Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.

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Mike D

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« on: 21 Apr 2005, 01:31 pm »
:o

I wasn't going to post this due to the crap that some of you will give me, but there may be a few people interested in this:

I have changed the audio out capacitors on my DVD player and my televisiion satelite receiver.  (no joke)   :roll:

Along with the audio outs on the DVD player, I also replaced the S-Video out capacitor.  

All caps used were Black Gates.  I just matched the uF rating and either met or exceded the voltage ratings depending on availability.  

The difference in sound quality on both units would make you sit up and laugh out loud!  The difference is THAT noticeable.   :lol: The bass is just what you would expect from a Black Gate cap, deeper and faster.  The first thing I noticed with both units was extended, faster treble.  After a few hours I started to notice depth and positioning within the soundstage.  This was really entertaining to have sound this good coming from a DVD player.  It was absolutely hillarious to have clean sound coming from a television satelite receiver.   :lol:  

For the video out sections, I was able to replace the S-video cap in my DVD player.  It was the only cap next to the S-Video output.  The difference in video quality was an immediate increase in white and red.  Later the black level became far more defined and I had to adjust the TV video settings.  I used to have the TV settings at higher levels of contrast and lower levels of bright.  This made up for the grain.  Now I have it set almost flat with the dvd player.  I just turn the brightness down (this turns up the black).  If you are new to the contrast and brightness controls actually controling the white and black levels, go rent one of the new Star Wars dvds.  The Lucas Film movies come with a video setup option that gives you all of the tools that are sold on dvd video setup discs for $25 to $50.
 
While I was at it, I changed the binding posts on one of my MGIIIA outboard crossovers to big gold fancy WBT binding posts from www.partsexpress.com.  I just changed one speaker because I wanted to see if this would do anything besides making it easier to hook up my speakers.  The result: slightly clearer sound out of the new binding posts than the old.  I had to drill the holes to 7/16 to make the new binding posts fit.  No complaints here since the posts were 50% off as a discontinued item.

One very cheap and fun experiment I did a month ago was to add a single film cap 1uF 100v from Radio Shack to the bass crossover cap on my MG12s.  This was an experiment to test the reports that a bypass cap fundamentally serves to speed response.  The bass was significantly faster which gave the illusion (or reality) of it being louder.  Another result of this ultra-cheap experiment was an increase in the perfect 5th harmonic.  

Next up:
power supply cap in the dvd player
power supply cap in the tv receiver
bypass caps in my preamp
bypass caps in the crossovers of my Klipsch RBS3 speakers
bass bypass caps added to the Black gate bass cap in my MGIIIA
The goal of all of this experimenting is to gain enough proficiency to tackle an old Radio Shack Optimis 4x100 watt receiver.  I'd like to replace every audio cap I can find in the Optimis and maybe hire someone to bridge the two B speaker channels to the A speaker channels.  How cool would it be if that 35 pound radio shack receiver from 1990 was converted to a mid-high-end piece of audio?    :lol:
Steve K will guide me through building all new internal crossovers for the IIIAs.  He, Alex B, and I will all have new internal crossovers for out IIIAs eventually.  Ideally, by the time we get around to doing my crossovers, I will know enough to do them myself.  
Once all of that is accomplished, I will apply Black Gate caps to the Bissel vacuum cleaner, the living room lamp, and the door bell.  If that goes well, I'll add copper foil in oil caps to the door hinges on the house to smooth out their response.

Again, I'm only posting this in case someone else is interested in getting into the fine art of cap swapping.  :-)  It is similar to tube swapping except they last longer and they're cheaper and you have to solder them in and you could get electricuted and things could blow up if you put them in backwards and you could destroy your equipment if you put in the wrong values and you can burn yourself with the soldering iron and you could ruin the circuit board by getting it too hot.  Other than that, its the exact same thing a tube swapping.  

But seriously, the difficulty is highly exaggerated.  Soldering is no big deal.  Logic plays the most important part.  If you heat the lead and the part to which the lead is to be connected, the solder will flow onto them both.  If the solder is shiny and you have heated both pieces completely, the connection should be okay.  If you hear the sound of record static, the solder connections need to be reheated.  I am a newby and by no means experienced at this soldering bidness.  These tips that I am passing on are tips given to me by champs like Scott F, Steve K, Sturgis, and G.  

Have fun!

Mike  :roll:  :wink: :lol:  :lol:  :cry:

DeadFish

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #1 on: 21 Apr 2005, 01:51 pm »
Good for you, Mike!

No crap dished out here; my hat is off to you for having the 'testicular fortitude' to go after better sound getting yer hands dirty!
At least it didn't all go up in a puff of smoke!! :wink:
Am definitely interested to hear more!

Regards,
DF

wavelength

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BG's are great anywhere
« Reply #2 on: 21 Apr 2005, 02:33 pm »
Mike,

I have used them in bio medical stuff and have sent them to people having trouble with dac's, adc's for some of the stupidest products. They work miracles. But then the accountants see how much they are :)

I just received last week 369 pounds of Black Gates ordered months before they re-signed on with Rubycon. AHHHHH

Thanks
Gordon

JoshK

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #3 on: 21 Apr 2005, 03:40 pm »
What series did you use, polarized or non-polarized?  The N series non-polarized caps seem like a really good match for where you used them.

Mike D

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #4 on: 21 Apr 2005, 04:10 pm »
I used the black and gold VK series for everything except for the video sections where I used the non polar red ones.  This was not by design.  It was just because the non polar caps were the only ones that matched the right values.  The way I chose the caps was kind of embarassing.  I just looked for the ones that matched the necessary values and looked for the  most expensive ones.   :oops:   I figured the more expensive ones would be better.  In one case, I chose the cap based on size due to case limitations of the DVD player.

