[Folsom]

jsaglia - Could you explain why you find the following statement absurd:

"2. Using the original tapes means absolutely nothing when it comes down to if there is a digital step in the process."

Had you done so, instead of insulting the poster, it may have alleviated some consternation.

 

He simply believes if you get a good product then it's ok.

But it's extremely misleading not only for the source but the process. The rest of everyone else does not believe because some music is recorded digitally so the source has to be digital for the vinyl, that it makes anything at all acceptable about paying a high premium for an album you believe to be completely and wholly only ever analog. If you don't think it makes a difference in sound that could be debatable but it doesn't change the mistrust - especially as more marketing comes out that never answers the questions.

But also there's a reason with all the old music I prefer earlier pressings... just saying, even if the digital tech were good it would appear to me most haven't a clue how to do it correctly. I almost only own new music on newer vinyl for a reason. Most of the new albums I have that are good music rarely come close to richness of old pressings (on pretty much all qualities).

[rbbert]

You know, someone lamented in a private message to me that he was saddened that a lot of folks who were very knowledgeable about vinyl have moved on from the Vinyl Circle and no longer post here...
--Jerome

There are any number of audio internet forums devoted primarily to LP playback and all things related.  I may be over-reaching and/or misinterpreting, but Audio Circle to me has always had a much broader scope, with perhaps more emphasis on the manufacturers' circles.

[rbbert]

...
But also there's a reason with all the old music I prefer earlier pressings... just saying, even if the digital tech were good it would appear to me most haven't a clue how to do it correctly. I almost only own new music on newer vinyl for a reason. Most of the new albums I have that are good music rarely come close to richness of old pressings (on pretty much all qualities).

I'm confused.  On the one hand you seem to be saying that most haven't a clue about how to use digital to produce good LPs, then you say you (almost) only own new music on new vinyl?  Why would you do that if most haven't a clue about how to do that?

[Bemopti123]

Unless a marked "damage" has been inflicted in terms of loss of value or use due to deliberate obfuscation of the "facts," I just don't see how MoFi will be held liable for their lack of "candor."  Although I have several hundred LPs, I don't own a single MoFi issued one, therefore all of this discussion might be too heated for my taste.  What a person considers "sounding" good, lots of time, has a lot to do with what he has gotten used to in terms of expected sound.  Maybe my ears are losing their capacity of hearing, but there are pressings that sound unbelievable and their lossless digital equivalents are just meh.  How can I explain this?  Is it the illusion that my vinyl rig extracts more nuance than the lossless file ?  Perhaps it has a lot to do with the cartridge, the way the coils were wound up, the cleanliness of the stylus, the cleanliness of the power line during that one moment or.... or perhaps the time of the day or whether I have had a nice cup of Rioja.  Who knows?  Perhaps I am not a hardcore vinyl person like others are, so be it.  Let those who have $ to spend, fight over the nuances of a vinyl reissue or a specific pressing.  All I say is that many companies, from record labels to audio gear makers are jumping in the bandwagon... due to the boom of vinyl.  I say it is time to rejoice since with this boom, perhaps a tiny sliver of these newly minted record connoisseurs will become the small stream of the now, slowly dying river of aging audiophiles.  It is good news indeed, I say!  These people will keep many manufacturers of your favorite gear alive!  Is there something negative about this?  I don't see but the upside. 

[Folsom]

I'm confused.  On the one hand you seem to be saying that most haven't a clue about how to use digital to produce good LPs, then you say you (almost) only own new music on new vinyl?  Why would you do that if most haven't a clue about how to do that?

The answer is pretty simply. I don't have a digital side even hooked up to any stereos (my car has a CD changer though). So when new music comes out I still buy the vinyl knowing it came from digital.

Clearly I don't own old music on new vinyl except in rare circumstances.

[S Clark]

Gustavo, I was looking at your system to see if you were spinning vinyl again, but it seems to be edited.  Come on back to the analogue side.   

[rbbert]

 There is more to analog than spinning (second rate) vinyl    

[S Clark]

There is more to analog than spinning (second rate) vinyl    

That's true.  But I haven't hooked up my reel to reel in years.  I see the Tascam listed in your gear.   
Do you find tapes easily?  If not, what do you use for sources?

[FullRangeMan]

Gustavo, I was looking at your system to see if you were spinning vinyl again, but it seems to be edited.  Come on back to the analogue side.   

