from: roymail

From your many contributions to this forum in the past years, I know you are seriously vested in this hobby like many others. So let me see if I properly understand what you're saying. You download music from your PC to a RWA modded iPod-->modded ClariT amp--> Bastini OB's. And, the resulting sound is far superior to your CDP/Nixon Dac combo amplified by your modded ClariT? You said "there's no doubt in my mind that PC based audio is a huge step up from traditional cd players." Well, maybe I'm just behind the curve.

Pretty much. When I first heard the NOS Nixon dac it was an eye opening experience because it sounded so much less "digital" than other dac's I was used to. The iPod (with apple lossless files) provides the same character of sound, but it takes it to the next level when it comes to clarity, detail, and resolution. To my ears, this is the most organic and analog that digital music has sounded, and I definitely agree with Steve at Empirical Audio when he says that this is the wave of the future.

Gary

Folsom · « **Reply #16 on:** 26 Jan 2006, 10:58 pm »

Consider that when you rip a CD it tries to account for every bit and will track if any are lost, you know how much of the actual recording you got off the disc.....

A PC will read the same place on a disc over and over, it will do all it can with EAC or the like to make sure the rip is near perfect. This account, by multiple reads, is much more accurate especially when you know the HD and RAM does not have jitter problems!

With the little fact that it is a shorter pass of possible interferance through a computer does not hurt either.... 1 and 0's are all you got. There is nothing else, it is perfect. You have no need to worry about any jitter, induced noise, nothing at all.

CD players simply have a lot more characteristics.... Just think of every tweak there is out there to help them and how much the super expensive ones play.... Hell there is a new de-magnatising toy for CD's and DVD's so the player will work better with them.....

Gordy · « **Reply #17 on:** 27 Jan 2006, 04:36 am »

Another excellent record label that hasn't been mentioned yet is MA Recordings... http://www.marecordings.com/main/default.php

Rob Babcock · « **Reply #18 on:** 27 Jan 2006, 05:36 am »

I've had great luck with Naxos, for classical that is. The calibre of the performances is uniformly high, and the sound quality is generally superb.

gonefishin · « **Reply #19 on:** 27 Jan 2006, 06:11 am »

Russell, Have you had a chance to listen to Ray Kimber's ISOmic recordings? It's (unfortunatly) only samples of various recordings done with his ISOmic technique. It has a very natural and real presentation to the sound. I was wondering if you've had a chance to hear it...and any thoughts.

thanks,

dan