[Rob Babcock]

Okay, after reading a bazillion posts about the Squeezebox I think it must sound really good (at least once it's tweaked).  But how user friendly is it?

The reason I ask is that I'm trying to envision how it works.  The thing is very small, and presumably the display is small.  So how do you search for/find things?  Can you program and cue up things easily?

I have about 800 CDs, give or take, and I'd love to rip 'em all to a couple of 400 GB Seagates and pipe 'em down to my main rig, but there's that nagging fear of never being able to find what I'm looking for.

[eric the red]

I'm with Rob on this one. Can I use a SB if I have a laptop only for a computer?? Would love to rip all my cds, sell them, then get a nice vinyl rig. TIA

[lonewolfny42]

Can I use a SB if I have a laptop only for a computer??

Thats the way Vinnie R. (Red Wine Audio) showed his system at the RMAF....

[Rob Babcock]

I'm with Rob on this one. Can I use a SB if I have a laptop only for a computer?? Would love to rip all my cds, sell them, then get a nice vinyl rig. TIA

OMG!   Don't do that!  Aside from vinyl sucking ( ) and the legal ramifications, HDs tend to crash.  I know some very foolish people that did just that, ripped all their discs and sold them, thinking they'd never need them again.  Of of those guys had his drive crash only THREE WEEKS LATER!   Since his discs were long gone he was screwed.

No, I'll keep all my CDs, but I might go long stretches without taking them off the shelf if I could just play all my music thru the SB.

[eric the red]

Can I use a SB if I have a laptop only for a computer??

Thats the way Vinnie R. (Red Wine Audio) showed his system at the RMAF....

In idiot's terms, how does one use a SB??

[lonewolfny42]

Can I use a SB if I have a laptop only for a computer??

Thats the way Vinnie R. (Red Wine Audio) showed his system at the RMAF....

In idiot's terms, how does one use a SB??

I'm the wrong guy to ask...I had a problem....so I shipped it to Carlman...he had no problem. I do know he's used it wired and wireless...and he uses a laptop for storage.

[zybar]

I think it is very easy to use.

The display is actually bigger than a cd player and the menus are well laid out and simple to follow.

Here is an example:

Broswe Music -> By Artist -> Artist -> All music by that artist

Once you get to the artist part you can scroll through all artists or use the remote's letters to group the search (i.e. if you press the number 2 once it will give you the A's, press 2 twice and it gives you the B's, etc...)

You can also create playlists, etc...

The remote has all the features/functionality you would have on a regaular cd player, plus you can use a web interface if you like via the computer or wireless PDA.

Hope this helps a bit.

George

[ctviggen]

I think the SB2/SB3 is both easy to use and a nightmare.  I have two SB2s, one modded and one unmodded.  The unmodded one has the frequency display (typically on the right) over the entire screen while the modded one does not.  Why?  They're running the same software.  If your computer is running some type of time consuming application, the SB2 will not respond to input and will begin breaking up when it plays back music, but this is done with no error messages.  If your SB2 cannot find the server, the SB2 simply shuts off with no error message.  The web interface -- compared to iTunes -- is horrid.  For instance, to set up a new playlist using iTunes you create a new playlist then drag songs/albums into the playlist.  I can't even tell you how to do the same using the slimserver, although I've done it before.  I've set up internet radio (NPR, as my fiancee likes NPR), which is good.  I deleted WSHU (because my modded SB2 will not play internet radio and degrades into noise/static, but the unmodded SB2 does not, but I originally thought the link to WSHU got corrupted) and now cannot re-add WSHU even though I'm using the exact same technique I did to originally add WSHU.  And, I can listen to WSHU on my computer using the same link.  Why?  I have another list of 10+ bugs that I could go through, but I don't want to bore you.

Here's what I think.  If all you do is access music and never change any settings, the SB2 is a fine tool and sounds good.  If you use the computer on which the songs reside, if you want to change a lot of the functionality of the SB2/3, then be aware that there are bugs you're going to have to find and work around.

[PhilNYC]

The interface on the SB remote is similar to an iPod...use directional buttons to navigate thru your albums/songs/playlists.  To me, it was incredibly intuitive.  I just got one for my dad for Xmas, and he was up and running very quickly (note that he is an iPod/iTunes user, so he already had a sense of how the interface would work).

