[BikeFi10]

I have the following KiK Odyssey amp.. Khartago,  Deluxe face plate, Full Kismet Board upgrade, SL Ref. 15 K caps, offboard PS upgrade extreme / 400 VA / 120 K base, Groneberg TS Premium cable upgr. WBT RCA's/ Binding posts upgrade.

Nice amp, sounds good but even though it is a high current amp it barely takes my Maggie 1.7i s to a modestly high volume.
Even at 12:00 - 1:00 knob position it just doesnt " kick it out" when the urge hits.
Jazz, female vocals, electronic recordings can sound great, but if I want to crank it with something like prog rock it doesnt impress.

I also have a Rythmik servo sub that takes over 80hz and below so that is even less effort for the KiK. Plenty of bass kick with the sub.

I do get a bit more volume from streamer/dac than HOMI Soundsmith Zephyer cart on the tt.

So has anyone had this version of amp upgraded for more power or am I going to have to consider mono blocks with bigger xformers & caps?

Some nigjt when Im awake late Ill call Klaus, but wanted to get info from you folks 1st.
Thanks!

[FullRangeMan]

Knowing magnepan my personal opinion is the prob is not the amp, I would suggest you change the speaker to a two-way 8 ohms 100dB sensitivity if you want a speaker with cross-over.

[rollo]

I have the following KiK Odyssey amp.. Khartago,  Deluxe face plate, Full Kismet Board upgrade, SL Ref. 15 K caps, offboard PS upgrade extreme / 400 VA / 120 K base, Groneberg TS Premium cable upgr. WBT RCA's/ Binding posts upgrade.

Nice amp, sounds good but even though it is a high current amp it barely takes my Maggie 1.7i s to a modestly high volume.
Even at 12:00 - 1:00 knob position it just doesnt " kick it out" when the urge hits.
Jazz, female vocals, electronic recordings can sound great, but if I want to crank it with something like prog rock it doesnt impress.

I also have a Rythmik servo sub that takes over 80hz and below so that is even less effort for the KiK. Plenty of bass kick with the sub.

I do get a bit more volume from streamer/dac than HOMI Soundsmith Zephyer cart on the tt.

So has anyone had this version of amp upgraded for more power or am I going to have to consider mono blocks with bigger xformers & caps?

Some nigjt when Im awake late Ill call Klaus, but wanted to get info from you folks 1st.
Thanks!

  Maybe your front end not having enough gain. Preamp ?? Using one ?

charles

[BikeFi10]

FullRangeMan.. change to 2 way 8 ohm? Never heard of that. I know GR Research does that 2 way conversion, but Ive read some whom had that done experienced even slightly less volume.
I do have nice poly caps that are going to replace stock ones but I dont expect any volume gain from that.
I maybe mistaken, but do you have the Stratos Monos with 1.7i s? I recently pmd someone here with that. If so, do they provide plenty of power?

Rollo... yes I use an old, recently recapped Carver C4000 pre amp with both MM & MC phono stages. Tried both but use a Schitt Mani plugged into aux. Same level results for all 3. Regardless, when sourcing from streamer / dac there is just a small volume gain.

Klaus did build amp custom for me so he knew my system. Unless he has an affordable solution, Im tempted to audition Emotive High Current mono blocks 30 day trial. A/B class 800wpc into 4 ohms. Have read a few success storys from Maggie Owners with these. I know they use some H type switching ps, but hey, if they sound good, why not.

[FullRangeMan]

I mean say buy a new hi efficiency speakers 100dB and benign 8 ohms impedance as Klipsch RF7 or RF83, or other brand you like.
What you dont need are low efficiency speakers as magnepan 3-way, 86dB and low 4 ohms impedance(3 ohms most of the freq range). Inefficient speakers will limit your choice of amplifiers, they will have to be very powerful and expensive.

[opnly bafld]

The Carver preamp has a lot of buttons and looking at pictures I couldn't see all of the functions, are you sure they are all set correctly and there is no attenuation going on to limit its output?

Yesterday I was listening to a friend's Apogee Calipers which are very low sensitivity also and they were quite loud with 100 watts.

[toocool4]

When you are talking about playing with more volume, saying 12:00 – 13:00 means nothing, give us what you are talking about in db so we know true values.

[FullRangeMan]

When you are talking about playing with more volume, saying 12:00 – 13:00 means nothing, give us what you are talking about in db so we know true values.

He mean say 12 hours of the clock.

