[dadix4e]

Hello.
I would like to listen to the music on Youtube through an external DAC NOS r-2r vintage type tda1543 or pcm56, etc. I want to use the laptop that only has a USB data output, it does not have s-pdif. But I saw that most of them, the cheapest ones, only have s-pdif or coaxial inputs and that they only read WAV. Maybe I didn't read enough or I didn't understand well, but I have the following question:
can I listen to music on YouTube with such a DAC? But if I buy a USB to S-pdif converter, will I be able to listen to music from YouTube through this type of DAC? The DAC will then have output via RCA to the amplifier.

[richidoo]

Welcome to AudioCircle!

A USB > SPDIF converter will send usable digital signal to your old R2R DAC.
Your PC can convert it to PCM (wav) to make it play on the old DAC.
Use a decent quality SPDIF cable, like Blue Jeans Cable, etc.

Normally I would caution you about high jitter coming from a low cost crystal oscillator in one of those amazon converters, because old DACs rely on the timing of the input, so they reveal high jitter digital signal source, but since you're playing compressed utoob audio the jitter is moot.    If you try lossless digital audio sometime, you might try a jitter filter like iFi Purifier2 to get the best sound from the DAC. 

There's a lot of great music on utoob, Enjoy!

[viggen]

https://www.amazon.com/Digital-Interface-Coaxial-Optical-Audio/dp/B08HN3VSF8/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=douk+ddc&qid=1673743540&sr=8-2&ufe=app_do%3Aamzn1.fos.18ed3cb5-28d5-4975-8bc7-93deae8f9840

[dadix4e]

@richidoo I still don't know what DAC to buy, I'm also thinking about something with pcm58, but I'm still getting information. In principle, I would like something up to 200 dollars. iFi Purifier2 is out of the question because I don't consider myself an audiophile. But thanks for the suggestion, I myself took it into account until recently and maybe in the future I will change my mind and buy the product at IFI.

@viggen the proposal is interesting. I'm looking carefully at this product, it's interesting for the price.

[richidoo]

R2R DAC integrated circuit chips were the first DACs, but are obsolete now. I dont know of any dac chips that work that way still in production.

Ironically, the highest of high end Dacs do use this architecture, but they make them with discreet parts, not IC.
Finding the old dac chips has become difficult but vintage dacs may still be availabke in used market.
I have a NEC Cd player that uses TD1543 DAC chips.

If you are on a budget, you might find that modern low priced DACs like Topping, Schitt, etc, sound pretty amazing with usb input jack, unless you have specific reason for non-oversampling DAC. When you buy used vintage gear you have to plan for repairs before you can use it, so it may end up costing you more than you expect.

[Bendingwave]

I use this and it sounds fine.

https://www.parts-express.com/Dayton-Audio-DAC01-USB-Audio-DAC-24-bit-96-kHz-RCA-Output-230-510?quantity=1

[dadix4e]

@richidoo It's a shame that the r-2r chips were abandoned. If their development had continued even at a snail's pace, today we would have more options to choose from at lower prices.
I am looking to make a system that sounds musical, not necessarily with HI-END resolution.
From what I have read, the R-2R NOS DACs are more musical and the Delta-Sigma DACs have more resolution.

@Bendingwave thanks for the suggestion but now I have this thing in my head with the NOS R-2R DACs.  . Now I use an old audio interface EMI EMAGIC 2|6 as a DAC .

[VinceT]

From what I have read, the R-2R NOS DACs are more musical and the Delta-Sigma DACs have more resolution.

There is a whole science based around this topic in itself. There really isn't a right or wrong answer. There is a thread in cheap and cheerful section here on AC with some cheap modern r2r dacs. I do agree some of the cheaper chip dacs can have digital glare but can be softened with a tube pre amp. Chip dacs are getting better with softening the sound with the advantage of higher bit rates. R2R dacs are also evolving. There are also dacs with a hybrid approach with digital processing and r2r architecture. I'd say if you are just streaming YT get an old Scitt Modi. If you want to listen to music there are a lot of options in the used market pretty cheap and you can test out different dacs and see for yourself what you like. It really depends on the rest of your system what type of dac works best.

[viggen]

ds chips are catching up.

give this a try:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B7LBCLM5?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details&th=1

refund if you don't like it.  no risk.

[WGH]

The Border Patrol DAC still uses the TDA 1543, there is one for sale here on AC
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=184479.0

I had a Scott Nixon Tube DAC that used the TDA 1543, looked around and nobody is selling one right now, it is a pretty good DAC if you can find one for $125. I wouldn't be surprised if someone here on AC has one in their closet, post a WTB in the For Sale: Source Components of the Trading Post.


