[jandrews]

Hello
I'm considering a FW F7.  I have new Fritz Carbon 7 SE mk 2 speakers and using them with a Van Alstine SET 120 to great effect.
However, I'm curious about First Watt power amps and the F7 in particular.
Has anyone successfully worked with this combination?
Thank you
JS

[VinceT]

Congrats on the new Carbons

I have the Carreras, great speakers. I have run mine with both solid state and lower wattage tubes. They will do whatever you want them too.

I do not have experience with any of the pass amps with my Carreras. I will say it really depends on your listening tastes and criteria. With the tube amp at least with my Carrera's with sound stage was really nice but the sound was somewhat too soft. With my tastes I prefer more of the grip of SS. I would expect the class A pass amps to be somewhat similar to the tube amp. Fritz speakers with that series crossover design do really have an open sound. I know a lot of ppl like low wattage tubes or class A with his speakers. I prefer tube pre amp and solid state power combo, the tubes were too much of a good thing for me. But again I think it comes down to what you like and musical tastes. The speakers will give you huge air and stage with jazz and classical, or can hold it down with some rock, top 40, and funk and will adpot the character or whatever amplification you choose.

[JLM]

I a nice 7 wpc integrated hooked up to 90 dB/w/m, 8 ohm, 30-20,000 Hz loudspeakers, did a remarkably good job.  But replacing it with 40 watt mono-blocks turned the loudspeakers from polite dinner guests into NFL linebackers wearing tuxedos (much better dynamics and resolution).

[thetakeout]

@jandrews

Did you ever try the F7?

[WGH]

I have the Fritz Carbon 7 SE Mk2 speakers on a long term loan from Fritz and so far they have sounded excellent on every amp we have tried. The speakers are being passed around our Tucson Audiophile Group.

I tried them with my Van Alstine Vision SET 400, which will sound similar to the SET 120. The Carbon 7's sound is a little warmer than the Salk HT2-TL speakers but as expected the RAAL tweeter and SEAS W18 drivers have more detail and upper end extension. The Carbon 7's are the everyman's speaker, they are not as detailed and analytical as the Salks, and that's probably a good thing. Overall they are very, very good. The Carbon 7's disappear with a deep soundfield and benefit being set up close to a wall. The speakers have less bass than the Salk HT2-TL speakers but turn on the sub and they sound like $5000 speakers. The Carbon 7's are speakers you can listen too all day long without fatigue.

Next up was the 845 based Line Magnetic 218ia rated at 22 watts per channel. The Carbon 7's sounded great, they are easy to drive so there was no shortage of power.
Mick wrote: "Yes, these are superb. If I didn’t have 5 pairs of speakers right now, I would have bought them in a heartbeat. Just an excellent all-arounder that works with most any amplifier ….even a 300B SET would get the job done. Probably do their best work in small to medium sized rooms as we noted."

The Carbon 7's sounded the best in another custom low watt system paired with Rythmik subs. We still don't know why "L" didn't buy them, this was the best his stereo ever sounded.




Coming up - a Pass amp extravaganza. One of our members loves Pass Labs, in addition to the amps in the photo he has a XA25. Unfortunately no F7, the F5 would be the closest match.
I don't know when the Fritz/Pass pairing will happen, all this coordinating takes time and the holidays are fast approaching.

From what I have heard so far I expect the Carbon 7's to sound no less than excellent with the Pass amps.



Nelson Pass wrote:  “The F5 was noted for detail and neutrality, the result of simple Class A operation, wide bandwidth, and a generous amount of negative feedback. With some material and equipment, the sound was exquisite, but the amplifier also tended to highlight the faults of recordings and the rest of the system. A poorly engineered record, a second-rate DAC, or peaky loudspeakers and the amplifier was merciless.” His goals for the F7 were primarily better sound and an even simpler circuit. He says that simpler circuits tend to sound better, but since he builds these amps himself, he confides with a touch of humor that his motivation may have included cheapness and laziness. He envisioned a circuit with only four transistors and four resistors—the bare minimum for a push-pull amplifier.
https://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/first-watt-f7-stereo-power-amplifier/

The Fritz Carbon 7 SE Mk II are not peaky and the Audio Note ANK 5.1 Signature DAC is sublime so I'm looking forward to hearing the combo.
 

[planet10]

Nelson’s amplifiers are very good. I have a few. Not heard the F7.

The only limitation would be poser but that is unlikely to be an issue oin most domestic situations.

dave

[JLM]

From a brief audition of Fritz they do OK with low power but thrive on high power (more detail/dynamics).

Had 90 dB/w/m 28-20,000 Hz speakers with a 7 wpc class T amp, worked remarkably well.  But 40 watt amp provided better grip (imaging/detail/dynamics). 

[jandrews]

@thetakeout

No, I never moved on an F7.  It's still in my sights though.  I do feel that an XA25 is probably a better solution for my Fritz Carbon 7 SE mk2's....so I've also been keeping an eye out for one of those.  Also have been considered jumping into a DIY first watt build...perhaps the F5.

In the meantime, it's hard to believe that the results I'm getting from the Van Alstine amp could get any better, but I perhaps the Pass/First Watt would be a smoother, more refined presentation.

FYI in addition to Fritz running a sale on his Carrera's for $2800, down from $3600, he's also running a sale on his Carbon 6 speakers for $1750, down from $2500

Carrera Sale: https://www.usaudiomart.com/details/650036556-fritz-speakers-carrera-be-loudspeakers-on-sale-2800-a-pair/
Carbon 6 Sale: https://www.usaudiomart.com/details/650039507-fritz-carbon-6-1750-shipped/

[WGH]

I do feel that an XA25 is probably a better solution for my Fritz Carbon 7 SE mk2's....

In the meantime, it's hard to believe that the results I'm getting from the Van Alstine amp could get any better, but I perhaps the Pass/First Watt would be a smoother, more refined presentation.

The Pass XA25 sounded great with the Carbon 7s but so did the AVA SET 400 and every other amp we have tried so far. At this level of refinement there is very little difference between amps when used with the Carbon 7s, there may be differences but the Carbons didn't reveal any because they are not a hyper detailed speaker. Imaging, depth, smoothness with a lack of any stridency or sharpness was all excellent with the Pass XA25.

All the systems the Carbon 7s have been in have subwoofers so I can't comment on bass quality between amps. The Pass system has a REL G2 sub and integration with the Carbons (and Maggies) is seamless, the stereo sounds like a full range system down to 20Hz. A REL G2 sub will give you better sound than any new amp without a sub and there is a G2 for sale at US Audio Mart too. The G2 is so much better than the REL S/510 that there isn't even a comparison. The Pass buddy just bought my REL G2 after comparing it to his S/510 in his house, he'll be selling the S/510 soon at a great price.
https://www.usaudiomart.com/details/650000020-rel-gibralter-g2-piano-black-subwoofer/

The REL G2 is at the bottom left behind the Maggies.





Different rooms, different electronics, different wires make it impossible to make a definitive call between the AVA SET amps and the Pass, both are excellent. The Carrera's may reveal a difference between amps, I listened to them at Fritz's and they were more resolving with nice highs, closer to my Salk HT2-TL sound, but they also seemed to have tighter but less bass than the Carbon 7s.

Got a big room or plan to use the sub in a home theater then Upscale Audio still has the REL G1 MkII on sale for $4395 with full factory warranty and free shipping. That's what I did.
https://upscaleaudio.com/products/rel-g1-mk-ii-reference-subwoofer-piano-black