[brooklyn]

I’ve had different pairs of Maggies over a forty year span.. The last pair I owned was the .7’s.. I don’t ever remember bumps on any of the panels during those years. I don’t think I would be happy about that..

I didn’t see it mentioned, sorry if I missed it. What amplifier are you using? The Maggies love power.. 

I used one REL T/5i sub which sounded good in the room with the .7’s but the bass sounded a little uneven within the room unless you were sitting near the sweet spot.. a second T/5 took care of that problem..

[I.Greyhound Fan]

The bumps are present on many new maggies.  My 1.6's came with them.  Magnepan gave me a new pair but they told me that they usually put those panels on maggies that have the beige covering because you can't see them.  They do not affect the sound apparently.

[I.Greyhound Fan]

May I ask what you like better about the ML subs?
I don't care about 'thump' per se.  I want to hear pitch and timbral accuracy of (let's say) a string bass in an orchestra or jazz combo.
I've read elsewhere that some people recommend two subs.  I was hoping to avoid this due to lack of floor space and to keep the budget down.  But I will keep an open mind.

I am not saying my ML subs are better than the Rythmiks.  But they integrate just as well with my Maggies.  They are fast, musical and can pressurize a room a little.  They have a very small foot print which I prefer as the maggies are huge.

[josh358]

Magnepan calls it "tenting," but it's actually the definition of delamination. The bumps are where the foil has separated from the mylar.

The rattling sound on bass notes is cause by the same thing (the wire or foil separating from the mylar).

Tenting may technically be a form of delamination, but it's a harmless cosmetic issue that doesn't affect the sound, whereas delamination will typically progress until the speaker buzzes and needs repair. The LRS+ is particularly prone to it because of its special foil attachment technique.

[studiotech]

I personally find it unacceptable and embarrassing that a factory made product has an issue like this renting.  I've seen plenty of diy planar speakers that do a better job with application of constructive traces.  I got rid of my old magnepans when delam started and I'd be furious if I bought the new improved models and then had tenting.  I guarantee it will lead to problems in the future.   

[josh358]

Perhaps Magnepan should pay more attention to permanently fixing the common delaminating issue instead of charging (IMO) exorbitant premium for the X "upgrades"..

They fixed the delamination 25 years ago with a new adhesive. This isn't the same thing. In the LRS+, it will happen no matter how it leaves the factory and the only way to prevent that without raising the price would impair the speaker's performance. Since the sound quality and longevity aren't affected, they've chosen not to raise the price. I'm not sure why it sometimes happens in the more expensive models. But once stretched, aluminum doesn't return to its form the way Mylar does. Wendell Diller did research on how to prevent this and came up with a couple of methods, but as I said earlier, it wouldn't be economically practical for the LRS+.

[josh358]

May I ask what you like better about the ML subs?
I don't care about 'thump' per se.  I want to hear pitch and timbral accuracy of (let's say) a string bass in an orchestra or jazz combo.
I've read elsewhere that some people recommend two subs.  I was hoping to avoid this due to lack of floor space and to keep the budget down.  But I will keep an open mind.

For that, I would go with a dipole sub. Because of how they interact with the room, they have a realism that conventional subs can't match; the tradeoff is some combination of cost, size, and extension. VPE makes them, including the LDW, which is designed to fit under an LRS: https://vpeelectrodynamics.com/little-dipole-wolfer/ GR Research has a kit. And Wendell Diller, who recently retired as Magnepan's director of research and development, has a new company called PlanarBASS that is making one as well.

[magister]

What amplifier are you using? The Maggies love power.. 

I used one REL T/5i sub which sounded good in the room with the .7’s but the bass sounded a little uneven within the room unless you were sitting near the sweet spot.. a second T/5 took care of that problem..

I own a PS Audio BHK250 amp which produces (you guessed it!) 250 W into eight ohms and 500 W into four ohms. It’s not the most powerful amp in the world, but I think it should enough for the LRS+. Thanks also for the info about how adding the second sub changed what you heard.

[magister]

They are fast, musical and can pressurize a room a little.  They have a very small foot print

This is helpful. A small footprint combined with good musical qualities would be appropriate, since floor space in my room is limited. Thanks also for your comment in the previous post about the bumps.

[magister]

For that, I would go with a dipole sub. Because of how they interact with the room, they have a realism that conventional subs can't match; the tradeoff is some combination of cost, size, and extension..

This, and the links you provided, are very helpful. It does seem on the face of it that a dipole sub would be a better match for Magnepans; yet clearly some users here have had good success with sealed subs. So I have to ponder this some more.

Thanks very much also for the comments about tenting. As long as that doesn’t affect the sound of the LRS+, I won’t worry about it.

[josh358]

This, and the links you provided, are very helpful. It does seem on the face of it that a dipole sub would be a better match for Magnepans; yet clearly some users here have had good success with sealed subs. So I have to ponder this some more.

Thanks very much also for the comments about tenting. As long as that doesn’t affect the sound of the LRS+, I won’t worry about it.

FWIW, the advantage of a dipole woofer is that since it has nulls at the sides, it doesn't excite the X and Y modes of the room, meaning it has smoother response in a real world room. You can achieve the same thing with monopole woofers, but you need four of them in a specific arrangement.

I think what happens here is that most people listen to studio pop and the sound is so highly processed that there's no real reference, besides which punchiness can be more desirable. It's in acoustical music that a dipole woofer shows its stuff, but, again, I'm not sure I would choose a dipole for pop because you can get more slam in a smaller package.

[Wallacefl]

I personally find it unacceptable and embarrassing that a factory made product has an issue like this renting.  I've seen plenty of diy planar speakers that do a better job with application of constructive traces.  I got rid of my old magnepans when delam started and I'd be furious if I bought the new improved models and then had tenting.  I guarantee it will lead to problems in the future.   

I as a lover of electrostats, planars and ribbons agree… I have considered a purchase of the LRS but as a long term owner this does not look good for something that is already showing delaminating problems right from the factory.

[josh358]

I as a lover of electrostats, planars and ribbons agree… I have considered a purchase of the LRS but as a long term owner this does not look good for something that is already showing delaminating problems right from the factory.

Delaminating problems, or tenting? Tenting is normal on the low mass drivers of the LRS+ and affects the cosmetics but not the sound. Delamination, of course, is another matter. I haven't heard anything about it, but I'm not much in the loop right now, so I'm curious.

[I.Greyhound Fan]

I have a pair of the original MMG's.
About 30 years old, it has that bass slap which is indicative of delamination.  I need to bring it in to the Magnepan factory here in White Bear Lake MN, about 25 minutes from me.

[josh358]

I'd check first to see what it costs to have them repaired -- the LRS+ is night and day improved and you can probably get one used for a very reasonable price. Otherwise, they're pretty easy to fix yourself if you have a weekend. The worst part is getting all the damn staples out. Ouch!

[I.Greyhound Fan]

It is about $150.  I don't use them anymore and I am going to sell them for about 300. I own a pair of 1.6's that are over 20 years old and still going strong.  Going to sell those as well.  I have a pair of Arendal 1528 bookshelf speakers and I have a pair of Fritz Carbon speakers on loan.