There are some things that I don't like (eg. I find the "Browse by Artist" function to be completely useless, because it lists every musician on every album, making for hundreds of artists for even just a few dozen rippped CDs)...but overall it works pretty easy.  And in a pinch, you can always control things from your computer very easily...

[zybar]

Bob,

Who modified your SB?  What was done?

I am running my Slimserver software on an old P3 600 Mhz Dell and I am not running into the issues you describe.  It is dedicated to audio and outside of some internet surfing doesn't get any heavy action (which might explain our differences).

I have been able to rip cd's and compress them (using up almost all available CPU), yet no dropouts or issues with music playback during this cpu intensive process.

Have I had hiccups?  Absolutely!!

But a simple stop and restart has solved them almost every time.  The few occasions it didn't, I needed a hard reboot.

Not perfect, but not too bad either.

Sorry to hear that you are hitting more bugs.  

What version of Slimserver are you using?

George

[Carlman]

It's a bit hard to explain without showing you how it works.  However, if you buy one, I doubt you'll send it back or sell it.  

I'm borrowing LW's and it's fantastic.  It's configured differntly than he described, though.  I installed the 'base software' (as I call it) on my music server in my sound room and then setup the SB3 in my office.  My music server has a huge library of .flac files that the SB3 can access remotely.

The SB3 gets an IP address like any other PC on my network when it starts.  So, the SB3 is kind of like a little computer on your network.  I have not tried it wirelessly, I only have a wired network.  

The menu's are very easy and intuitive; and are as described by George and Phil above.  I had no interest in this device since my main rig has a (very queit) PC already in the room.  I did not understand how the interface could work with such a small space but it does.  It's very clever and fairly easy to find music.  There is a little setup to consider that will make things easier... If your music folders are setup properly from the start, it'll make finding them easier on the SB3.  

All of this stuff is a lot easier in person than reading.  Like I said, I wasn't even interested until I set it up.  Now I have easy and full access to my entire music library in my office.

I have the SB3 connected directly to an EE Minimax tube amp presently and it's fantastic.  I have volume, tubey goodness, .flac files... it's as smooth as can be.

Just buy it.  If you don't need wireless, save $50.

-C

[ctviggen]

George, Wayne modified mine.  I just realized this morning what the true problem is, as I tried to operate internet radio with the modded SB2 and got static.  I then switched to music, but got only static.  I unplugged the modded SB2 and put in the unmodded SB2 and it works fine with internet radio (although I still cannot add WSHU for some reason -- I have no idea why).  The static happens on the modded SB2 every time I select an internet radio station.  This lead me to believe that the links got corrupted, but that's apparently not the case.

Tonight, I'm going to buy a hub so that I can have both SB2s running at the same time and can switch back and forth (I have this hub running in my main system but not in my second system; because I listen to my second system more than my main system, I've been using my second system to break in the modded SB2, which I just got Friday).

Don't get me wrong -- the SB2s are great and work very well 90% of the time.  It's just that the 10% can get to be a pain.  For instance, last weekend, I was in the attic.  I set the unmodded SB2 to random play all the songs in my collection.  For some reason, it turned off after about an hour.  I have no idea why.  I had to climb down out of the attic and reset everything.  This has happened at the wierdest times.  Most times, the thing works great; it worked well all weekend, playing Christmas songs during our Christmas party.  Then this morning, it responds extremely slowly to my remote button presses.  Why?  Because the backup of the hard drive, which I started last night, was still running for some reason.   The backup must have taken all the processing power of the computer.  Why this would happen, I don't know.  I've also had times when I've not been doing anything on the computer and the SB2 will begin breaking up, forcing me to reset it.  I've tried selecting "fade in and fade out" modes, and I could never get this to work at all.  I had to reset everything and deselect "fade in and fade out".  

If all you do is listen to music, the SB2s work extremely well and there's only an occasional hiccup.  If you test the software, though, it breaks.

[samplesj]

The unmodded one has the frequency display (typically on the right) over the entire screen while the modded one does not.  Why?  They're running the same software.  

The frequency display is a user option.  You have turned it on through the menus on one and not on the other.  Be careful with multiple squeezeboxes on the same network that you are really changing the one you mean to.  I've got three now and a couple of times I've sent the music to the wrong one and tried to figure out what was wrong until I noticed the drop down had defaulted to the wrong box.  The setting you want to change is "Player Settings" and the "Now Playing Setttings".  Personally I like the full spectrum analyser and thats how I have mine configured in that box along with the idle but playing screen saver

If your computer is running some type of time consuming application, the SB2 will not respond to input and will begin breaking up when it plays back music, but this is done with no error messages.