JeffB

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Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #5 on: 21 Apr 2005, 04:33 pm »
Wavelength,
I don't understand this

"before they re-signed on with Rubycon"

Who is they?
Are you saying that Rubycon is now producing Black Gates?

Uptown Audio

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Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #6 on: 21 Apr 2005, 05:33 pm »
AFAIK, Rubycon has always produced the Black Gate capacitors. Black Gate is a brand name used for certain types of caps made by Rubycon. The associations may get even deeper. I don't know if Rubycon is related to Nichicon, but they are also a huge capacitor manufacturer.
-Bill

Bill Baker

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Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #7 on: 21 Apr 2005, 06:27 pm »
Quote
before they re-signed on with Rubycon


"Re-signed"???? I have not been following the Black Gate situation for a while. Are you saying they (Rubycon) will continue to manufacture the Black Gate capacitors? Or are they still being discontinued?

KT

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Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #8 on: 21 Apr 2005, 06:52 pm »
Apparently, Blackgates will continue to be produced:

http://www.audionote.co.uk/

(Click on the Blackgate announcement)

Good news for us!

KT

JoshK

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #9 on: 21 Apr 2005, 06:58 pm »
there was some talk on diyaudio about Rubycon discontinuing production of some of their line of blackgates but AFAIK they decided to continue producing, I think that is what he means by resigning.

Scott F.

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #10 on: 22 Apr 2005, 02:06 am »
Mike D,

Good to know that your tweaks worked so well. I've been debating on a new TV. Something that has a little better resolution and A LOT better color rendering. I think you've just made my mind up on rebuilding the one I've got. Maybe I'll dig into the power supply and start jacking with it, then load the chassis up with some serious caps. After that I'll kill whats left of my warranty on the DVD player that I bought from electricbear. All this after I get done with the HH Scott rebuild, the DRD's, tweaking my newfound CAL Sigma :lol: plus finishing up the Tube Design Sessions we've all been waiting for  :lol:



Gordon,

I see this was your first post. Welcome to AC and GAS in particular. You'll find that the GAS membership has an inordinately high percentage of SET amp users  :mrgreen:  Just a quick count there is Wille (45's, 300b's), Brad (2a3's and 300b's), G with EL34's (triode strapped), Mark (2a3's), Thom (2a3's) Deadfish (300b's) and me (2a3's and 300b's). I think that was everybody.
In fact, all but just a handful of guys (there are over 20 of us now) are using tubes in some configuration. Hmmmm, wonder what that means  :lol:

Mike D

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #11 on: 22 Apr 2005, 02:50 pm »
I spoke with a TV repair man at a small business in town, Box TV.  He said adjustments and tweaks on TVs are easy.  Here is the weird part: my TV is a 35" JVC that I bought for $500 in 1999.  It only has S-video.  The screen is slightly tilted or turned.  This is only noticeable when there are bars at the top and bottom of the screen.  The repair man suggested that I take the back cover off, turn on the TV, grab the center tube housing, and twist it bit by bit until the picture is centered.  That is a heck of a lot of voltage to be playing with!  

How well do electrician's gloves work for protection?

steve k

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #12 on: 22 Apr 2005, 04:12 pm »
Mike,
I think I'd have him do that for you.
steve k

Mike D

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #13 on: 22 Apr 2005, 07:46 pm »
That is what I told the repair man.  He told me that the cause of the angle was moving the TV.  Therefore, if he fixed it in the shop for me, there would be a good chance of the the angle getting knocked off again when I move the TV back into place.   :o

That is why I may opt to adjust the angle with the TV off, turn it on, check the angle, turn it off, readjust, turn it on, check it, off, adjust, on, check, off, adjust, on, check, etc.  That will take a while, but at least I will keep my testicles at normal body teperature.   :mrgreen:

DeadFish

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #14 on: 22 Apr 2005, 08:16 pm »
NONONO!

TeeVee is still deadly turned off, unplugged, inside.
Friend from computer club got first tv repairjob when former employee welded himself to former teevee.

I've been an electrician, and you know I can be a sap, but I won't go in there.

How about a book of matches under the corner of the teevee???

 :D

Regards,
DeadFish

Scott F.

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #15 on: 22 Apr 2005, 10:41 pm »
Quote from: Mike D
....How well do electrician's gloves work for protection?  ...


I want to say the pair that I have are good to 3000 volts (I think). These things are thick and go halfway up to your elbow.

There are a few Bulter Supply houses on the East side (Marion, OFallon, Effingham, etc.) where you can pick up a pair. Heres the link.

http://www.butlersupply.com

gary

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #16 on: 22 Apr 2005, 11:12 pm »
Well, my Clari-T and dac are going back for some upgrades, including black gates for both. We'll see what they do for performance.

Gary

lonewolfny42

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Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #17 on: 23 Apr 2005, 07:12 am »
Did you Gateway guys see this.... http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=18538 .....tube amps and speakers.

Scott F.

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #18 on: 23 Apr 2005, 12:07 pm »
Quote from: lonewolfny42
Did you Gateway guys see this.... http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=18538 .....tube amps and speakers.


Oh yeah....... I got wood  :D

sturgus

Black Gate capacitors going in strange places.
« Reply #19 on: 23 Apr 2005, 11:10 pm »
I got five onit  :mrgreen:
Sturgus