[Tyson]

Ok so that's actually not bad, you just need to use adhesion promoter prior to primer application. Something as simple as the UPol Grip4 aerosol HERE would work. One good coat and a 5-10 minute flash before applying primer and you're good to go. Since it is a poly (plastic) you'll need to use water based cleaners as well, not solvent based. Outside of that, and once you get a primer down, dealers choice on application preferences.

After I apply the UPol Grip4 aerosol, can I still use the Styx Primer and Ben Moore Advanced paint that KTS recommended above? 

[nlitworld]

Yes, it should be fine. The Grip4 is compatible with most water or solvent based products. Now I am curious though, since that is basically a plastic, is there a reason to prime and sand it for smoothing out rough finishes or is it smooth enough to actually apply color right over the Grip4?

[Tyson]

Yes, it should be fine. The Grip4 is compatible with most water or solvent based products. Now I am curious though, since that is basically a plastic, is there a reason to prime and sand it for smoothing out rough finishes or is it smooth enough to actually apply color right over the Grip4?

I guess we'll find out when it gets here! 

[nlitworld]

It appears the Stix primer sticks to a lot of surfaces (or so it claims) but the hard part could be around the driver mounting and if there is any manhandling during moving. Just existing inside a house and untouched should be fine for anything without the extra steps of serious sanding and adhesion promoter, but how it handles under physical stress is the key. That is what sets automotive paints apart from krylon. Feel free to test the Stix flying solo in a small corner and sand it the next day. If it does weird stuff like delamination or wrinkling, pick up adhesion promoter and go to town.

[jmimac351]

I'll just leave this here in case it's of interest... I'm going to try "topside paint" for boats... "roll & tip" method.  It's designed to be applied with roller / brush and is made to flow out smooth.

Prior to painting, raw MDF cut edges will be sealed with Starbond super glue and I'll seal the rest of the MDF with shellac or some other sealer.   

This finish looks good to me... and easy.

https://youtu.be/k-SGcSlNmoo?si=GEbBLPYQss3nFTCt

[Tyson]

It appears the Stix primer sticks to a lot of surfaces (or so it claims) but the hard part could be around the driver mounting and if there is any manhandling during moving. Just existing inside a house and untouched should be fine for anything without the extra steps of serious sanding and adhesion promoter, but how it handles under physical stress is the key. That is what sets automotive paints apart from krylon. Feel free to test the Stix flying solo in a small corner and sand it the next day. If it does weird stuff like delamination or wrinkling, pick up adhesion promoter and go to town.

One other question - on the composite part of the speakers, for the midrange and tweeters, I think all the holes for the drivers are pre-drilled.  How do I protect the pre-drilled holes from getting paint and primer going in the screw holes? 

I assume you don't want any paint/primer in the screw holes because it would just gum it up, right?

[js1955]

Maybe just fill the holes with some of this stuff?

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Loctite-Fun-Tak-Mounting-Putty-Pack-of-1-Blue-2-oz-Wallet/45106830?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=0&wl13=5087&gclsrc=aw.ds&adid=2222222227745106830_117755028669_12420145346&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=c&wl3=501107745824&wl4=pla-394283752452&wl5=9010122&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=8175035&wl11=local&wl12=45106830&veh=sem_LIA&gclsrc=aw.ds&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjwvvmzBhA2EiwAtHVrb-dz8sKARPD7EP3HRQYcImJEdyM6mt98aY01jHfeQlN4zYZU20rEOxoCqWAQAvD_BwE

[Peter J]

Tyson, if I were building a dream speaker I would consider epoxied inserts in every single hole. These coming from Jay? I don't know the tapping screw holding capability of the composite material, but MDF is not all that great. My other discovery is that the slot in Neo 3 (and maybe others) is close to the same size as the root of the tapping screws intended. This is a recipe for screw jacking where threads on screw engage tweeter frame and try to lift off surface rather than clamp to surface. Can/has it been done? Yes, but not very elegant IMHO. At the least I would open up the driver frame mounting slots a bit.

If you intend to fit everything up and then dissemble prior to paint you could just run expendable screws in mounting holes and paint right over them. Remove and replace when mounting drivers. If the pre-assembly is not the case then you could just run a drill to clean up pilots if need be.

I'm going to inject some info and questions concerning jmimac351 proposed paint schedule. Petit marine paint is typically high gloss polyurethane, often with UV inhibitors which control fading from exposure which speakers will rarely see. Rolling and tipping off can be done with the Ben Moore stuff to some extent because it was formulated to lay out like old school oil base paint. Also you have the choice of sheens.  Why cyanoacrylate glue as edge filler? Again, better products exist.