What are you trying to run at the same time?  The server I have mine on used to be a dedicated PVR and I have no issues.  It does have a hardware encoded/decoder for the recording so its not maybe a terrible bad processor load, but I've not noticed a stutter at all except when I'm running a full rescan on the squeezebox db and its recording one thing and playing back another.  I've actually tried recording one thing and playing back 2 different other shows (I've got an external network box that can talk to the PVR software) along with 2 different streams of music without problem.  One thing you may want to look at is what you are streaming.  FLAC can be converted on the squeezebox itself, but some other formats have to be converted on the server so that may make a difference in processor load.  To me the real limit I think I'll hit is the disk IO.  Right now I've got 2 PATA IDE channels and a SATA channel, but I'm sure if I got unlucky enough to have them all on the same drive its cough a little.

[mcgsxr]

I have an SB3, unmodded at present but it will end up in Wayne's hands when he clears his bench sometime!, and all my problems have been with the wireless network teething, not the device itself.

I have returned the WRT54G Linksys router, after experiencing 2-3 dropouts per week, requiring a reboot of the modem, PC, and router to re-ignite connectivity.  I have now setup a WRT54GS and will hope that solves the issues associated with V5 firmware for the other router.

Outside that, the SB3 has worked great - both my brothers and their families were over for the holidays, and were really interested in this ability to store lossless music on an HD, and then serve it up as needed, to various rooms etc.  My one brother (not all that savvy with computers), immediately bought a 250g drive, and will begin ripping his 500+ cd's, in preparation of a purchase of one of these devices sometime in the coming months.

They both found the display easy to use (on the HUGE setting), and the interface was intuitive enough to have them both slicing and dicing my 40 FLAC cd's and 18g of MP3 within minutes, checking out how to use this toy.

I would say, that if you own a PC, you can use this baby, and if you like good sound, be prepared to sell off some gear too!

[ctviggen]

I do not believe that I modified the SB2 to have a frequency range over the entire screen (heck, I didn't even know this was an option), but perhaps I did by accident.  I've had many problems with the SB2.  In fact, I started a thread about them:

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=23851

Some of these, I've posted to the SB board on the slimserver network, but I honestly don't have time to fix all of them.

Wayne said that the crystal oscillator is modified such that only 44.1kHz will be locked.  Streams of other frequencies will not lock.  Thus, I have to give up internet radio on the modded SB2.  This isn't that big of a deal, as I plan to use it in my "nice" system and not my second system, so I'll never listen to internet radio anyway.

[nathanm]

I'm still trying to conceive of how anyone has the TIME and\or PATIENCE to rip their CD collections to digital files; much less actually get rid of the CDs after they're done!    Do you guys have robotic tray loaders or something?  Even a straight drag 'n drop of the WAV files is still a 600-700MB copy, and more if you're encoding them to a different format.  Sounds too much like work to me.

But getting rid of your collection after you copy it all over to a hard drive, that's the topper!  That has got to be about the stupidest move I can think of!  Wow.

I did order one of those Squeezebox doodads myself in order to better access my stash of Ruskie MP3s from the listening room, but if the interface sucks I will be more than happy to tear it a new one.  Interface is the most important part of a component, especially one that needs to address potentially thousands of files.  I'm just glad it has a remote with BUTTONS, not like that goddamn touch sensitive horeshit like on an iPod.  Sorry folks, if there's no tactile feedback on a control it's no good.  But hey, I must be wrong because everyone and their grandma has an iPod.

The real question is: does the squeezebox offer an animated dolphin?  This is the most-requested feature of audiophiles everywhere.

[gitarretyp]

If you really want to see what the interface is like, download the slimserver software and rip a cd or two to your hard drive. Once you get the server up, there's an included java program called softsqueeze. It has an interface identical to the squeezebox 2 (the 3 just has a larger display). This program will allow you to see if you like the interface and usability of the squeezebox. I also used it to be sure i like the interface before buying.

Regarding lag and drop-outs: I have experienced a few while running windows (these were not associated with cpu or hard disk usage). However, i usually run linux and have never had any problems under linux.