[toocool4]

FullRangeMan I understand that, but it means nothing. It's like say my cars wheels spins at 10 revolutions a minute, it means nothing as I don't know if your cars wheel size is 1 meter or 1 centimetre diameter. A 1 meter diameter and a 1 centimetre moving at 10 revolutions a minute will cover a different amount if distance in the same 10 revolution. So telling us the measurements in a known unit of measurements gives us all the same reference point.
12:00 may mean 70db or 100db, which is a huge difference. so just saying 12:00 - 13:00 is meaningless.

[FullRangeMan]

I cant opine on this, this value changes from amp to amp.

[Chops]

It's the Carver preamp. I know, I had one. It didn't have enough gain for some modern amps I tried it with.

[Delta77]

  “Maybe your front end not having enough gain. Preamp ?? Using one ?”

This was my first thought as well..!

[toocool4]

Which is why a db figure would give us all a better indication than saying 12 o'clock.

[BikeFi10]

FullRangeMan... yes, I know the 1.7i s are low efficiency, but they have an airy open sound I really enjoy. Full soundstage across entire front wall. At this point Im focusing on power. I just need what it takes to drive them to their fullest.

Opnly... Ive had this pre amp 44 years (recapped). Love its features and know exactly what every button knob does. Yes, all settings good.

Toocool4... Your right an actual db level is the best referance. I do not have a db meter. I just know on previous amps and speakers and my ears 11:00 position on volume knob seemed like a common position for a clean high volume.

Chops... I use to have the 9 lbs companion Carver M400 cube amp 200 wpc into 8 ohms. It drove the 1.7i s  good. Didnt even get warm. I just got the upgrade bug after many years and went with the Odyssey. Id have a hard time giving up the C4000. Kind of wish I found a 2nd M400 use as mono blocks at ~ 900 wpc as per their spec.

I did tell Klaus about my old preamp before build. He said it would be fine. For the most part my system sounds quite good. Just those times I want to turn it up it doesnt quite get there.

 

[FullRangeMan]

Just those times I want to turn it up it doesnt quite get there.
You would solve this prob with a live room, chances are your room is very stuffy, muffled with carpets and upholstery etc

[Doublej]

You can turn it up past 1 o'clock if you are not hearing any distortion. What happens if you go to 3 or 4 o'clock on the preamp?

...there are a stack of Carver M400's for sale on ebay...

[lovelexicon]

BikdeFi10:

I have the following system:  Magnepan 1.7i; Parasound P7 preamp; Rythmik servo sub (F-12); Odyssey Mono Extreme (2003 version).

I sit 10 feet away from the speakers.  The room is neither too live or too dead. 

The Odyssey Mono Extremes have no problem driving the Maggie to a high volume. But to protect my hearing, I don't listen to music above 90 db sound pressure level (spl).

Hope this helps.

[klaus@odyssey]

Yeahhhh...call me.


I really feel compelled to defend my beloved Kismet here........


We have probably well over 400 1.7 users as our customers with all sorts of different amp mods,  and I used to run my 1.7's (had a pair,  plus Apogee Calippers,  and another 1.6's sitting around somewhere...I know,  it's a sickness,  and right now it's 9 pairs and counting,  but there are some prototypes,  so that doesn't count)  with a Khartago + as a demo pair in my showroom / listening room  before the pandemic.....

I had a typical Candela as a pre,  and ran both,  CD and phono through it via a Suspiro stage....

There was never ever ever a problem with volume.  Speakers gave up wayyyy earlier before the amp even got taxed.....and the room is 32 x 30 with 16 ' cathedral ceilings...so no, the Kismet amp that I built you shouldn't even break any sweat,  and this particular amp is superior to any other amps mentioned,  that much I can guarantee you as ,  again,  I know the combo intimately..........

In addition I installed / set up Khartago / Stratos / Kismet amps with 1.7's all over the place ( at least half a dozen times )  and listened to a variety of similar systems....volume levels were never the problem.....room setup was in a few cases,  but not volume.........

[toocool4]

BikeFi10, like some people have already said maybe the gain is not correct between your pre & power amp.
If you have a mobile phone, you can download a free db app and use that to give you a rough idea of the db level.
When you do download the app, make sure you take the reading at your listening position.

[Jeff_From_Michigan]

Bike, while I can't diagnose your compatibility issue, I can say with 100% certainty that my Kismet monos paired with the Candela (ordered from Klaus at the same time) are a match made in heaven, and my neighbors get spitting mad long before the amps break a sweat. 

I also ran both MMG's and 3.6R's with a 45wpc conrad-johnson CAV-50 years ago, and I remember playing it pretty loud without any signs of strain whatsoever.

Have you spoken with Klaus yet? I'm sure that he can get your issue with gain or current (or whatever it is) sorted out for you.