[Peter J]

I tried to photograph this to show texture and sheen but I'm afraid it just doesn't translate well compared to naked eye. It's satin Cabinet Coat which is really similar to the mentioned Ben Moore product. FWIW, I guess.

[jmimac351]

I'm going to inject some info and questions concerning jmimac351 proposed paint schedule. Petit marine paint is typically high gloss polyurethane, often with UV inhibitors which control fading from exposure which speakers will rarely see. Rolling and tipping off can be done with the Ben Moore stuff to some extent because it was formulated to lay out like old school oil base paint. Also you have the choice of sheens.  Why cyanoacrylate glue as edge filler? Again, better products exist.

Hi Peter, thank you for doing the NX-Studio assembly video.  It will be handy as I get started on those soon.

A friend who reads this forum has worked with MDF for a few decades.  He mentioned sealing the cut edges with CA glue, as it's easily done by hand and works.  He mentioned I can use MDF sealer epoxy or shellac as well.  Although the speakers won't see UV, I was primarily looking for something that would flow out well, and was designed to do it.  Unless it being UV resistant means it won't stick, flow out as well, or some other negative I'm unaware of - I view it as a benefit.  I figured if that paint will stick to fiberglass under water, it oughta stay stuck on a speaker.  I'm also considering Milk Paint / Cabinet paint, as others have used.  I figure the extra calcium in the milk paint will help with hardness / durability.

This was just my thinking on how to tackle this topic as a good recipe for Easy, Fast, Cheap... and Good.  The Quadfecta! 

Maybe it's a bad idea... and that's partly why I shared it.  I will know for sure when I test on some MDF pieces before putting on an actual speaker.

[Peter J]

Hi Peter, thank you for doing the NX-Studio assembly video.  It will be handy as I get started on those soon.

A friend who reads this forum has worked with MDF for a few decades.  He mentioned sealing the cut edges with CA glue, as it's easily done by hand and works.  He mentioned I can use MDF sealer epoxy or shellac as well.  Although the speakers won't see UV, I was primarily looking for something that would flow out well, and was designed to do it.  Unless it being UV resistant means it won't stick, flow out as well, or some other negative I'm unaware of - I view it as a benefit.  I figured if that paint will stick to fiberglass under water, it oughta stay stuck on a speaker.  I'm also considering Milk Paint / Cabinet paint, as others have used.  I figure the extra calcium in the milk paint will help with hardness / durability.

This was just my thinking on how to tackle this topic as a good recipe for Easy, Fast, Cheap... and Good.  The Quadfecta! 

Maybe it's a bad idea... and that's partly why I shared it.  I will know for sure when I test on some MDF pieces before putting on an actual speaker.

 Adhesion with oil-base products has more to do with surface prep than anything else. They rely on mechanical bond (tooth) rather than chemical bond like solvent finishes. UV inhibitors add cost but won't interfere with bond. CA is expensive if you figure by the ounce.  I would suggest sealing first with shellac, sanding sealer or epoxy, then fill edges with polyester glazing putty. Then prime/fill/sand repeatedly until surface is what you want then proceed with topcoat(s). I don't think Petit is going to cost any less than Advance or Cabinet Coat.  Practice on scraps is always a good idea.

 I really don't know the actual makeup of milk paint, but it seems to exist only in the hobbyist world. Because it's my background and a much bigger arena, I tend to rely on commercial stuff which addresses specific finishing situations. Sadly, much of it is hard to come by for the general public.

Perhaps you've given me an idea for video. There's a tremendous amount of lore surrounding speaker (and general woodworking) finishing. I've avoided in the past because my preferred techniques are somewhat obscure to the hobbyists that seem to make up a large percentage of my audience. If only I liked editing videos...

[Tyson]

Tyson, if I were building a dream speaker I would consider epoxied inserts in every single hole. These coming from Jay? I don't know the tapping screw holding capability of the composite material, but MDF is not all that great. My other discovery is that the slot in Neo 3 (and maybe others) is close to the same size as the root of the tapping screws intended. This is a recipe for screw jacking where threads on screw engage tweeter frame and try to lift off surface rather than clamp to surface. Can/has it been done? Yes, but not very elegant IMHO. At the least I would open up the driver frame mounting slots a bit.

If you intend to fit everything up and then dissemble prior to paint you could just run expendable screws in mounting holes and paint right over them. Remove and replace when mounting drivers. If the pre-assembly is not the case then you could just run a drill to clean up pilots if need be.

I'm definitely sticking with the Ben Moore paint outlined by KTS in his first post.  I am going for a boring paint job.  Mostly because I need the speakers to blend in to the room as much as possible.  In my space I don't have much floor space at all.  Not enough room for separate bass towers.  So I worked with Danny and Jay to modify the design of my speakers so that the subs could be oriented sideways and the main speaker modules mounted on top of the subs.  That means they will take up way less floor space.  But the trade off is that they will be TALL. 