Regarding the time required to rip a 600 cd collection: If you're ordering a modded unit as i did, you'll have 3-4 weeks to rip your collection before it arrives. Just rip 10-20 cds a day. It only takes ~10 minutes to rip and encode a disc using eac. I'd be willing to bet most of you spend that long in front of your computer everyday doing other stuff, anyway.

[Wayne1]

Wayne said that the crystal oscillator is modified such that only 44.1kHz will be locked. Streams of other frequencies will not lock. Thus, I have to give up internet radio on the modded SB2. This isn't that big of a deal, as I plan to use it in my "nice" system and not my second system, so I'll never listen to internet radio anyway.

One of the mods that both Vinnie and I do is to disable (remove) the 12.28 MHz crystal oscillator. This does result in lower jitter as reported by the CEO of Slim Devices. It has the side effect of disabling the SB from receiving any Internet radio that streams at 8k, 16k, 24k, 32k and 48k. There are still quite a few Internet stations that the SB can receive. Most of the Radio IO group will work just fine.

The mods I do are intended to get the most out of the SB. If listening the Internet Radio is VERY important to you, I can simply leave the crystal in place. It will result in higher jitter. You would have to decide what is more important to you, ultimate sound quality or more access to lower quality music streams.

As Mark mentioned, most of the "problems" with the Squeezebox can be traced back to wireless network problems. For the "easiest" way to use the SB, run a ethernet cable. If that is not possible, be prepared to put in a little time working on wireless issues. "Drops" can be caused by a neighbor using wireless internet, 2.4 Mhz wireless phones, microwave ovens, garage door openers, or wireless game controlers.

Wi-Fi and wireless routers are not perfect, yet. Some will work great in some situations and not in others. Like many other things, you just have to try out the different routers available to find the one that works for you. I tried four different routers before I settled on the Netgear WPN824. I still get drops from 2.4 Mhz phones but I can put up with that. A change to 5.8 Mhz will come shortly.

Nathan, depending on what program you use to rip CDs it takes between 7-15 minutes per disc. Yes, that can add up to a lot of time sitting in front of your computer. I took about two months to slowly rip my 300 plus discs.

I did have a hard drive failure that caused me to re-rip part of my collection. You should always have a back-up of your files, either .flac on DVD, the original CD or an external hard drive.

The Slimserver interface is not the best. Slim Devices is looking for a programmer with good GUI skills to update the interface. TelCanto software does have a "better" interface to use with a PDA but it does cost extra.

[samplesj]

Tonight, I'm going to buy a hub so that I can have both SB2s running at the same time and can switch back and forth (I have this hub running in my main system but not in my second system; because I listen to my second system more than my main system, I've been using my second system to break in the modded SB2, which I just got Friday).

Get some switches instead of hubs.  I didn't even know you could still buy hubs .  Are the PC and the squeezebox both in the same hub?  Maybe you're hitting problems with them sharing the fixed amount of bandwidth in the hub.  A switch should give you full bandwidth to all channels.  I think I got a 16port switch for like $20 from newegg when I had a lightning strike take out a media extender and run up the network line to fry my old switch.

From this I'm guessing you are using wired and not wireless right?  Or is some of the gear wireless?  While I use wireless for my laptop and PDA, I didn't even consider it for the squeezeboxes.  Since I'd already wired the house, to me it just wasn't worth the potential for a headache later.  Like Wayne mentioned wireless can be trouble depending on what you are using as access points/routers and cards.

BTW: it looked like someone had tried to help before in your other thread, but needed more environmental details.  Although they did explain how you might have set the spectrum display and how to fix it.

[nathanm]

I did get the wired version to avoid those kinds of issues Wayne listed.  Wireless-anything just doesn't appeal to me; mucking about with batteries and such.  Feh.  Well, they would come in handy for avoiding ground loops I suppose.  

Besides, if I got the wireless Squeezebox version I wouldn't have been able to purchase this swell new 3rd party Hi-Fi ethernet cable and cable elevator set for $3000! (it's got techflex and one of those anti-snag boots on the ends you know. )

The thing they don't seem to make entirely clear is how exactly the Slim Server knows where your MP3 files are.  It just "knows"?  Because I don't use iTunes on my Mac.  (iTunes reminds me of Microsoft Bob.)  I've read the manual and I'm still a little fuzzy how that works.  I suppose I will find out soon enough.