Need help with 6SN7 tubes for Don Sachs Pre

morganc · « **on:** 2 Jan 2022, 05:40 am »

Hey guys and gals, Happy New Year,
I need help. I am replacing tubes in my pre and want to ask for anyone with experience with 6SN7 NOS or modern models, please chime in. I loved the RCA 5692 in a prior amp and have found a pair that I’m ordering. Also want to get a few others. I love deep rich tone, and well defined bass. I’m ok with a bit less on the top end as I have very revealing Spatial X-3’s which are very neutral and I’m running a SS amp and love a smidgen or two of warmth!

rotarius · « **Reply #1 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 05:50 am »

Sylvania GTA chrome domes, brown base WGT. Ken-Rad black glass. GE GTA. Soviet Melz or foton factory ones from 50s to early 60s. CBS/Hytron GT. These are all very nice, start with the chrome domes.

Tyson · « **Reply #2 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 05:58 am »

For NOS tubes I like the old Tung Sols. For new production I like the Psvane Tii (grey glass) tubes.

morganc · « **Reply #3 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 05:59 am »

How do I find the Sylvania Chrome domes? I have a guy I’m ordering from who has a big box of Sylvania with several types. Including Sylvania GT, GT code 252 and GTA. Any idea or can I just telll from a photo. Thanks for the newbie Q but just want to make sure I get the right ones.

morganc · « **Reply #4 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 06:00 am »

Quote from: Tyson on 2 Jan 2022, 05:58 am

For NOS tubes I like the old Tung Sols. For new production I like the Psvane Tii (grey glass) tubes.

Where do you get the Psvane Tyson? I see several models on line and wasn’t sure which ones were legit.

Thanks,
Morgan

Tyson · « **Reply #5 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 06:04 am »

I got mine from ebay, I've had good luck with this seller:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/223512118392

genjamon · « **Reply #6 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 04:35 pm »

Just a warning, the Psvane grey bottles are on the more neutral and less warm end of the 6sn7 spectrum. That said, they can be a good match with warmer tubes in the Sachs if you mix/match. I use Psvane grey bottles in position one, and Sylvania brown base chrome top WGTA in the second position on my Sachs currently, and it sounds pretty good. Good clarity and dynamics with the Psvane in the primary, with a nice dose of tone/burnish on the notes from the Sylvania. Reversing the order with Sylvania first and Psvane second doesn’t sound nearly as good to me. Muted sound. And a quad of Sylvania is too warm too.

I started my Sachs experience with a quad of Shuguang Treasure black bottles, which were ideal to my ears (warmer than the Psvane, but just as detailed). The Psvane/Sylvania sound gets close to that, but not sure how close since it’s been too long and too many changes to say for sure.

YMMV, but a takeaway is to not be afraid to mix/match sets in the Sachs.

rotarius · « **Reply #7 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 04:42 pm »

Chrome domes are readily available on Ebay and a few tube dealers. The earlier GT have a lot more getter flashing with T-plates facing one another and they are superb too.

morganc · « **Reply #8 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 04:55 pm »

Quote from: genjamon on 2 Jan 2022, 04:35 pm

Just a warning, the Psvane grey bottles are on the more neutral and less warm end of the 6sn7 spectrum. That said, they can be a good match with warmer tubes in the Sachs if you mix/match. I use Psvane grey bottles in position one, and Sylvania brown base chrome top WGTA in the second position on my Sachs currently, and it sounds pretty good. Good clarity and dynamics with the Psvane in the primary, with a nice dose of tone/burnish on the notes from the Sylvania. Reversing the order with Sylvania first and Psvane second doesn’t sound nearly as good to me. Muted sound. And a quad of Sylvania is too warm too.

I started my Sachs experience with a quad of Shuguang Treasure black bottles, which were ideal to my ears (warmer than the Psvane, but just as detailed). The Psvane/Sylvania sound gets close to that, but not sure how close since it’s been too long and too many changes to say for sure.

