[John Casler]

As a small continuation in my Adventures in High Performance Listening, I have "once again" been playing with my LARGER subwoofers.

Now, I recently sold my preamp so I am running my new CD Player (ONIX CD-1) "straight" into my NHT X-2 crossover and then to my Main (Son of Ampzilla) and my CineNova Bass amp.

If you haven't been following my Quad (four LARGER SUB) Bass adventures, a quick update is that I have a pair of LARGERS in the front that act as stands for a pair of 626Rs.

Then the other pair of subs is in the rear and wired "anti-phase" to the front pair.

The idea is to have the front woofer cones "pushing" while whilst the rears are "pulling".  Theoretically this will cause the air at the listening room to be acted upon "in concert" by both systems and create the greatest movement of air possible at the listening position.

It would also seem to cause a differing set of modes and nodes, again "theoretically".

This has been working exceptionally well for clean, deep, detailed and tight bass.  It also has a surrounding envelopment that is quite good and it adds a very nice 3-D depth to the room and stage which otherwise is quite damped.

On a whim, I decided to lay the "rear" pair of subs "on their back" firing up.  The idea was just an experiment to slightly lengthen the path of the rear bass and to "maybe" load the ceiling path a little more (my poor upstairs neighbors )

The preliminary results are quite good with a seemingly "even lower" response and envelopment, without any degradation to detail.

If anything the 3-D depth improved slightly and one very strange thing happened  

Mid and HF 3-D depth has improved even further      

After additional listening and eventual measurments, I will report further, but after a quick run through of a "portion" of all my reference cuts, I have to say, this is a very nice sonic presentation.

Now remember that room dimensions and bass paths will differ from room to room, but for any who are adventerous, this "QuadBass LARGER LIBRA SubSystem has given me the best overall bass I have ever heard in "ANY" system or any room.

As soon as the New Preamp arrives, I will be able to also implement the R-DES equalization system and report on its abililties.

[zybar]

Anybody get to hear John's setup yet?

Love to hear some thoughts...

George

[John Casler]

Anybody get to hear John's setup yet?

Love to hear some thoughts...

George

Hey George,

You have to be coming to LA sometime?  Bring your ears.  Love to have you come by and catch a few cuts.

Maybe by that time, I'll have the new secret project I've been pushing B on.

I call it the RM40 "Stealth".  If I get everything I want in it, it will be something pretty special.

[warnerwh]

You know I've wondered why not just put a sidefiring 12" and two 10" passives in the RM 40.  Add another midrange panel and we'd have an RM 50 which would fit well between the RM 40 and RMx.

[John Casler]

While on the subject of "Better Bass", I thought it might be relevant to point out something that many don't know.

If you want better bass, with fewer modes and nodes, just open all your doors and windows.

It is certainly not a "cure all" by any means, but, most modes and nodes are caused by "speaker released" bass energy that you have already heard (directly from the speaker) traveling past you to a room boundary(s) and being launched back into your "clean" direct wave and damaging it by adding or subtracting its energy to or from it.

When it is added, it creates a spike (mode) and when it "fights it", by applying its energy against it, it creates a dip (node) (At least I hope that is correct)

If that energy encounters an open window or door, it cannot be reflected back into the room by the amount of pressure lost out the opening.

So as long as you don't have any sensitive neighbors, open up the place and let the "bad bass energy" out.

I have known this for quite some time, but noticed it today while "working out" on my patio and I had the music on, and all the doors and windows open.

And even though I had the system on rather low, when I walked into Music room #1, the bass was very clean, deep, and textured.

[ScottMayo]

While on the subject of "Better Bass", I thought it might be relevant to point out something that many don't know.

If you want better bass, with fewer modes and nodes, just open all your doors and windows.

This can work. It can also make all sorts of mess. If the doors and windows are in places where they contribute to reflections at the listener's seat, opening them replaces harsh, vibrating glass with a convenient duct. If the windows and doors aren't where direct reflections occur, what you get is a complicated, possibly subtle change that mostly just sucks volume out of your room - causing you to turn the volume up - which can add detail but also can exaggerate existing frequency problems.

There's also the question of what your neighbors will say, with bass oozing out every window.

One good plan is probably to have cloth curtains hanging over glass windows. Glass windows have nasty acoustic properties and big ones can muddy the heck out of everything. Even better is no windows at all, but I found out to my pain that building codes have something to say about minimum window sizes for a room. I'm literally going to have sheetrock "plates" over my windows on Movie and Music nights. Sheetrock isn't quite as nasty as glass, at least to my ears, and it's easier to treat.

[John Casler]

This can work. It can also make all sorts of mess. If the doors and windows are in places where they contribute to reflections at the listener's seat, opening them replaces harsh, vibrating glass with a convenient duct. If the windows and doors aren't where direct reflections occur, what you get is a complicated, possibly subtle change that mostly just sucks volume out of your room - causing you to turn the volume up - which can add detail but also can exaggerate existing frequency problems.

Hi Scott,

While I should have stated such, I always strive to reduce "ALL" room interactions.  Reflected sound reinforcing the total SPL is not helpful to the "pure sonic" so I advocate reducing it to its minimum.

This is more important (IMHO) for 2 channel than HT.

There's also the question of what your neighbors will say, with bass oozing out every window.

Generally mine say "can I come over and hear your system sometime?"  

One good plan is probably to have cloth curtains hanging over glass windows. Glass windows have nasty acoustic properties and big ones can muddy the heck out of everything. Even better is no windows at all, but I found out to my pain that building codes have something to say about minimum window sizes for a room. I'm literally going to have sheetrock "plates" over my windows on Movie and Music nights. Sheetrock isn't quite as nasty as glass, at least to my ears, and it's easier to treat.

Good thick "soft surface" with more rigid backing curtains are a great idea.  And the bigger the better.  Floor to ceiling Oh yeah!  Oversized, you gottit!

And for the "open window" times, the curtains also reduce the amount of "outdoor noise" that comes back into your room (especially if you live close to a busy street)

Hope all is well and those RM/x's are breaking in.  Will we see pics soon?

[ScottMayo]

Hope all is well and those RM/x's are breaking in.  Will we see pics soon?

Right now, the room they are going into is being mudded and sanded. Then there's the ceiling (suspended, with soffits and sound absorption/diffusion built in. My contractor won't even estimate when he'll be done; he's never done a suspended ceiling before). Then there's painting, and area remnant carpeting, because I'm too tapped out to install the bamboo floor I'd planned. THEN I get to put the speakers in, and start the treatments. *mutter*

So, no photos yet. If Brian saw where they are at the moment - under a low, uneven ceiling, against a wall in a highly irregular space and about 3' from the "listening position" with a TV smacked between them - he'd be in tears. It's about as bad as it can be. It's amazing I'm getting the imaging I'm getting.

But when it's all installed, positioned, and dialed in, yes there will be photos. And invites. Oh yes. Yes, my precious, yes...