In August 2020, Ted Smith, digital guru and designer of the PS Audio DACs, talked about the NOS Philips TDA 1543 chip. His comment reminded me of my first DAC, a Scott Nixon Tube DAC I bought used in 2006 that also used the Philips TDA 1543 chip. The Scott Nixon Tube DAC was a NOS design with no digital filter. The sound was pleasant but eventually I became bored because the music just laid there, there was no PRaT, and now I know why. The Van Alstine Insight I bought in 2008 was livelier but still rough around the edges compared to modern DACs.

6Moons has a review of the Scott Nixon Tube DAC
https://6moons.com/audioreviews/nixon/tubedac.html

Ted writes:

“It’s [Philips TDA 1543 DAC] a very simple chip. For people who want NOS or R-2R style DACs it’s great. Also most people don’t seem to read the datasheet, the chip requires an opamp to meet its specs (which aren’t great), but many simply use resistors on its outputs which adds a lot of 2nd harmonic distortion and restricts the dynamic range.

"If your favorite music doesn’t have a lot of high frequencies and it doesn’t get too loud, the chip works well.

"Without an output filter the timing and waveshape of impulses is lost and PRaT will suffer, but if the original recording is already rolled off this won’t be a problem.
I suspect most people that really enjoy orchestral or, say, grunge [or rock] would be disappointed, but jazz trios, women’s solo voice, etc. should sound fine.”


I bought the Scott Nixon Tube DAC in 2006, back then early CDs sounded raspy so a little roll off was a good thing. I would guess the dynamic range of youtube music is already limited so the TDA 1543 will do no more harm.

[viggen]

i had a nixon around the time i joined this forum.  still using a pic of that dac as my profile pic.

now i have a lab12 that uses i think 8 1543 chips.

[dadix4e]

@WGH thank you for the information.
Also Lite DAC-AH has 8 TDA-1543 .

@viggen It is not profitable to buy from the USA due to the transport and import taxes. The solution for me is the sites from Europe or China.

@VinceT I read about that DAC with PCM-56 in that forum. I keep thinking about buying it or opting for something that I will write a few lines below.

The PCM-58 DAC caught my attention. I found it as a decoder board with the parts glued but without a transformer. I have to learn what kind of transformer I need and how to glue the wires. And most importantly, how not to electrocute myself.

It seems to me that this DAC has some qualities that attract me compared to the TDA-1543. But nothing is set in stone, I may find other options.

[genjamon]

My first 1543 DAC was a DDDAC that used 8 chips in parallel to provide enough output current to avoid the need for an op-amp. Sounded really natural compared to my cheaper CD player at the time.

I currently still use a dB Audio Tranqulity SE, which is a 1543 DAC too. I don’t find it rolled off in the highs at all - get plenty of air. But I did audition the original Border Patrol DAC alongside it a few years ago and found it quite veiled and rolled off in comparison. Also tried a different 1543 DAC a long while back - might have been a Scott Nixon. And that one was veiled and rolled off too.

Point is, not all 1543 DACs sound the same. It completely depends on the implementation, as with any DAC chip, whether R2R or Delta-Sigma.

[dadix4e]

@genjamon have you tried other DACs? For example, I am thinking of this pcm58 or ad1865 chip (IC)

[genjamon]

I have owned a few other DACs for sure, most notably Lampizator, Schitt Modi Multibit, the Khadas Tone Board,  a cheaper Sabaj unit, and most recently the Black Ice Audio DAC. Have heard quite a few others at friends’ homes and even more at audio shows. Honestly, the Schitt Modi Multibit would be what I’d recommend given your desired sound signature, use case, and price point. You can probably find one used at a good price.

I’m not familiar with the ones you mention.

[Tam Lin]

I am thinking of this pcm58 or ad1865 chip (IC)

I like the AD1865. It's used in some $$$$ DACs, such as Audio Note and Aries Cerat.

[js1955]

R2R DAC integrated circuit chips were the first DACs, but are obsolete now. I dont know of any dac chips that work that way still in production.

A Google search returns this:

What brands of DACs are R2R?

There are plenty of R2R DAC manufacturers today, from affordable units like Audio-GD, MHDT Labs, Schiit Audio, Denafrips, Metrum, Border Patrol and Soekris, to mid-level devices like Holo Audio, CAD, LessLoss, TotalDAC, Lampizator, Mojo Audio and then to high-end units like Rockna, MSB Audio, Aries Cerat, Audio Note, ...Jul 13, 2021