YMMV, but a takeaway is to not be afraid to mix/match sets in the Sachs.

Thanks Genjamln. Is position one that you’re referring to on the right or left when facing the front of the Pre?

At this moment I have two of the WE6SN7 plus in the right sided position.

borism · « **Reply #9 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 05:21 pm »

In my Atma-Sphere MP3 I really like the NOS Ken-Rad VT231. They have great, strong bass and a nice, smooth top end/midrange.

morganc · « **Reply #10 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 05:27 pm »

Quote from: borism on 2 Jan 2022, 05:21 pm

In my Atma-Sphere MP3 I really like the NOS Ken-Rad VT231. They have great, strong bass and a nice, smooth top end/midrange.

Thanks for the reminder. I loved the Ken Rads in the past in the 845 amp that I had.

genjamon · « **Reply #11 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 06:09 pm »

First position is on the left side, second position on the right, closer to the rectifier.

genjamon · « **Reply #12 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 06:15 pm »

I also second Ken Rad VT231 as my favorite 6sn7 when I used to own the Dude preamp - was both the most relaxed and pleasing warmth combined with most expansive soundstage, and didn’t lose out on detail compared with comparatively brighter 6sn7’s. Worth a try if you have them.

Unfortunately, I included my stock of various 6sn7’s when I sold the Dude, so can’t compare how they perform in the Sachs circuit.

borism · « **Reply #13 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 06:54 pm »

Many of the NOS 6SN7 have unfortunately become unaffordable. Another favorite if one can find them is the Brimar CV1988.

RPM123 · « **Reply #14 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 07:34 pm »

Russian Melz 6H8C (1578) tubes are also a good substitute. They have the "rich tone and defined base" you are seeking, but they can also be quite pricey.

Tyson · « **Reply #15 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 09:42 pm »

I should probably shut up about this and not let the cat out of the bag, but.... if you want a really great 6SN7 tube for cheap, get a NOS 7N7 tube and buy an adapter to fit it to a 6SN7 slot. Really great tubes that are electrically equivalent to the 6SN7.

Bob Stark · « **Reply #16 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 09:51 pm »

Hey Morgan,

Contact Andy's Vintage Tubes in Michigan. I'm the one that bought Genjamon's TRL DUDE. Andy recommended the RCA tubes I replaced all 5 of the tubes that were in the Dude as sent me. It was a very significant upgrade in sound over what I first heard as bought. There were a couple 6SN7's. and 3 other tubes that got replace at the same time. All 5 NOS tubes, 2 were matching, and that was basically a much different sounding DUDE and I now heard what all the fuss about it's sound was about. Much bigger improvement than going replacing 6 standard fuses with all Synergistic Research Blue (1) and Orange (5) fuses all at one time. The 5 NOS RCA tubes from Andy's cost me about $247 total. Sophia Electric 6SN7 tubes are new and sound very live and detailed without any hardness. I use them in my Modwright Sony 5400 Signature Truth CD player.

Bob

morganc · « **Reply #17 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 09:59 pm »

Great thread guys. Appreciate all your feedback!

Tyson: I'll check em out! Sounds like just what I needed as I hate turning my pre on and off and also feel guilty about leaving my tubes on 18 hours a day when they are so costly and some irreplaceable.

Bob: are those the RCA 5692? I loved those in the past as well.

genjamon · « **Reply #18 on:** 2 Jan 2022, 10:21 pm »

I don’t doubt a new set of tubes could have helped, Bob. The tubes that were sent had been in use 24/7 for several years at that point, and they were not brand new when I bought them. And I never experimented much with the three power supply tubes. But as I recall, you also had your shop tech do some work on the circuitry, so are you sure how much of the improvement was from tubes and how much was from the shop work?

Anyway, good to hear you like the RCA.

mcmusicman · « **Reply #19 on:** 3 Jan 2022, 08:48 pm »

+2 for the Melz 1578
I also very much enjoyed the Ken Rad VT231 NOS