So my plan is to blend them with the decor as much as possible via a satin finish and paint color that matches the rest of the room.  And the paint method from KTS should give me exactly this. 

And, using expendable screws to fill the holes while painting, that's a great idea, I will definitely do that. 

[KTS]

One other question - on the composite part of the speakers, for the midrange and tweeters, I think all the holes for the drivers are pre-drilled.  How do I protect the pre-drilled holes from getting paint and primer going in the screw holes? 

I assume you don't want any paint/primer in the screw holes because it would just gum it up, right?

Tyson,
I did not concern myself with getting primer or paint in it predrilled screw holes, I was more concerned with keeping them identifiable. You can always re-drill the holes if needed as long as you know where they are. Be sure to size the hole with a bit prior to starting the paint process, check the depth and use a piece of electrical tape to mark the depth on the bit, set it in a safe place just in case it’s needed later. As far as the primer, as the name implies it will stick to most anything, I have painted glass with it and had excellent results. The auto finishes are more durable, but I have used Advanced on many projects, cabinets, tables, chairs and trim, and as long as you perform the proper steps and let it cure you should get the results you are desiring (if I understand what you are looking for). Good luck and have fun.

[Tyson]

Thanks Kelly that helps a lot!  I’m feeling a lot more confident now.

One more question about the sanding prep.  Can I do it to each piece individually before assembly?  Seems it might be simpler because there’s less nooks and crannies.

[KTS]

I only sand the joints if needed to get a tight fit, first dry fit and clamp, address any joint issues, glue and clamp,  router the overhang/squeeze out once dry and flat sand. In the past when I sanded prior to glue up I caused more issues or did not impact the end results. Getting the joints seated well and clamped timely will be the challenge on such a large speaker IMO. If that is done well as you can the minor imperfections can be addressed during the finishing process. I also suggest you completely dry fit everything with clamps, clamping blocks and a good clamping sequence, you will see the areas in the joints that might need sanding during this process. It will also help to build confidence on the amount of time it will take, I would suggest two friends to help in both dry fit and glue up, due to the size of the speaker. My apologies if this is information that you already know, but just in case. Just don’t rush it!

I am sure some forum members that have built the larger speakers might have better or different suggestions, this is just the way I have approached the few builds I have done. I hope this answers your question. If you have watched Peters videos you’re good to go.

[Early B.]

Tyson!!!!  -- these are your dream speakers, so get them professionally finished.  I'm not insinuating you can't do it yourself, just sayin' you should spend your time more effectively on what you do best -- tricking out crossovers.   

[S Clark]

Tyson!!!!  -- these are your dream speakers, so get them professionally finished.  I'm not insinuating you can't do it yourself, you sayin' you should spend your time more effectively on what you do best -- tricking out crossovers.

Early said what I've been thinking. 
I'm sure you can do a good job with the finish... but pros are pros for a reason. 

[Tyson]

I hear you, guys.  And if I screw it up, I will definitely take it to a pro to fix. 

But, a big part of the fun of this hobby for me is doing it myself.  And I have actually built other speakers in the past - The Elsinore tower box speakers (with help), the GR Research V2's (with help), a pair of SEAS based bookshelves (by myself), the LGK 2.0's and the LGK 2.1's (both by myself) and a big 15" box sub for my dad from Parts Express (also by myself).  Normally I just slap on some Duratex and call it a day.  But this time I want to expand my skills and give HPLV painting a try. 

[Norman Tracy]

I hear you, guys.  And if I screw it up, I will definitely take it to a pro to fix.  ...But, a big part of the fun of this hobby for me is doing it myself. .....  Normally I just slap on some Duratex and call it a day.  But this time I want to expand my skills and give HPLV painting a try.

That's the spirit! 

[mlundy57]

I hear you, guys.  And if I screw it up, I will definitely take it to a pro to fix. 

But, a big part of the fun of this hobby for me is doing it myself.  And I have actually built other speakers in the past - The Elsinore tower box speakers (with help), the GR Research V2's (with help), a pair of SEAS based bookshelves (by myself), the LGK 2.0's and the LGK 2.1's (both by myself) and a big 15" box sub for my dad from Parts Express (also by myself).  Normally I just slap on some Duratex and call it a day.  But this time I want to expand my skills and give HPLV painting a try.

You might want to ask Jay if he has any bits and pieces available to practice on. He may not have but it's worth an ask. It's always a good idea to practice your finishing schedule on scrap pieces before the actual project.