Thanks Scott, I very much appreciate your friendship.

[S Clark]

Thanks Scott, I very much appreciate your friendship.

Your quite welcome.  Over the years, we do seem to get along pretty well, even when we disagree.  Best to you. 

[Digi-G]

That's not your call, as you're not the moderator here. 
Also, I find it curious that those without vinyl rigs are posting... unless hopefully that means they are considering returning to the Light from years spent wandering in the digital wilderness. 

I'm not sure why I would have to have a vinyl rig to post in this thread.  I buy plenty of MFSL releases, albeit the digital versions.  And I have opinions that need to be released onto the world.

I do have vinyl and bought plenty of the Mofi vinyl back in the day as well.  It's just not my preferred medium these days.  And I do find this whole situation with Mobile Fidelity fascinating.

[S Clark]

I have two vinyl rigs.  Am I allowed to post?     

Of course.  Anyone can.  Hopefully you have something to say about Mobile Fidelity Sound Labs.  That is what we're here to discuss, isn't it?

[S Clark]

Somewhat back to topic:  Is the MFSL one step basically what Teldec has done for decades with their Direct Metal Master (DMM) process?

[S Clark]

Looking at my MFSL 1-375"Sketches of Spain".  The top banner on the cover says "ORIGINAL MASTER RECORDING"
In the fine print on the back bottom "Mastered from original master tapes"  This is a 2013 pressing.  Any idea how far back the questionable pressings go back? 

[jsaliga]

Any idea how far back the questionable pressings go back?

2015 if I am not mistaken.

--Jerome

[Saturn94]

Just saw this on another forum

https://roon-community-uploads.s3.amazonaws.com/original/3X/7/2/726bb4f77704adac323918ee489bc823e348e2b2.jpeg

[rbbert]

That's true.  But I haven't hooked up my reel to reel in years.  I see the Tascam listed in your gear.   
Do you find tapes easily?  If not, what do you use for sources?

My main deck is now a hot-rodded Technics 1506 with the last 2-track FM head made and a custom tape head repro amp.  There are quite a few gray market sources for tapes (in addition to all the "official" sources listed in the recent The Absolute Sound tape issue), most of which use safety and/or copy masters as the source tape.  Over the last 40+ years many of those have left record company vaults, most legitimately (to pressing plants in other countries, to other recording engineers' studios, etc), a few more surreptitiously.  A good thing, too, as the very destructive Universal fire a few years ago showed.  With enough searching most albums that were originally recorded to analog tape can be found, and there are now a few more studios recording selected current artists to R2R.

But this is the Vinyl Circle, so I will leave

[S Clark]

Somewhat back to topic:  Is the MFSL one step basically what Teldec has done for decades with their Direct Metal Master (DMM) process?

To answer my own question for anyone who cares, it looks like the MFSL "one step" is simply a DMM.  I bought quite a few French Blue Notes DMM's because I liked the sound and collectors turned up their noses at them. 
I guess MFSL gave it a new name and pushed it as something new.  The technology actually grew out of laser disc from the 70's.   

[newzooreview]

In their reply on Instagram, MOFI begins:

"We at Mobile Fidelity Sound Lab are aware of customer complaints regarding use of digital technology in our mastering chain."

This is only half the story. The more important half is that they intentionally misled customers regarding the use of digital files in creating analogue recordings (e.g., expensive LPs). When they switched to digital, they hid the information from customers. If you pay for a banana and get an orange, it doesn't matter how tasty the orange is. You were deceived.

The biggest complaint is that people were lied to.

"We apologize for using vague language, "

The language was not vague, unless someone is, perhaps, a lawyer working for MOFI. Then, of course, all language is vague and they can blame their customers for misunderstanding things.

"allowing false narratives to propagate, "

They propagated the false narrative; it didn't just spring up out of the vacuum of space, or appear in the sky through a wormhole.

"and for taking for granted the goodwill and trust our customers place in the Mobile Fidelity Sound Lab brand."

This can be fixed: "…and for taking for granted exploiting the goodwill and trust of our customers."

[Tom Bombadil]

Any idea how far back the questionable pressings go back?

From the Washington Post

"By the end of 2011, 60 percent of its vinyl releases incorporated DSD. All but one of the reissues as part of its One-Step series, which include $125 box set editions of Santana, Carole King and the Eagles, have used that technology. Going forward, all MoFi cutting will incorporate DSD."