Vinnie, please address concern about SB3 volume control

Boybees · « **on:** 30 Dec 2005, 08:38 pm »

Vinnie I found this bit of information (or misinformation) buried in one of the threads:

"Apparently SB2 reverses polarity and Slim Server didn't. It was fixed at some point. Modding SB2 takes out the op amp that does this. Therefore, you need to go back to firmware that doesn't fix this if you have a modded unit. J. Holtz was kind enough to send me the older firmware. I run the latest Slim Server but replaced the firmware with the older version 15 per his instruction. I would be glad to forward it to you if you PM me your e-mail address."

If this is true it is relevant to those of us who have (or have ordered) modded units. It'd be great if you could "weigh in" and tell us what firmware fixes we may or may not need.

Thanks, Dave

mgalusha · « **Reply #1 on:** 30 Dec 2005, 08:54 pm »

Dave,

I'm not Vinnie but the firmware versions 15 and below have incorrect absolute polarity if the opamp is used as the opamp inverts polarity. Slimdevices corrected this in later versions.

For those with modded units that don't have the opamp, this is just the opposite. It's "correct" in v15 and older and inverted in newer versions. Just reverse the speaker leads to correct it if you are running a newer version of the firmware.

Note this only applies to the analog outputs.

mike

Boybees · « **Reply #2 on:** 30 Dec 2005, 09:44 pm »

thanks, Mike, the other issue with firmware and volume control is the apparent "volume bug" pops up on some versions of firmware.

There are numerous threads in the Slim Devices forum on this subject.

Do you know if firmware v.15 has the volume bug?

Vinnie R. · « **Reply #3 on:** 31 Dec 2005, 03:13 am »

Quote from: Boybees

If this is true it is relevant to those of us who have (or have ordered) modded units. It'd be great if you could "weigh in" and tell us what firmware fixes we may or may not need.
..

Hi Boybees,

Mike is correct about the absolute polarity (thanks for chiming in, Mike!) regarding the software.

Regarding the volume bug, I don't remember what software version (and versions that followed) fixed the volume bug. I am using the latest version and everything seems to work fine...

Regards,

pugs · « **Reply #4 on:** 31 Dec 2005, 07:08 am »

What is the volume bug? I still have volume control even if I disable it. Is that the bug? I'm using 6.2.1. I tried downloading 6.2.2 but couldn't figure out how to make it work. I'm using version 15 firmware.

jholtz · « **Reply #5 on:** 31 Dec 2005, 02:38 pm »

I don't use the volume contol on my SB2. I run it into a modded pre. The version 15 firmware just simply sounds better. I do use the latest builds (6.2.2) and replace the firmware folder with one containing version 15 firmware.

I've compared version 15 to later builds at different times with several day intervals and I always come to the same conclusion. 15 simply sounds better. It's more 3-dimensional, smoother and more analog sounding. It's easy to compare. I believe Tweaker did some A/B comparisons and came up with the same opinion as did others who have compared.

I have the version 15 folder zipped. Let me know if you want it and I'll email it to you.

Jim

Quote from: Vinnie R.

Quote from: Boybees
If this is true it is relevant to those of us who have (or have ordered) modded units. It'd be great if you could "weigh in" and tell us what firmware fixes we may or may not need.
..

Hi Boybees,

Mike is correct about the absolute polarity (thanks for chiming in, Mike!) regarding the software.

Regarding the volume bug, I don't remember what software version (and versions that followed) fixed the volume bug. I am using the latest version and everything seems to work fine...

Regards,

Builder Brad · « **Reply #6 on:** 31 Dec 2005, 05:56 pm »

hi Jim,

i am currently using a RWA modded SB2 and am interested in trying out version 15 of the firmware. Currently I am using version 28 of the firmware and Slimserver v 6.2.1 5194. I can see the Firmware folder withing the Slimserver Program folder and the 5 system files, however I have not been able to find any version 15 files to replace these with.

Please help.

Brad

jholtz · « **Reply #7 on:** 31 Dec 2005, 05:59 pm »

Hi Brad,

Send me an email and I'll send version 15 to you in a zip file.

Jim

Quote from: Builder Brad

hi Jim,

i am currently using a RWA modded SB2 and am interested in trying out version 15 of the firmware. Currently I am using version 28 of the firmware and Slimserver v 6.2.1 5194. I can see the Firmware folder withing the Slimserver Program folder and the 5 system files, however I have not been able to find any version 15 files to replace these with.

Please help.

Brad

jholtz · « **Reply #8 on:** 31 Dec 2005, 06:43 pm »

Anyone that would like to try version 15 to compare it to the newer ones, please "email" rather than PM me. I sent one out and received an out of the office message back. (Milton?)

Thanks...

Jim

ebag4 · « **Reply #9 on:** 31 Dec 2005, 07:13 pm »

Thanks for the file Jim. Sorry about the auto response from my email. I will be sure to post my impressions.

Thanks again
Ed

jholtz · « **Reply #10 on:** 31 Dec 2005, 07:25 pm »

Hi Ed,

No worries. I was afraid that it ended up in company mailbox which often strip attachments.

I look forward to hearing your opinion after you've compared the versions.

Happy New Year!

Jim

Quote from: ebag4

Thanks for the file Jim. Sorry about the auto response from my email. I will be sure to post my impressions.

Thanks again
Ed

Boybees · « **Reply #11 on:** 2 Jan 2006, 04:24 pm »

Quote from: Vinnie R.

Quote from: Boybees
If this is true it is relevant to those of us who have (or have ordered) modded units. It'd be great if you could "weigh in" and tell us what firmware fixes we may or may not need.
..

Hi Boybees,

Mike is correct about the absolute polarity (thanks for chiming in, Mike!) regarding the software.

Regarding the volume bug, I don't remember what software version (and versions that followed) fixed the volume bug. I am using the latest version and everything seems to work fine...

Regards,

Vinnie can you clarify your own s/w set up for us? With your modded SB, are you using:

a) all the latest s/w with your speaker leads reversed?
b) the latest Slimserver with firmware v.15, and speaker leads not reversed?
c) some other combination?

Also, if removing the op amp does in fact reverse polarity, is it possible to reverse internal wiring on the SB so that we can use the latest slimserver and firmware without reversing speaker leads?

After all, it's a bit inconvenient to reverse leads when your speakers are bi-wired and/or you are using multiple sources

Thanks (and happy new year), Dave

Vinnie R. · « **Reply #12 on:** 3 Jan 2006, 03:40 am »

Quote from: Boybees

Vinnie can you clarify your own s/w set up for us? With your modded SB, are you using:

a) all the latest s/w with your speaker leads reversed?
b) the latest Slimserver with firmware v.15, and speaker leads not reversed?
c) some other combination?

Also, if removing the op amp does in fact reverse polarity, is it possible to reverse internal wiring on the SB so that we can use the latest slimserver and firmware without reversing speaker leads?

After all, it's a bit inconvenient to reverse ...

Hi Dave,

To be honest, I'm not concerned with absolute polarity.

If you are really concerned with maintaining absolute polarity, you have to ask yourself:

-- Does your source reverse polarity?
-- Does your preamp reverse polarity?
-- Does your amp reverse polarity?

And before all of that, did the recording engineer pay attention to absolute polarity.

As long as both channels are in-phase, I am satisfied. If one speaker is out of phase, it is very obvious! In terms of trying to preserve absolute phase, I don't bother to swap the polarities of my speaker cables.

Quote from: Boybees

Also, if removing the op amp does in fact reverse polarity, is it possible to reverse internal wiring on the SB so that we can use the latest slimserver and firmware without reversing speaker leads? [/qoute]

The opamp circuit in the SB does invert the polarity. (V_out= = -A*V_in)

The modification to the analog output circuit involves bypassing the opamp, so whatever the absolute phase is of the voltage output signal of the dac, that is what is what will exit to the RCA output jacks. This cannot be reversed as the dac's voltage output pins are wired directly to the RCA jacks via signal coupling caps (Auricaps).

Happy New Year,

Boybees · « **Reply #13 on:** 3 Jan 2006, 04:22 am »

Thanks, Vinnie, I "get it" now. I was confusing absolute polarity with being out of phase.

ebag4 · « **Reply #14 on:** 8 Jan 2006, 07:10 pm »

Guys:
I have been running the slimserver Rev 15 firmware that JHoltz provided for about a week now. Although I cannot efectively A/B I would say that the older firmware is more musical than the rev 28 that came with the latest beta. I am sticking with the 15.

Be aware that if you are using the SB3 volume control you will have less usable volume range than with the 28, or at least I do. I had configured the 28 to allow 0-40 with 40 being as loud as my amp could play cleanly. With the rev 15, 20 on the SB3 is as loud as my system can reach cleanly.

Thanks Jim for bringing this to my attention.

Ed

Boybees · « **Reply #15 on:** 10 Jan 2006, 09:22 pm »

I did try firmware v.15 by replacing the files in the "firmware" folder with the ones Jholtz sent me. Slimserver immediately started acting up (playlists wouldn't play, mysterious shutdown for no reason). So I downloaded the latest beta and installed it, and everything worked fine again.

So ends my experiment with firmware v.15.

jholtz · « **Reply #16 on:** 11 Jan 2006, 12:47 am »

Sorry that it didn't work out well for you. I suspected that not everyone would find it sucessful. I am curious if your Squeezebox prompted you to upgrade the firmware after installing the files and also if you completely replaced the files in the firmware folder or just copied over them? I'm assuming that you stopped the Slimserver service before replacing the firmware folder, correct? Did you rescan your music server when the issues started?

Thanks for the feedback.

Best regards,

Jim

Quote from: Boybees

I did try firmware v.15 by replacing the files in the "firmware" folder with the ones Jholtz sent me. Slimserver immediately started acting up (playlists wouldn't play, mysterious shutdown for no reason). So I downloaded the latest beta and installed it, and everything worked fine again.

So ends my experiment with firmware v.15.